Autism awareness month

[Banditbandit]

I'm not so sure about the treatment ... There's strong threads of both ADHD and Aspergers in my famly - with many mixes and variants ...

What I see is that the family members who were diagnosed and "treated" are worse off than the ones who were diagnosed and not treated ...

I have two nephews .. one diagnosed ADHD/Aspergers ... he's a bloody mess because his parents treated him differently .. don't believe he can function by himself, and consequently don't let him .. don't let him out of their sight .. don't let him do anything (he's 21 years old ...) he's been treated differently all his life ... it has not been good for him ...

And another nephew (different parents) is is clearly on the autistic spectrum .. has had tests done .. but has never been told what the results of the tests were ... and is doing extremely well - if a little dreamy and odd at times ...

Sure, one of my sisters and her husband have done pretty badly by their son ... the other sister and her husband have been pretty good ... but this is just one example I've seen of "treated" Aspergers people being worse than none treated ... I had to deal with an Aspergers student who used to play up al the time ... her standard response "It's not my fault - you can't blame me, I'm Aspergers" .. my internal response (never vocalized) was "Yeah Right ..." that was the ultimate cop-out of personal responsibility ...

I have seen some great results from treating ASD people ... but equally I have seen some big fuck ups ... so I'm in two minds about treatment ..

[Edbear]

I'm not so sure about the treatment ... There's strong threads of both ADHD and Aspergers in my famly - with many mixes and variants ...

What I see is that the ones who were diagnosed and "treated" are worse off than the ones who were dagnosed and not treated ...

I have two nephews .. one diagnosed ADHD/Aspergers ... he's a bloody mess because his parents treated him differently .. don't believe he can function by himself, and consequently don't let him .. don't let him out of their sight .. don't let him do anything (he's 21 years old ...) he's been treated differently all his life ... it has not been good for him ...

And another nephew (different parents) is is clearly on the autistic spectrum .. has had tests done .. but has never been told what the ressits of the tests were ... and is doing extremely well - if a little dreamy and odd at times ...

Sure, one of my sisters and her husband have done pretty badly by their son ... the other sister and her husband have been pretty good ... but this is just one example I've seen of "treated" Aspergers people being worse than none treated .. I had to deal with an Aspergers student who used to play up al the time ... her standard response "It's not my fault - you can't blame me, I'm Aspergers" .. my internal response (never vocalized) was "Yeah Right ..." but that was the ultimate cop-out of personal responsibility ...

Therein probably lies the problem. One box don't fit all and not enough time is invested in studying the individual to find their strengths and weaknesses, what works and what doesn't in their case.

I agree, too, that the fact that too many parents find excuses for their children, meaning the child gets to cop out. This is general, not just in medical situations either!

[F5 Dave]

Guess that depends what is meant by 'treating'. Treating someone to become independent or as much as possible, or treating people to become dependant, whether it is a parental prompt dependency or over dependence on a pattern which may lead to inflexibility, there is no doubt extremes to avoid. Certainly people aren't born as experts & understanding someone else that is wired differently is not an intuitive act.

[scissorhands]

So often a child is pigeon-holed and it is a long time before a proper diagnosis is found and then treatment can start. A school mate was considered dumb until it was found he needed glasses, he couldn't read the blackboard.

My son was considered a violent and disruptive "naughty child" until in 1981 they discovered hyperactivity disorder and he was tested and treated. By then he was 6 years old.

Another mate of mine suffers ADHD but is holding down a good job and coping with life at 47. These people simply need more one-on-one attention until they "get it" and then do a usually better job than others. It is a matter of finding out how a person's brain works and fitting in with that. I don't consider it an intelligence issue as some of the most unlikely people can do amazing things, it is a matter of how a person learns and we are all different to some degree.

Scissorhands, how do you see yourself, as it appears that you are good at expressing yourself and in researching the condition?

My dad had 2 degrees both with honours, I retired in my early twenties with my own home. I'm basically just intelligent, especially with problem solving, like industrial maintenance and machinery.
My main problems are in verbal communication, I come across as a dick. I never did homework once, as sitting in front of my books elicited a huge blankness. Even now, sitting in front of work, elicits the same response today. I get bored with chores, and am always on the lookout for a muse to entertain me.

Bored and frustrated intelligent person with limited verbal skills and emotional intelligence.
If not for the shit medical shitstem.... and the ass family, I may have done something significant with my life, like manufacturing or product design or the many things that inspire me.

Ethically strong creates an inflexibility with many other people. The strong ethical drive is problematic in todays world, where being a prick is somehow encouraged

[scissorhands]

I'm not so sure about the treatment ... There's strong threads of both ADHD and Aspergers in my famly - with many mixes and variants ...

What I see is that the family members who were diagnosed and "treated" are worse off than the ones who were diagnosed and not treated ...

I have two nephews .. one diagnosed ADHD/Aspergers ... he's a bloody mess because his parents treated him differently .. don't believe he can function by himself, and consequently don't let him .. don't let him out of their sight .. don't let him do anything (he's 21 years old ...) he's been treated differently all his life ... it has not been good for him ...

And another nephew (different parents) is is clearly on the autistic spectrum .. has had tests done .. but has never been told what the results of the tests were ... and is doing extremely well - if a little dreamy and odd at times ...

Sure, one of my sisters and her husband have done pretty badly by their son ... the other sister and her husband have been pretty good ... but this is just one example I've seen of "treated" Aspergers people being worse than none treated ... I had to deal with an Aspergers student who used to play up al the time ... her standard response "It's not my fault - you can't blame me, I'm Aspergers" .. my internal response (never vocalized) was "Yeah Right ..." that was the ultimate cop-out of personal responsibility ...

I have seen some great results from treating ASD people ... but equally I have seen some big fuck ups ... so I'm in two minds about treatment ..

For a long time doctors blamed it on refrigerator mother, or poor mothering. Now its all genetic....Freaken dickheads.

I believe early awareness to be key. But deny most interventions as badly thought out actions

The truth is nature and nurture both contribute, especially mainstream school systems which indoctrinate to a certain beat or rhythm , a beat that is anathema to aspies.

The medical fraternity is to blame for much of the suffering at a family and personal level. They are lying about mental health, just like a doctor will never recommend diet, all the while diet being the main driver of health...

Its all bullshit and money, peeps need to do their own homework as medical professionals are corrupted by bad science and nefarious political reasons which obscure facts and are all part of the general dumbing down of modern western man.

I have learnt not to trust a medical expert at all, but only till very recently..... Which is quite liberating as well as being quite lonely, noone is there to help me except fools and horses!!

So I agree with your view BB on avoiding medical experts. We are just a walking dollar sign to them, so 'fixing' you is not the desired outcome for their business, and they do not have the skills anyway

Medical and health industries should never be a business, as well as education and housing.

AVOID!

[Akzle]

The truth is nature and nurture both contribute, especially mainstream school systems which indoctrinate to a certain beat or rhythm , a beat that is anathema to aspies.

dude. all you have to do is stand up when they tell you "your name", accept their authority without question, recite the correct answers when they're demanded of you.... really, they're just preparing you for life in "society"

[Banditbandit]

For a long time doctors blamed it on refrigerator mother, or poor mothering. Now its all genetic....Freaken dickheads.

I believe early awareness to be key. But deny most interventions as badly thought out actions

Yeah ... that's what I have seen ...

The truth is nature and nurture both contribute, especially mainstream school systems which indoctrinate to a certain beat or rhythm , a beat that is anathema to aspies.

The medical fraternity is to blame for much of the suffering at a family and personal level. They are lying about mental health, just like a doctor will never recommend diet, all the while diet being the main driver of health...

Its all bullshit and money, peeps need to do their own homework as medical professionals are corrupted by bad science and nefarious political reasons which obscure facts and are all part of the general dumbing down of modern western man.

I have learnt not to trust a medical expert at all, but only till very recently..... Which is quite liberating as well as being quite lonely, noone is there to help me except fools and horses!!

I still don't trrust the fuckers ... I recently went to a "specialist" with stomach problems .. he asked me what medication I was using and I said "sulpher-based drugs, because they seemed to work better that the penicillin" .. he said "we don't usually prescribe suplpher-based drugs for that .. I'll give you soemthing that works better" .. and promptly gave me a scrip for ... wait for it .. penicillin ... didn't listen the fucker ... and I've never been back

Which is why I've also refused Aspergers/ADHD tests ...

I have never let the "health professionals" look after my health ... If they won't do what I want then I find one who will ...

[Oscar]

Yeah ... that's what I have seen ...



I still don't trrust the fuckers ... I recently went to a "specialist" with stomach problems .. he asked me what medication I was using and I said "sulpher-based drugs, because they seemed to work better that the penicillin" .. he said "we don't usually prescribe suplpher-based drugs for that .. I'll give you soemthing that works better" .. and promptly gave me a scrip for ... wait for it .. penicillin ... didn't listen the fucker ... and I've never been back

Which is why I've also refused Aspergers/ADHD tests ...

I have never let the "health professionals" look after my health ... If they won't do what I want then I find one who will ...

So when your appendix bursts....you're going to fix it yourself...?

[Banditbandit]

So when your appendix bursts....you're going to fix it yourself...?

That's a case of having to use them ... but I'll never trust them ... that's a choice between letting them operate or dying ... but afterwards . I'll do what I want about my recovery ...

Yeah I do use doctors .. but they are only a little better than witch doctors .. it's a black art .. no matter how much they try to tell you it's "science" ...

[Oscar]

That's a case of having to use them ... but I'll never trust them ... that's a choice between letting them operate or dying ... but afterwards . I'll do what I want about my recovery ...

Yeah I do use doctors .. but they are only a little better than witch doctors .. it's a black art .. no matter how much they try to tell you it's "science" ...

So you trust them to cut you open and fiddle with yer guts, but you won't take their word for how to avoid or treat infection?
Interesting.

Do you let them use anesthetics?
Isn't that "science"?

[Banditbandit]

So you trust them to cut you open and fiddle with yer guts, but you won't take their word for how to avoid or treat infection?
Interesting.

Do you let them use anesthetics?
Isn't that "science"?

No ... I have to let them cut me open .. or I die ... the first choice is a risk . the second one a certainty .. I'll take the risk thank you ...

I know how to avoid and treat infections .... and I don't believe that drugs are always the answer ... especially with increased, and increasing, antibotics-resistance amongst the happy little organisms that eat us ... (that doesn't mean I go for homeopathy - which is no more than magc as far as I can see) ... and I certainly don't want antibiotics for a virus (one tried to give me some a while ago and was offended when I laughed ... I wonder wheere he got his medical degree ... )

I have not "let them use anasthetics" since I was an adult - I've had no operations since I was about 12 years old ... Yeah that passes as "science" ...

I do let them stitch me up when I get badly cut ... but I watch them like a hawk ... and I take out my own stitches ... (Fuck they just cut and pull - I can do that just as easily )

A while ago the doctor told me my colesterol (spelling?) was too high and I had a 15% chance of a heart attack in the next 15 years .. I laughed .. he told me that was serious .. I told him I was on my bike sitting on 235 klicks on the Western Access Road around Taupo the previous weekend ... what did he reckon would kill me first? He put my file away and said "Go away and have a nice life ..."

[Edbear]

No ... I have to let them cut me open .. or I die ... the first choice is a risk . the second one a certainty .. I'll take the risk thank you ...

I know how to avoid and treat infections .... and I don't believe that drugs are always the answer ... especially with increased, and increasing, antibotics-resistance amongst the happy little organisms that eat us ... (that doesn't mean I go for homeopathy - which is no more than magc as far as I can see) ... and I certainly don't want antibiotics for a virus (one tried to give me some a while ago and was offended when I laughed ... I wonder wheere he got his medical degree ... )

I have not "let them use anasthetics" since I was an adult - I've had no operations since I was about 12 years old ... Yeah that passes as "science" ...

I do let them stitch me up when I get badly cut ... but I watch them like a hawk ... and I take out my own stitches ... (Fuck they just cut and pull - I can do that just as easily )

A while ago the doctor told me my colesterol (spelling?) was too high and I had a 15% chance of a heart attack in the next 15 years .. I laughed .. he told me that was serious .. I told him I was on my bike sitting on 235 klicks on the Western Access Road around Taupo the previous weekend ... what did he reckon would kill me first? He put my file away and said "Go away and have a nice life ..."

You seem to live for the here and now which is a youth "thing", but unfortunately for most of us we tend not to die early enough. We tend to live until our recklessness of youth catches up with us and we start suffering for our past.

I agree with your Doctor. I don't take health lightly and always do my own research and discuss issues with the Docs on their level, or as close to it as one can without the Degrees they have. I believe in personal responsibility and not to rely on others to tell me what to do, but if ever in doubt, I defer to the specialists. It's worked so far, but I've had some negative consequences from those who should have known better or listened.

[Banditbandit]

I've had some negative consequences from those who should have known better or listened.

See - right there ... after negative consequences you still trust them .. I don't ...

[Edbear]

See - right there ... after negative consequences you still trust them .. I don't ...

A nurse nearly killed me once by not listening to my wife.

Not implicitly, but I do listen and ask questions and do my own study. So far the only reason I am alive, is due to conventional medicine and Doctors.

I would certainly have died once if I'd listened to a Naturopath and not checked with my Doc!

[scissorhands]

yeah naturopaths are killing people with vitamins and minerals at an astonishing rate