More Lie Profit Privatize From National (9th Feb Parliament)

**DEVVIL** · 26th January 2010, 09:21

Before The : Next BIG Protest with StoneY and the Unions

Beven HanlonMeet with the stinky 7 today (the 7 managers in charge of privatisaing prisons) they kept a glimmer of hope alive. we have until May before any final decision is made by cabinet on which existing prison is up for sale. So show your support and show that no jail is for sale. come to our rally on the 9th of Feb early afternoon in front of parliament

**Hitcher** · 26th January 2010, 20:26

So what would bikers turning up achieve? Are we supposed to be opposed to the privatisation of prisons, or are we just some sort of rent-a-mob?

**DEVVIL** · 26th January 2010, 21:07

Originally Posted by Hitcher

So what would bikers turning up achieve? Are we supposed to be opposed to the privatization of prisons, or are we just some sort of rent-a-mob?

Do what you like. Dont show up if you don't want to. Some bikers are affected by this and my main concern is about staff assaults or worse. Rent-a-mob and bikers your kidding right. Bikers come from all walks of life and can think for themselves. I Just have to say something or I can just do nothing.I dont expect everyone to agree.
The link I see is
Lie
Profit
Privatize
Money over people.

**Hitcher** · 26th January 2010, 21:12

Originally Posted by DEVVIL

The link I see is
Lie
Profit
Privatize
Money over people.

OK, I'll play along.
1. What lie?
2. What's wrong with making a profit?
3. What's wrong with private enterprise?
4. As a taxpayer, I'm prepared to listen closely to any idea that may reduce the amount of tax that I pay. If people want to voluntarily donate more of their taxpaid earnings to the goverment to protect inefficient sacred cows, then there is nothing to stop them.

**DEVVIL** · 26th January 2010, 21:34

Thats all good but working for a private prison that takes profit out of NZ. Puts money over staff safety. Can end up costing more per prisoner (ACRP cost $5,000 more per prisoner each year as a private prison in NZ). Wants more prisoners=$$$.
I'm all for giving value for tax payer money.

But staff are not collateral damage to save money.
Can we compete with private prisons (Yes)

If we privatize prisons

We end up with prisoners over crowded locked and unlocked
longer look up times
Shorter visit times
Not replacing sick staff
Staff getting stressed and bashed
Prisoners rioting (Staff getting hurt)
Sending lots of NZ cash (Profit) to another country. (WHY)
Its the same story as the ACC
Can we save money by privatizing?
Do we care about people or profit?
Do you care if a few staff get stabbed/bashed to save some $$$
Again I'm all for giving value for tax payer money.
1 Lie
2 Profit (going over seas)
3 Privatize=More prisoners, less staff, longer locks, more staff assaults riots And little ACC to fall back on.
That's it.
We can cut our costs they are doing it now. So If we can compete with private why send money over seas.

**DEVVIL** · 27th January 2010, 08:00

Beven Hanlon January 26 at 11:19pm
Mate here is an example of what will happen if they privatise HB prison. It is simply not cheaper in fact it was $7000 per prisoner per year more expensive. Also should overseas companies be making money from people. This used to be called slave labour?

Mate,

In terms of HB prison we currently have 325 Corrections officers.* The average salary is $52,000 a year.** this is a total of $16,900,000 a year going into the HB community as salary alone.

Private prisons will reduce the staffing by 30% and then the 227 staff that are left will have a further 30% reduction in salary making it $36,400 this is a total of $8,262,800 a year going to the HB Community a reduction of $8,637,200 a year.

A lot of staff have already said they will look to go across to Australia to work. Western Australia are back in NZ in February doing a recruitment drive. They pay 30% more than the NZ public system.

There will be an increase in violence at HB prison. We will see an increase of up to 60% in prisoner on prisoner violence and 49% staff on prisoner violence.*** The injuries sustained in these attacks will be treated at HB Hospital. This means that money that should be used to treat honest taxpaying HB citizens will be treating injuries of prisoners that would not have got injured in a publically run prison. I don’t know how many babies or old people miss out on treatment because of the hundreds of thousands of dollars treating these prisoners.

* Figures obtained from Cornet. Department of Corrections Website
** Figures obtained from Department of Corrections
*** 2001 US Department of Justice Report

**Hitcher** · 27th January 2010, 20:18

If I recall correctly, the purpose of prisons is to provide accommodation for bad buggers, rehabilitation for the not so bad and a deterent for those considering evil ways. Clearly they don't work, or otherwise we would be closing them down, not providing more of them.

On the basis that they clearly don't work, aren't supposed to be holiday homes or sources of income for the provinces that are fortunate to have them, then what's the harm in trying something different, particularly something that costs shitloads less than the current secure hostelries?

Personally I don't give a shit if prisoners want to beat each other up. Perhaps unlocking all of the cells and leaving a few loaded guns and sharp pointy things lying around could be more effective than privatisation. Install a few CCTV cameras and sell the resulting spectacle on pay for view TV. I reckon that could be a great little earner.

**DEVVIL** · 27th January 2010, 21:10

Originally Posted by Hitcher

Personally I don't give a shit if prisoners want to beat each other up. Perhaps unlocking all of the cells and leaving a few loaded guns and sharp pointy things lying around could be more effective than privatization. Install a few CCTV cameras and sell the resulting spectacle on pay for view TV. I reckon that could be a great little earner.

Well I'm clearly not qualified to talk to you.

**NONONO** · 28th January 2010, 06:41

All part of the great rip off campaign we have recently seen (and continue to see) with ACC.
As you say Devill, lie, privatize, profit. Sell off state assets, which by the way includes peoples jobs, in order to profit a few.
But as it does not DIRECTLY affect some people they have no interest, until the consequences hit home later and then we get the whinging noises.
Keep up the work rate Devill, and though I can't be there on 6th, am hopeful of being there on 16th.

**DEVVIL** · 28th January 2010, 08:15

Will be a good ride down.

**BoristheBiter** · 28th January 2010, 08:27

Why do you quote US statics?
If you do, what about the guy in, I think, Arizona whos feeds the personers for 50c a day, no problems there (unless you are in there).
I don't understand what you mean by if you are not effect by this? are you a person that at some time have been in, had somone in, or worked for the NZ corrections.
why is it that you don't like the idea of privatization? have you, or anyone else, seen the draft bill of how they will be run or the mangment system they will be required to work under.

**DEVVIL** · 28th January 2010, 10:48

Stop The Cell Off So the Nats are going against the rest of the world. Who would have guessed the idea of more jail time for offenders now that we have the possibility of private prisons involved.

**DEVVIL** · 28th January 2010, 11:15

Originally Posted by BoristheBiter

Why do you quote US statics?
If you do, what about the guy in, I think, Arizona whos feeds the personers for 50c a day, no problems there (unless you are in there).
I don't understand what you mean by if you are not effect by this? are you a person that at some time have been in, had somone in, or worked for the NZ corrections.
why is it that you don't like the idea of privatization? have you, or anyone else, seen the draft bill of how they will be run or the mangment system they will be required to work under.

We had private prison in NZ before and yes it cost $5,000 more per prisoner per year at ACRP when it was private.
With less staff
Profit going over seas
More staff getting bashed
To be affected you may mow the lawns fix or sell cars etc to staff that got made redundant (dam you're going broke now with GST going up ACC going up Rego going up Property tax going up. Who's next? you.re next). or need a hip replaced and the waiting list is longer now because more prisoners and staff in hospital.
Time to stop the madness. or just pay up

**Pascal** · 28th January 2010, 11:24

Alternative option:

1. Government opens contract for prisons to public tender
2. A NZ businessman tenders and wins
3. Jobs remain in NZ
4. Money remains in NZ
5. Money is used to fund other enterprise
6. More jobs in NZ
7. Having prison run as a private enterprise means more efficient
8. Prison is no longer a luxury hotel with Sky TV (I don't even fucking have Sky!)
9. Government spending target is met (My taxes. Fantastic!)
10. = Win

Or is the aim to simply have a "National bad" froth-rant? In which case please, carry on.