Forum whore
This top plate on a deck balustrade disintegrated when I exhaled on it (no visible sign of damage other than a hairline crack between the capping and the wall)Originally Posted by dangerous
This shows the difference between untreated timber and treated timber when it gets wet. Yup! that's a cantilevered deck sitting on that rotting mush. Again, no visible indication of damage prior to removing the cladding to check it out.
Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Forum whore
thats harditex yea?? where did the water get in, around the joists??
GOOD ROADS, NUTHIN 2 RIDE
Go for it the flying crock has got the ball rolling
"Your talent determines what you can do. Your motivation determines how much you are willing to do. Your attitude determines how well you do it."
-Lou Holtz
Forum whore
Yes, mostly at the un-flashed joist penetrations and also a little moisture entry through defects in the horizontal band and the h flashing/jointer behind it (which is in line with the bottom of the joists). Also a little contribution from an un-flashed door sill above the deck.
Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Una Storia Italiana
and I find through hairline cracks common at the edges of plastic mouldings/flashings as the plaster is so thin, its amazing how so much water can get through a crack so fine.
cheers DD
(Definately Dodgy)
Forum whore
funny how water will piss through a fine crack but a leaf will block a drain hole
Forum whore
Yes. Part of that "funny" is about air pressure equalisation between the interior and exterior. Surface water pasing over small gaps in an otherwise sealed cladding system (monolitic) will get sucked in through those small gaps by air as it passes through those same gaps while pressure is equalising. This can occur in hundreds of cycles during any given day (as wind pressure fluctualtes while it is raining). Which is why air seals were introduced at high risk junctions (like window & door joinery) where the junction spans between exterior and interior wall linings.
Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Forum whore
Clearly the fault of the Harditex lol.................not
Ive run out of fucks to give
Forum whore
The expansion and contraction rates of HT exceeds the capacity of the jointing system and sealant details (mandated by JH) to absorbe the movement without cracking. No doubt (in your biased opinion) that is the fault of the builder who installs it as well.
Clearly NZ builders should have known exactly what sort of a shit product JH were inflicting on the NZ market under the guise of New generation low maintenance cladding systems.
Of course the fact that JH pulled it off the market (would no doubt in your biased opinion) be soley as a result of the inability of builders to correctly install such a (cough) fine product, rather than any failure of the product.
Quite obviously the manufacturer shouldn't be expected to be accountable for knowing just how shit their product was untill it failed so badly that everyone stopped buying it and they had to remove it from the market. It must have been the builders fault.
That'd be why JH write all those big cheques at confidential settlements. That and so that the increasingly rare dickheads who defend the product can stand tall and talk crap with impunity.
Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Forum whore
lol so the builder didnt put in the rtequired control and expansion joints then ?The expansion and contraction rates of HT exceeds the capacity of the jointing system and sealant details (mandated by JH) to absorbe the movement without cracking. No doubt (in your biased opinion) that is the fault of the builder who installs it as well
Clearly NZ builders should have known exactly what sort of a shit product JH were inflicting on the NZ market under the guise of New generation low maintenance cladding systems.
Of course the fact that JH pulled it off the market (would no doubt in your biased opinion) be soley as a result of the inability of builders to correctly install such a (cough) fine product, rather than any failure of the product.
Quite obviously the manufacturer shouldn't be expected to be accountable for knowing just how shit their product was untill it failed so badly that everyone stopped buying it and they had to remove it from the market. It must have been the builders fault.
That'd be why JH write all those big cheques at confidential settlements. That and so that the increasingly rare dickheads who defend the product can stand tall and talk crap with impunity.
case closed, it was the stupid builder..................again
Product works fine until you get monkies using it.
Why did the builder use untreated timber? cant have been a very good builder it would be 101 building knowledge that untreated pine would rot
why where the flashings etc so poor ? builder Im picking didnt do it properly or manage his contract properly, or is the fault of the flashing supplier ?
Builders are to blame period, they are "the professional" and should have the knowledge and skills to construct a building using good quality products correctly, if he cant do either then he is solely to blame.
Ive run out of fucks to give
Forum whore
They didnt, they replaced it with Monotek which is a system as builders where to stupid to build anything with intelligence i.e with flashings (as per instructions), so a simple system had to be developed for the morons.
Ive run out of fucks to give
Forum whore
You really are full of it today aren't you.
No control/expansion joints were required in relation to these defects.
Case closed, stupid product sales rep thought he had a clue.
The mandatory requirement for chemical timber treatment was removed in favour of kiln drying by the Govt of the time at the insistence of the Green movement (& Party) and after considerable lobbying by Carters, Pinex, Winstones & even James Hardies in support of non chemical treated kiln dried framing. Tight fisted and environmentally friendly owner builders, developers, designers and home buyers drove the actual decisions to use it.
Though James Hardies took that freedom of choice away for the fools who elected to use their crappy Harditex cladding, as it was a mandatory system requirement for use of KD (kiln dried) framing for boundary joists and chemical treated KD was generally only run to order so wasn't readily available) Of course as a technical rep for Hardies you wouldn't have a fucking clue about minor technical details such as that or you wouldn't have planted your feet so firmly in your mouth by asking such a dumb arse question while berating others for their lack of technical knowledge eh!
What flashings? The James Hardies monolithic cladding SYSTEM technical instructions and data sheets didn't show any such requirements for the balustrade junctions (along with many other junctions) and the standards of the day weren't intended to convey or cater for the requirements for Alternative solution monolithic cladding SYSTEMS introduced by the likes of Hardies. It was over to the manufacturer/distributor to take responsibility (by way of detailing) for the theoretical compliance of the products with the requirements of the NZBC. JH failed to provide technical details showing how compliance could be achieved by their specialised product in over half of the out of the ordinary applications that they advertised the product as being able to do. So they are even less blameless than the monkeys who did follow their instructions, (as in the failed SYSTEM PVC 'h' flashing pictured at the base of the joists) which failed to prevent moisture ingress in other areas which were isolated from other contributing junctions
They replaced it with a more stable product (which is still prone to delamination) as they came to realise that their crappy harditex product was expanding and contracting at rates which exceeded the capacity of the jointing system and sealant details (mandated by JH) to absorb the movement without cracking and therefore failing to meet the 15 year minimum life expectancy for a cladding system.
I.e product failure. Much like your postings in this thread.
You aren't going to waste any more of my time as you have clearly demonstrated a proclivity to spout off complete bullshit in support of a factually baseless bias toward attributing blame for a systemic failure on only one of many of the responsible industry sectors while in complete denial of patently obvious truths. So you may as well STFU
Political correctness: a doctrine which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Una Storia Italiana
only required after a certain length of wall has been reached. Maybe JH should re look at their requirments?
hey...
HEY... dident we have words over this generlising
WHY... should he? untreated is perficly adiquit, ever a poor builder knows that.
depending on the situation, HOWEVER the builder just does as the CONCENTED plan tells him to.
NOW... ya getting my farking goat up man... honestly ya full of shit on this one aye, why? easy If the builder has built to the concenting plan as have his subbies then he has done his job well, we CAN NOT ulter the plan to suit ourselves, we do as we are told, right or wrong, simple as that.
Just to add however, yes a builder like any of his subbies should they do a sub standard job YES they are to blame and it does happen, but only a small part of the problem.
Now fark off and sell some leathers...
cheers DD
(Definately Dodgy)
Una Storia Italiana
... OK
The following photos are from a 10 year old block of 4 units in Whitleigh ave just down from tower jnt.
The extent of the timbers damage was bearly noticable inside and out side, you have to know what to look out for.
NOTE: THE BUILDING WAS CONSTRUCTED CORRECT AND TO REGULATIONS OF THE COUNCIL AND SUPLYERS OF MATERIALS USED (including James Hardie's fixing methods)
cheers DD
(Definately Dodgy)
Una Storia Italiana
These photos show new building methods now used like PEF rod, expanding foam, cavity, breathing type building wrap, saddle flashings and cill tape.
cheers DD
(Definately Dodgy)
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