Guy riding in Auckland with no helmet

**zzzbang** · 5th March 2009, 23:42

yes, let them do what they want, if you dont want to waste money to save your skull then dont. but dont say that a helmet is useless, because that is just completely stupid.

**Forest** · 6th March 2009, 04:49

Did anybody else see this story last month?

http://www.3news.co.nz/Video/Campbel...4/Default.aspx

**jonbuoy** · 6th March 2009, 04:57

Originally Posted by davereid

So why is he a prat exactly ?

No doubt you will answer "because he was doing something dangerous, that could have cost me and other taxpayers ACC money for his medical bill if he bins."

That of course just proves you are the prat.

Understand this.

A helmet is SO EFFECTIVE at reducing head injuries that it is almost statistically irrelevant.

Time after time I have published tables of motorcycle death rates in NZ and invited bikers to use the data to guess which year we got helmets.

And surprise surprise, I get quoted endless data from overseas "proving" we need helmets.

No one has ever picked the year we got helmets from kiwi fatality data, as in spite of promises of massive reductions in death rates, it had no effect.

But there IS data you can use to make a good guess as to compulsory helmet year. Research "tetraplegia" and you will see the year quite clearly.

For every biker wishing safety rules on other bikers, there is a non biker even keener to make you safe.

His technique is statistically relevant. He can provide a solution to massively drop the road toll. He wants you in a Volvo.

Thats because riding a motorcycle helmetless is done for fun, enjoyment and because it feels good. Thats actually exactly the same reason as to why we ride motorcycles.

So, in the USA, they will be debating helmet laws for years to come.

But due to idiots like you, we will be driving cars.

OK real world statistic I came off - my shoei had a huge graze on the visor and top - if I hadn't been wearing it that would have been my face. I wouldn't be dead but probably blind and brain damaged.

**davereid** · 6th March 2009, 07:05

OK firstly, I shouldn't have called PortoKiwi an idiot, I get a bit wound up about these things, and it wasn't a fair call, so I apologise.

It also sounded a bit "anti helmet" or "anti safety" this wasnot my message.

Not for a moment do I think that helmets are of no value, I absolutely think they are, particularly in low speed crashes and as an abrasion preventative.

But Kiwis seem to be a pious lot, keen to preach their particular brand of safety at others while ignoring the real picture.

With regards to motorcycling, the problem is simple.

Motorcycles are much less stable, offer no crash protection, are hard to see and have high performance.

They are much less safe than a car.

Depending on whos data you read:

Motorcyclists are 16-26 times more likely to die on the roads than car drivers.
Helmets may double or even triple you chances of accident survival.

So its very clear. The banning of motorcycles will have a massive effect on the road toll. Helmet laws much much less.

We have to argue the "free choice" principle, as if we accept thats its OK for others to ban behaviour we enjoy, it will inevitably end our motorcycling.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Note : Survival of an accident is not necessarily a good indicator that a helmet was effective, or desirable. Helmets are very good at protecting you from abrasion and open type head injuries, but much less effective at closed jead injury protection.

**Indiana_Jones** · 6th March 2009, 07:09

Originally Posted by portokiwi

walking in Auckland city at 1230 today and a guy rides past on his green kawasaki. looked like a 250cc. he had a girl on the back who I think was wearing a push bike helmet and wearing shorts.
Where do these prats come from????

Knew I forgot something!

EDIT: Something, not sometime lol

-Indy

**DangerMice** · 6th March 2009, 07:21

Originally Posted by davereid

Time after time I have published tables of motorcycle death rates in NZ and invited bikers to use the data to guess which year we got helmets.

I have no idea when helmets were introduced, but I'm just curious, what happened in 1973 (before my time) for the total deaths to suddenly increase so much and stay higher?

**Forest** · 6th March 2009, 07:50

Originally Posted by DangerMice

I have no idea when helmets were introduced, but I'm just curious, what happened in 1973 (before my time) for the total deaths to suddenly increase so much and stay higher?

That's basically the problem with looking at a single statistic over time. It doesn't take into account any of the compounding variables. For example:

Total number of riders
Number of miles ridden
Increases in motorbike power
Experience of riders
Quality of roads

etc etc

**HungusMaximist** · 6th March 2009, 07:50

I saw that happen to, they parked up at Britomart and they both jumped off.

What the fuck ? ? ?

**fLaThEaD FreD** · 6th March 2009, 08:02

Originally Posted by SpankMe

I keep seeing a guy around my area riding his motorbike with nothing but a fucking towel on his head.

I bet you live in Mt Roskill then!

**sunhuntin** · 6th March 2009, 08:03

Originally Posted by Indiana_Jones

Knew I forgot sometime!

-Indy

i had a guy come into bp when i was there. was riding a motorbike, no helmet. he comes over with a funny look on his face "i just remembered i forgot my helmet!" i loaned him mine to go home and get his. it can happen... ive done it myself, though i realised before i took off as the exhaust sounded louder than normal.

**Indiana_Jones** · 6th March 2009, 08:14

Originally Posted by sunhuntin

i had a guy come into bp when i was there. was riding a motorbike, no helmet. he comes over with a funny look on his face "i just remembered i forgot my helmet!" i loaned him mine to go home and get his. it can happen... ive done it myself, though i realised before i took off as the exhaust sounded louder than normal.

lol I always realise what I've forgotten once I walk out the door or see the bike....'wait a minute, something should be in my hand lol'

-Indy

**davebullet** · 6th March 2009, 08:59

There is a very simple answer.

We can't change the ignorant, Darwin's law and all that... so let's not try.

No helmet and you crash = no ACC payments to your recovery (or funeral). you have to sell your assets, or put the onus on your family.

Those that don't care about their personal protection will never change... so why should we cover them?

Cheers,
Dave.

**want-a-harley** · 6th March 2009, 09:02

Simple test, put a helmet on, hold a brick above your head and drop the brick. Now repeat without helmet.

**Clubbie** · 6th March 2009, 10:02

With all that said re the for and against of helmets.... do you guys think there is much difference between them when it all boils down to it?

I've looked at the SHARP testing site
http://sharp.direct.gov.uk/

Do you think 1 star will do you any worse then 5?