Elections are coming up. What are we thinking?

[pete376403]

Media can manufacture or select the polls to say anything that they want ... there are no integrity check systems to stop them!

Another question for John Key ... does he hold any citizenships other than NZ?

He will always be able to get citizenship in Israel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return

[oldrider]

He will always be able to get citizenship in Israel
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_of_Return

Not as attractive as US, he was there long enough did he take up citizenship?

[mashman]

Looking forward to hearing what Glen Greenwald has to say - and what evidence he has to back it up

Sooooooooo, how did it gooooooooooo? Didn't see it due to doing other things.

[gjm]

Q&A this morning. I may well be mistaken, but it seemed JK got his head and spouted forth (while avoiding any direct answers), while the others got talked over as soon as they got into their stride.

And apparently, the Q&A polls are typically 'accurate'. Presenters word, not mine!

The post-interviews review sounded like a run Labour down session, saying nothing that had happened or been said would affect JK or National. There was support for the Greens, but it came across as 'vote Green instead of Labour - they won't get in, and National stay in charge.'
One of the panel even said 'when Green vote goes up, Labour vote goes down'. The same person even said Labour won't get more than 20% of the vote, and as such lack legitimacy to even form a coalition government... Quite possible, but a discussion about the interview seemed to be sidetracked into no-one else can win so you may as well vote National diatribe. Apparently Cunliffe 'may have equalled or even bettered Key in two of the debates' - I thought he'd kicked Key into touch in the first, and came out ahead in the second? (I didn't watch all of either debate, and haven't watched any more.)

The scariest thing about all of this is no-one challenges what is being said. No-one holds Key or National accountable for the monumental borrowing NZ now has - no-one even mentions it. Run Labour down, all good. Rave about National. All good. Give Green a little fillip - it won't make any difference, so that's good too. Of course, National abolished the charter Labour had given to TVNZ (it had failed, so there's nothing wrong in that) and give $15m a year to the NZ On Air Platinum Fund, which pays for Q&A.

Even JK's admission that he considered illegal expansion of covert public surveillance was dismissed with "well, they didn't do it so it doesn't matter'. We'll see. Subsequent assertions that GCSB does perform mass surveillance may (or may not) be proven. If true, it'll be embarrassing for all politicians who have discussed it, regardless of party affiliation.

Obviously this is just my perception of the media representation of the election 'stuff'. It could be that like bluninja, I also need to review my sources.

[oldrider]

Anyone else notice that the usual prolific political posters have gone to ground on KB?

Here we are only a few days away from the election and they are the quietest that one can ever remember!

Maybe they are all anticipating a final onslaught following the fat controllers amazing release on John Key next week!

[Madness]

[Brian d marge]

I have this in me note section of KB and its helpful to remind folks sometimes , one should;

Challenge the TINA ( there is no alternative ) syndrome .. ( again not I am not sure )
* Promote informed debate and critique ..
* Promote participatory democracy ..
* Embrace the Treaty of Waitangi as a liberating force ..
* Encourage progressive counter-nationalism ..
* Develop multi-level strategies ..
* Hold the line ..
* Localise politics ..
* Ginger up party politics ..
* Invest in the future ..
* Support those who speak out ..
* Promote ethical investment ..
* Think global, act local ..
* Think local, act global ..

Stephen

[Naki Rat]

An accurate appraisal of the situation

[Ocean1]

An accurate appraisal of the situation

I think Uncle Bob's appraisal of mate Rod is more concise.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=10833173

Labour will tax more and spend more to save the economy? Dog save us from whinging pommy doomsayers.

[Oscar]

Anyone else notice that the usual prolific political posters have gone to ground on KB?

Here we are only a few days away from the election and they are the quietest that one can ever remember!

Maybe they are all anticipating a final onslaught following the fat controllers amazing release on John Key next week!

That's probably because:

• The election has become boring.
• However, not quite as boring as some of the nupties here.

[bluninja]

An accurate appraisal of the situation

Really?? Some would disagree, it's certainly a "vote labour" appraisal.

[gjm]

I think Uncle Bob's appraisal of mate Rod is more concise.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/n...ectid=10833173

Labour will tax more and spend more to save the economy? Dog save us from whinging pommy doomsayers.

Uncle Bob didn't actually offer an alternative, though. Just a 'she'll be a-right'.

Economics is just a part of the election. National keep trotting out the 'Labour will borrow $18bn.' National borrowed $30bn to cover costs incurred by the Chch earthquake, and have only spent $15bn in Chch since then. Where's the rest? What happened to the funds saved for such an eventuality, and the money paid by insurance companies?



So economics is one aspect of this, but it's one that National have thoroughly shafted NZ on over the last few years. They were (imho) correct to borrow to build, but they have massively over-borrowed, and are hugely over-exposed. I said before that this means NZ needs to maintain an ever-increasing GDP, but that isn't happening. GDP growth is slowing, and may even fall back slightly.

Do Labour have the answer? Or anyone else? I don't know, and to expect them to recover from this shambles in a single term is optimistic, to put it mildly. Anyone who has had the misfortune to experience personal debt (for whatever reason) will know it takes longer to pay off than it does to run up in the first place.

Past performance is no guarantee of future success, but if your performance has been indisputably poor, and shows no sign of changing or even inclination to change, do you deserve a chance to make things worse?

The government NZ needs is one that will work together for the benefit of the country, and not one which is openly derogatory towards the electorate (as John Key has been) and won't tell anyone what they intend to do.

[Ocean1]

Uncle Bob didn't actually offer an alternative, though. Just a 'she'll be a-right'.

Well, he's worth a bit. Which makes his somewhat of an expert opinion wrt economists.

Economics is just a part of the election. National keep trotting out the 'Labour will borrow $18bn.' National borrowed $30bn to cover costs incurred by the Chch earthquake, and have only spent $15bn in Chch since then.

Source?

And in fact, like a few others with a functioning memory I'm still pissed that labour presided over the largest economic boom in living memory, taxed the fuck out of us right through it and blew the lot on social welfare, leaving us with fuck all fat to weather the GFC.

[blue rider]

interesting read for those who care

will be voting early and only once

http://oneandonlybrands.blogspot.co.....html?spref=fb

There is no difference between the party's ability to deliver growth or to meaningfully redistribute health or education resources - because we do a pretty good job of that - regardless of who has the helm.

But that doesn't mean you shouldn't change the government in this election. You should. The previous government became haughty just as the current one expresses a kind of entitled hubris. They become stale after too long in the sun and need to be switched around. It keeps them honest. It gives the electorate a fair sense of representation and choice.

It is time to change the government as a way of expressing your faith in a democratic process. Not because one party is 'better' than the other but because they need to be reminded that they represent us, the New Zealand parliament doesn't rule - it governs. There is a big difference.

To keep our democracy alive and healthy it needs to be regularly pruned. It's time for some dead-heading.

[Swoop]

There was support for the Greens, but it came across as 'vote Green instead of Labour - they won't get in, and National stay in charge.'
One of the panel even said 'when Green vote goes up, Labour vote goes down'. The same person even said Labour won't get more than 20% of the vote, and as such lack legitimacy to even form a coalition government... Quite possible

The interesting thing is that when the liarbour vote goes down, this will bring a whole new raft of lunatic fringe-ist, green party list morons, out into the open. Scary times.
A bit like the Internet/moron party who has john minto high on their party list (scary!).