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Brian d marge

21st January 2015, 17:00

japans just bought a shit load of new gear . . . .

dodgy fuckrs know somethings up i reckon

awa355

21st January 2015, 17:06

The only way to prevent war is not to participate in the first place! :mellow:

Unfortunately, for that to work, the guy on the other side of the fence has to believe it as well.

Brian d marge

21st January 2015, 17:12

Unfortunately, for that to work, the guy on the other side of the fence has to believe it as well.
hes busy with the green . . .dont worry

oldrider

21st January 2015, 17:36

Unfortunately, for that to work, the guy on the other side of the fence has to believe it as well.

True but then it is defense not an act of war as the aggressor - I think there is a difference unless our politicians are lying to us! (they wouldn't do that would they?)

SPman

21st January 2015, 19:17

japans just bought a shit load of new gear . . . .

dodgy fuckrs know somethings up i reckon Yep - Obama has recruited them to help "contain" China. Biggest spend since the war, isn't it?

Brian d marge

21st January 2015, 21:19

Yep - Obama has recruited them to help "contain" China. Biggest spend since the war, isn't it?
tis indeed and my beer has gone up . .im paying for that war

i should stop drinking then the war will never happen . .cant do much warring with no money

should . . .

mashman

22nd January 2015, 07:16

Nicknamed the 'The Punisher' (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/26050987/fiery-grandmother-joins-ukrainian-army/).

oldrider

22nd January 2015, 08:42

Nicknamed the 'The Punisher' (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/top-stories/26050987/fiery-grandmother-joins-ukrainian-army/).

She doesn't want to see occupation again - well neither does Putin - and obviously by her words he hasn't - why do they keep saying he has?

Maybe it is simply NATO and USA that have invaded and occupied their minds - their neighbours in their Eastern state want to remain Russians as part of Russia!

Democracy at work but not allowed or accepted by the champions of democracy - USA - only if it suits them and it goes their way! :shifty::corn:

awa355

22nd January 2015, 13:19

I sense a conspiricy here, Didn't she used to clean the cafeteria at Langley, after everyone else had gone home for the day? :confused:

oldrider

22nd January 2015, 14:09

I sense a conspiricy here, Didn't she used to clean the cafeteria at Langley, after everyone else had gone home for the day? :confused:

:confused: Is a conspiracy the story you believe may be true - or is it the ones that other people believe might be true? :facepalm: tsk tsk so confusing! :argue: . :wacko:

SPman

22nd January 2015, 15:32

She doesn't want to see occupation again - well neither does Putin - and obviously by her words he hasn't - why do they keep saying he has?

Maybe it is simply NATO and USA that have invaded and occupied their minds - their neighbours in their Eastern state want to remain Russians as part of Russia!

Democracy at work but not allowed or accepted by the champions of democracy - USA - only if it suits them and it goes their way! :shifty::corn:

The western papers, apart from the "Russia bad - West good mantra they pump out all the time, refuse to differentiate between the people of West Ukraine, who are Russo-phobic - especially those from Galicia, and those from the East. Kiev, is also the old traditional capital of Russia - not Moscow. Russia doesn't want to occupy Donbass - it would much rather have a united, stable, non-aggresive Ukraine on it's boundary, but, Nato and the US won't allow that!

I also like this comment on the current fighting....

Then there are all those rumors about Ukie units refusing to go on the offensive. Initially, I dismissed them as Novorussian propaganda, but then the Ukrainian social media also began echoing this information. Apparently, entire units are refusing to go on the offensive. Frankly, I don't blame them. Sure, the Ukies did lick their wounds from the catastrophic campaign last summer, but there is only that much anybody can do in just few months.
In most countries, just basic training, "bootcamp", is 3-4 months after which a civilian is considered only as a basic solider, a "private". Only then does this basic solider get any kind of specialty. As for a NCO (non commissioned, a corporal, sergeant, etc.) or an officer - they need even much more training. Except that the Ukies already used a lot of their older, but at least trained, NCOs and officers this summer and now their are either dead, or crippled or disgusted.
Poroshenko has now announced three waves of mobilization for 2015, but is rather evident for anybody with a semblance of intelligence that he is really conscripting cannon fodder, not a capable fighting force. In contrast, the Novorussians now have plenty of well-trained, well equipped and battle hardened experienced men on all levels. And make no mistake, a company of experienced battle hardened soldiers will defeat an entire battalion of clueless recruits, especially if the former are better equipped (which is the case thanks to the Voentorg).

http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/images/smilies/confused.gif Is a conspiracy the story you believe may be true - or is it the ones that other people believe might be true? http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/images/smilies/facepalm.gif tsk tsk so confusing! http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/images/smilies/argue.gif . http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/images/smilies/wacko.gif A conspiracy is what you think, judged by people who often don't think, or it doesn't fit with the scenario in their heads and, refusing to process it or think about it, they call it a conspiracy, to make themselves feel better and so they don't have to think about it.......or something.........

oldrider

22nd January 2015, 16:16

I am unable to find any back up that Russia has invaded (or intends to invade) Ukraine territory from anything other than American NATO backed media!

This is all that comes out of Russia: http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine-abroad/reuters-russia-says-no-proof-it-sent-troops-arms-to-east-ukraine-378018.html Followed by a diatribe of negative counter comments!

Putin has said all along that they do not want an unstable, even divided Ukraine - who really is driving this so called war? :corn:

mashman

22nd January 2015, 16:39

I also like this comment on the current fighting....

Good to hear that some units are refusing to fight. Can't be an easy decision to make.

SPman

22nd January 2015, 17:53

Yatseniuk (Ukraine prime minister) has publicly accused Russia of "invading Germany" at the end of the war.....

Putin was not invited to the commemoration of the liberation of Auschwitz, the Foreign Minister of Poland, Grzegorz Schetyna, declared: "The 1st Ukrainian front and Ukrainians liberated [the concentration camp], as on that January day there were Ukrainian soldiers, so they opened the gates of the camp".

So they invited Poroshenko - because "his" Ukrainians liberated Auschwitz.

So now we have it. Russia occupied Germany, the Ukraine liberated Auschwitz and soon we will be told that Stalin ordered the Holocaust, bombed Dresden and dropped nuclear devices on Japan. Then just call Putin the New Stalin and, voilà! We will be back to the good old "western civilization" against the "Asiatic Mongol hordes of Russia".
Some things really never change.

Revisionism is alive and well in Europe......

oldrider

22nd January 2015, 20:09

We have spent the last seventy years listening to all the bragging about the dirty tricks and deception used to start the last two world wars! :shifty:

Now they are obviously at it all over again! :shit: Not to forget all the other wars Korea, Viet Nam and countless Middle East conflicts etc etc! :sick:

Looks like we going to just roll over and allow them to do it again in Ukraine and get away with it. :wait: Meanwhile back in the Middle East! :ar15:

Brian d marge

23rd January 2015, 00:43

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ate1fVVwg4

Imran has a word or two

oldrider

23rd January 2015, 16:08

Imran has a word or two

Imran has a word or two actually worth listening to IMHO very thought provoking. :corn:

Brian d marge

23rd January 2015, 16:12

Imran has a word or two actually worth listening to IMHO very thought provoking. :corn:
but hes a muslim . ,so must not be telling the truth . . .

oldrider

23rd January 2015, 16:41

but hes a muslim . ,so must not be telling the truth . . .

True - ask any member of the "Western Judaic Christian alliance" of which he spoke at great length!

The "Eastern Christian Islamic alliance" apparently have a very different view of truth altogether!

A compelling speaker clear concise and well backed by historical facts over a long historic phase of mans spiritual and political lunacy! :scratch:

oldrider

24th January 2015, 08:40

mashman

24th January 2015, 09:28

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ate1fVVwg4

Imran has a word or two

Interesting view on the Quran translations being taken out of context (perception, meh) to justify jihad.

Why does the USA continually blame Russia for everything in Ukraine?:https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-cl=84503534&x-yt-ts=1421914688&v=HkYNpZcK9ws&feature=player_embedded

Now becoming just a bit too obvious! :shifty:

Maybe some Russians are making it across in the manner described? Good job too, if that is the case and imho, coz someone needs to stop the offensives on Donetsk/Lugansk and I'd be surprised if Russians were that cold hearted that they'd let Russians die for what they know is nothing more than war whoreplay.

It is obvious. Quick, call the world police.

SPman

24th January 2015, 22:52

There are a lot of Russians crossing over as mercenaries - Chechens as well. They are not Russian military, they're mercenaries, like a lot of troops in Ukraine. They may be ex=military, but a lot of the Donbass troops were as well. The Russians have been resupplying the NAB since the ceasefire - just as the US and some Nato countries have been resupplying Ukraine!
They say the first casualty of war is truth.........................

mstriumph

24th January 2015, 22:57

so the NAB is in on it too??
- you just can't trust bloody banks!:angry:

Brian d marge

24th January 2015, 23:43

https://www.google.co.jp/search?q=fuck+the+eu&client=ms-android-samsung&biw=360&bih=592&tbm=isch&source=lnms&sa=X&ei=EoTDVMKTNqSXmwXRxIHIDw&ved=0CAkQ_AUoAw&dpr=3#imgrc=SVsrcyqW84m6NM%253A%3B_a4QE2ZcSyzBzM%3 Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fedge.liveleak.com%252F80281E%2 52Fll_a_s%252F2014%252FFeb%252F7%252FLiveLeak-dot-com-2d3_1391780547-111Victoria-Nuland-1_1391780947.jpg%253Fd5e8cc8eccfb6039332f41f6249e9 2b06c91b4db65f5e99818bdd5974544dbd5b9c4%2526ec_rat e%253D230%253Fext%253Djpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww .liveleak.com%252Fview%253Fi%253D2d3_1391780547%3B 450%3B393

Remember this is US policy towards, well most everyone really ...or the policy of the people that control US policy that is

yokel

25th January 2015, 07:22

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Ate1fVVwg4

Imran has a word or two

Looks like the birds are already falling out of the sky.

http://enenews.com/one-largest-mass-die-offs-seabirds-recorded-place-west-coast-significant-uptick-mass-mortality-events-marine-world-govt-ive-never-anything-like-experts-massive-massive-unprecedented-strong-po

mashman

25th January 2015, 09:25

oldrider

27th January 2015, 08:40

I do believe that there is a version of truth that justifies this, and every, war.

Don't forget the Jack Nicholson factor - can we handle the truth? :eek: - Not when it comes to Zionism Israel and America! :oi-grr:

Swoop

27th January 2015, 10:10

26 January 2015: The fighting in eastern Ukraine (Donbas) has killed over 6,000 since April 2014. Most of those dead have been civilians and over a million people have been driven from their homes.

Russia is causing itself lots of additional problems by continuing to pretend that Russia is not supplying the Ukrainian rebels with weapons, supplies (especially ammunition) and Russian troops to do most of the fighting.

In Ukraine the Russian backed rebels are actually disorganized, discouraged and not all that effective. Interrogations of captured rebels indicate that there are many different factions, some of them not even from Ukraine (like the “Cossack” units from southern Russia). The Cossacks are very nationalist and really keen on rebuilding the Russian empire (which is what Cossacks were invented for centuries ago). The Cossacks were welcome arrivals when they showed up in 2014, because the original local Donbas rebels quickly lost their enthusiasm when their uprising triggered a nationalistic fervour throughout Ukraine and inspired Ukrainian troops and armed volunteers to fight a lot harder than the rebels expected.

Russia, which sponsored and encouraged the rebels from the start soon found that the only way they could take territory was to send in Russian troops and heavy weapons (tanks, artillery, rocket launchers, and missiles).

The special operations units (Spetsnaz) were the best for this because these guys knew how to pretend (that they were Ukrainian rebels) and were very effective fighters. But there not enough of them available and regular Russian troops (which are mainly conscripts) had to be sent in as well, especially for support (transport and supply) functions. As more and more of these non-elite troops were killed a growing number of parents were not accepting the cover stories created to cover up the fact that their conscript son died in combat, not because of some accident.

While the government controls nearly all the mass media they have not managed to keep unwanted discussions from appearing via the Internet. Thus the parents and friends of soldiers who died in Donbas, but were reported as dying in Russia, are increasingly on the Internet comparing data and organizing demonstrations against the government lies, deceptions and getting soldiers killed in a clandestine war. The Russian secret police are not as scary as they used to be and the government is having a hard time keeping the angry parents quiet.

Worse, news of this unrest gets to the outside world where it makes more trouble for the Russian government and its cover story about what it is (or is not) doing in Donbas. The Russian government denies they have troops in Donbas but it is an open secret in Russia that they do and too many parents of Russian soldiers killed in Donbas are demonstrating their anger at government efforts to keep them quiet about where their sons died and how. In addition to the parents there is also the problem of Russian soldiers ignoring orders and posting their exploits in Ukraine on Facebook and other social networking sites. There aren’t many secrets in this secret war.

While the angry and Internet savvy parents are annoying the economic problems accompanying the secret war are very public and increasingly terrifying. The government is desperate to deal with the economic problems.

For example the government is coercing Russian companies and wealthy individuals to move foreign cash back to Russia. Hundreds of billions of dollars were moved out of Russia by Russian citizens once the Western sanctions began a year ago and that hurt the economy (by depriving Russian businesses of capital). While the state-controlled Russian media is ignoring the impact of the sanctions and the declining oil price most Russians can’t help but notice (and personally suffer from) the high inflation, shortage of foreign goods and rising unemployment.

The government has already admitted that government spending for 2015 will be cut by at least 10 percent. Unofficially officials talking about a 20 percent, or greater, cut. The government wants to maintain military spending, but those who study the government budget know that won’t work if the cuts get to 20 percent or more. Foreign, and even some Russian, economists also warn that the growing government intervention in the economy, and the management of major companies, is doing permanent damage. That government interference was what cause the economic collapse that destroyed the Soviet Union in the 1980s. It’s happening again, despite two decades of evidence that a market economy is much more productive, even in Russia (which the government insists is “different”).

China has been a big help to Russia in dealing with its diplomatic sanctions and economic problems resulting from the Ukrainian invasion.

For example China bought 36 percent more oil (665,000 barrels a day) from Russia and less from Saudi Arabia (but still 997,000 barrels a day) in the last year. Other countries have also helped Russia but they, like China, did it out of self-interest. Thus India, Russia and Iran have created an unofficial currency union and barter network to facilitate trade that gets around the sanctions on Russia and Iran. India wants peace with Iran because Iran is often on bad terms with Pakistan. Russia is still a major supplier of weapons to India and India has many leftists who are still nostalgic about the old Soviet Union.

The renewed Russian offensive in Donbas has brought forth more (and stronger) Western protests and more sanctions. Russia pretends to ignore the impact of the mess it has gotten into over Donbas and Crimea.

Most of the world disapproves of such aggression. The UN charter explicitly forbids that sort of thing.

No one, including most UN members, believes the Russian fiction that they are not involved. The Russian leadership, especially president-for-life Vladimir Putin, is making a major gamble here as he has made nationalism and “rebuilding Russian glory (and the empire)” a core part of his justification for turning Russia back into a police state.

While the majority of Russians go for the glory part they are not happy with the economic problems and worldwide condemnation. Unlike back in Soviet (pre-1991) days the government cannot keep out all the bad news from the rest of the world. In this case the bad news is that the rest of the world sees Russia as the bad guy here and this angers some Russians but dismays and demoralizes many more. Russians know their history and they know what a disaster power mad and power hungry leaders have been in the past.

More Russians are doing the math and most are concluding that Donbas is not worth the price the country is being forced to pay. Putin risks a backlash that could cost him his power and reputation. At the moment Putin believes his own press releases, that he is stronger and more determined than the leaders in Ukraine and their Western supporters.

Thus Putin sees himself eventually prevailing at a political price he can afford. A lot of Russians disagree with this math, including senior officials and long-time Putin allies. Many economists and business managers see long term damage to the Russian economy, which has still not recovered from the 70 years of communist mismanagement. In many ways the Ukraine blowback and the Putin centralization of government power has prevented the economy from growing and becoming competitive. The cost of grabbing Donbas is rising and if too many Russians decide it is not worth it, even the newly rebuilt Russian police state will be in danger. It happened to the czars, then to the communists and it can happen to the next lot of delusional megalomaniacs.

25 January 2015: Ukrainian officials supplied recordings of rebel cell phone and radio messages confirming that it was the rebels who recently fired rockets into residential neighbourhoods of the Ukrainian port city of Mariupol. The rebels and Russians accused the Ukrainians of doing this. It’s not the first time recordings have been used to unmask Russian misbehaviour. This is another problem the Russians have by relying on amateurs and conscript soldiers in Donbas. OPSEC (Operational Security) is something professional soldiers understand and employ. That means not posting military information on the Internet or discussing military matters via communications systems the enemy can overhear.

24 January 2015: In eastern Ukraine the pro-Russian rebels, reinforced by thousands of Russian troops and hundreds of military vehicles (including artillery and rocket launchers) launched a major offensive. The Russian troops are leading the way, with the local rebels and other volunteers (like the Cossacks and such from Russia) handling occupation of newly conquered territory.

The UN (and many Western and East European leaders) condemned Russia and the Ukrainian rebels for the death of 29 civilians in the Ukrainian city of Mariupol when residential areas were hit by a barrage of rockets. Russia, using its seat on the Security Council, blocked an official UN condemnation. The rebels, who had earlier bragged about their new offensive to take Mariupol backtracked when the deaths of the civilians became known and blamed it on the Ukrainian Army.

23 January 2015: The rebels in eastern Ukraine announced they were no longer abiding by the September ceasefire and were on the attack again. Apparently the rebels and their Russian sponsors want to take possession of all Donbas, an area consisting of two Ukrainian provinces (Donetsk and Luhansk). Donbas comprise about nine percent of Ukrainian territory, 13 percent of the population and 15 percent of the GDP. Donbas is about 38 percent ethnic Russian. The two provinces comprise the Donets Basin (or “Donbas”) which was for a long time an economic powerhouse for Russia. But that began to decline in the 1980s and accelerated when the Soviet Union fell (and Ukraine became a fully independent country) in 1991.

Katman

27th January 2015, 10:31

Blah, blah, blah....

Wow, you're a regular little Western propaganda mouthpiece, aren't you?

Swoop

27th January 2015, 11:27

Wow, you're a regular little Western propaganda mouthpiece, aren't you?

If it worries you, I can send you some tissues.

SPman

27th January 2015, 18:29

Where'd that come from - the New York Times?

yokel

28th January 2015, 06:01

Where'd that come from - the New York Times?

well there are people from New York there so I guess they would have the inside scoop?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="//www.youtube.com/embed/TBAQJ_b6j8w" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

avgas

28th January 2015, 08:17

In other news. Sevastapol is getting screwed thanks to UN sanctions. Power line to Russian mainland is 6 months away - Ukraine has its hands tied by UN so turns on supply to Sevastopol when it can sneak it.....but sanctions mean that they are supposed to cut supply to Sevas.

So now my buddies aren't allowed warm showers in the morning.

oldrider

28th January 2015, 10:12

A point of view other than presented by Western media:http://www.serendipity.li/the_saker/untermenschen.htm

mashman

28th January 2015, 11:18

Ukrainian MPs call on UN, NATO & PACE to recognize Russia as ‘aggressor state’ (http://rt.com/news/226743-ukraine-russia-aggressor-state/).

oldrider

28th January 2015, 13:05

Ukrainian MPs call on UN, NATO & PACE to recognize Russia as ‘aggressor state’ (http://rt.com/news/226743-ukraine-russia-aggressor-state/).

Adage: "Give me control of the finances of the world I care not who makes the laws" - A practical example of how this works for the international Zionists! :shifty:

mashman

28th January 2015, 15:37

Adage: "Give me control of the finances of the world I care not who makes the laws" - A practical example of how this works for the international Zionists! :shifty:

heh... that's all just conspiracy theory. Be interesting to have a glimpse at their timetable... to have a fighting chance like :D

Brian d marge

29th January 2015, 19:44

Ukrainian MPs call on UN, NATO & PACE to recognize Russia as ‘aggressor state’ (http://rt.com/news/226743-ukraine-russia-aggressor-state/).

The same ones that the "land of the free" put in place

Didnt see that one coming

not

Stephen

Brian d marge

1st February 2015, 01:15

Well said Imran , well said

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/MPZPUom3d_M" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Stephen

oldrider

1st February 2015, 08:50

Well said Imran , well said Stephen

Adage: "When you don't know where you are going - how will you know when you get there?" - Imran has showed us they way and even why we are going! :niceone:

The international Zionists are so confident in the stupidity of the world that they fear not who knows their plans - Putin has called "check mate" for the moment! :wait:

This was unexpected but the Zionists will deploy the guns of America and NATO to try and crush Putin into submission! (Once their media has established a reason!)

The world will suffer their consequences once again in world wide conflict and their media and theater will convince the world that it was all Putin's fault! :kick:

The stupid world will believe the Zionist propaganda to the letter! :yes: . :corn:

mashman

2nd February 2015, 11:16

Obama openly admits 'brokering power transition' in Ukraine (http://rt.com/op-edge/228379-obama-power-transition-ukraine/)

oldrider

2nd February 2015, 13:49

Obama openly admits 'brokering power transition' in Ukraine (http://rt.com/op-edge/228379-obama-power-transition-ukraine/)

Obama is a lame duck president with no time left for anything - positive or negative - nothing left in the tank! - The world awaits AIPAC's next replacement! :wait:

Banditbandit

2nd February 2015, 14:36

Ukrainian bikinis

http://andrewmcmillen.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/ukraine_sunday_bikini.jpg

oldrider

2nd February 2015, 14:52

Ukrainian bikinis

Y'mean they are shooting at those! :scratch:

:confused: Didn't you mean this thread? http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/showthread.php/131224-Pics-that-make-you-jizz .. Bloody Maori - just can't take them anywhere! :laugh:

mashman

2nd February 2015, 15:12

Ukrainian bikinis

WMD's.........

awa355

3rd February 2015, 01:29

This seems to be a reasonably unbiased view on the Ukraine situation.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30278606

oldrider

3rd February 2015, 08:39

This seems to be a reasonably unbiased view on the Ukraine situation.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-30278606

That link didn't work - Note: BBC is not known for it's freedom or independence from Zionist controlled mainstream media!

mashman

3rd February 2015, 09:49

Ukraine run by 'miserable' Jews: rebel chief (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/26181460/ukraine-run-by-miserable-jews-rebel-chief/)

Brian d marge

3rd February 2015, 11:58

Ukraine run by 'miserable' Jews: rebel chief (https://nz.news.yahoo.com/a/-/world/26181460/new zealand-run-by-smiling-jewish-conservative-chief/)

fixed it for ya

SPman

3rd February 2015, 12:00

That link didn't work - Note: BBC is not known for it's freedom or independence from Zionist controlled mainstream media!
The BBC is fast descending into the realms of Fox News on it's coverage of national and international affairs.....

Brian d marge

3rd February 2015, 13:03

fixed it for ya
why did that link not change . . .

mashman

3rd February 2015, 13:20

why did that link not change . . .

I thought you meant to leave it, which actually made me chuckle... so I shall take my chuckle back until you've got your A into G.

SPman

3rd February 2015, 20:13

The Chief of Staff of Ukraine’s Armed Forces, General Viktor Muzhenko, is saying, in that news-report, which is dated on Thursday January 29th, that the only Russian citizens who are fighting in the contested region, are residents in that region, or of Ukraine, and also some Russian citizens (and this does not deny that perhaps some of other countries’ citizens are fighting there, inasmuch as American mercenaries have already been noted to have been participating on the Ukrainian Government’s side (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2576490/Are-Blackwater-active-Ukraine-Videos-spark-talk-U-S-mercenary-outfit-deployed-Donetsk.html)), who “are members of illegal armed groups,” meaning fighters who are not paid by any government, but instead are just “individual citizens” (as opposed to foreign-government-paid ones). General Muzhenko also says, emphatically, that the “Ukrainian army is not fighting with the regular units of the Russian army.”

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article40860.htm

So - how long before he's removed from his post..............

Lifting of sanctions?????? :laugh:

oldrider

3rd February 2015, 21:29

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article40860.htm

So - how long before he's removed from his post..............

Lifting of sanctions?????? :laugh:

Quote from that article: "If what General Muzhenko says is true, then he is a hero for having risked his entire career by having gone public with this courageous statement".

Certainly no puppet - simply telling it like it is obvious to anyone who makes an effort to try and understand the conflict - bet he doesn't see the year out! :facepalm:

America, NATO, UK, Western alliance, et al - :o . lying bastards! :yes:

Watch this space! :corn:

oldrider

5th February 2015, 10:56

By Eric Zuesse - Link:http://www.serendipity.li/zuesse.htm A lot of back up material if you want it!

Swoop

9th February 2015, 09:08

Putting some info out there for your reading pleasure.

8 February 2015: Westerners in Russia, especially those who speak and read Russian, report that state controlled Russian media has seemingly reverted to stories and attitudes right out of the Cold War. It is, in short, unreal but actually happening.
Russian media is full of stories of NATO aggression against Russia and anything that is going wrong in Russia is blamed on a NATO conspiracy to destroy Russia.
The Russian aggression in Ukraine is described as largely a fable created by a NATO conspiracy to take over the Ukrainian government and institute a terror campaign against the ethnic Russian minority in Ukraine, especially eastern Ukraine. There, the Russian media described ethnic Russians leading a rebellion against this NATO puppet government running Ukraine and NATO soldiers pretending to be Ukrainians doing most of the fighting. No captured NATO agents are presented which Russian media describes as proof of how clever and dangerous this NATO aggression is.

The reality is that Russian soldiers are regularly captured (dead and alive) and presented on Ukrainian TV but this is ignored and dismissed by Russian media as more insidious NATO propaganda. Those Russians familiar with their own history who point out the current government propaganda in Russia is similar to what went on in 1939 and 1941 are condemned as traitors.
But it is a fact that in 1939 the communist Soviet Union signed a peace treaty with Nazi government of Germany and overnight Germany went from threat to valued ally according to Soviet media. That switched again in mid-1941 when Germany broke the treaty and invaded the Soviet Union. But during the time the treaty was in force Russia invaded Poland, the Baltic States and Finland. Russia was defeated in Finland and only got control of some territory just across the border. But eastern Poland was seized (as part of the 1939 treaty, with Germany taking most of Poland) as were the three Baltic States (Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania)

Russia now ignores the fact that Poland and the Baltic States make no secret of the fact that they joined NATO to gain some real protection from renewed Russian aggression.
Some Baltic State leaders have been openly comparing Putin’s aggression to that of Stalin and Hitler before World War II.
Russians who agree with this, and the truth of the historical comparisons, are dismissed as misguided or traitors. The Russian government is officially very upset at these comparisons, insisting that they are only seeking to regain territory that is really theirs’ and lost due to foreign conspiracies (like World War II and the Cold War). Thus the official Russian explanation for all this fear of Russia is that it involves plots by NATO and the United States which strike Westerners as absurd but appeals to a lot of Russians. That’s what really makes Russia’s neighbours nervous. Too many Russians actually believe this frightening fairy tale.

Meanwhile Russian aggression in the Baltic has been increasing since mid-2014 and in some scary ways. NATO interceptors based in Poland and the Baltic States have been sent up more frequently because of a growing number of incidents of Russian military aircraft making unsafe flights over the Baltic Sea. These Russian warplanes were detected by NATO military radar, but had their transponders turned off and had not filed a flight plan with the air controllers who regulate air traffic over the Baltic. Some of the Baltic States use transponders only to track large aircraft and have no way of knowing where Russian aircraft with transponders turned off are. With no flight plan and transponders turned off these warplanes were invisible to flight controllers. This sort of thing risks collision with commercial aircraft and Russia has ignored criticism of this dangerous practice. NATO has responded by sending up interceptors, which do have their transponders on, to escort the Russian aircraft and give air traffic control radars something to identify and track. It’s not just the Baltic States either. In December a commercial aircraft taking off from a Swedish airport nearly collided with a Russian warplane flying in international airspace with its transponder turned off.

oldrider

9th February 2015, 09:45

Putting some info out there for your reading pleasure.

With respect - Have you recently taken a job with the IMF or the CIA? - Copybook USA NATO propaganda! I usually do get pleasure from your postings. :facepalm:

Swoop

9th February 2015, 12:32

That's why I said "putting it out there" as the info from Russian speakers is something you won't get in common media outlets.

With respect - Have you recently taken a job with the IMF or the CIA? - Copybook USA NATO propaganda! I usually do get pleasure from your postings. :facepalm:

How much are Christians in action paying these days? A new job could be fun & is it already BYO gun?

oldrider

9th February 2015, 12:56

That's why I said "putting it out there" as the info from Russian speakers is something you won't get in common media outlets.

How much are Christians in action paying these days? A new job could be fun & is it already BYO gun?

Soon as I read BRICS I knew Russia was going to get challenged - you would think they (USA) would have enough on their hands destabilising seven Muslim nations! :shifty:

Brian d marge

10th February 2015, 00:49

‘World-wide military conflict can still be averted' – President of Slovenia: http://youtu.be/oBdEE0SJugU

yokel

10th February 2015, 06:06

NATO are the aggressors, not Russia.

http://youtu.be/eW5HV69LKUs

http://youtu.be/x9z9jRybHGw

Brian d marge

10th February 2015, 06:20

Why does the USA continually blame Russia for everything in Ukraine?:https://www.youtube.com/watch?x-yt-cl=84503534&x-yt-ts=1421914688&v=HkYNpZcK9ws&feature=player_embedded

Now becoming just a bit too obvious! :shifty:
its been obvious since early 1916 . .

evsn earlier if one cares to look

vlad The impailer was a product of the overall plan

right must dash . , have green screen and some japanese to annoy

oldrider

12th February 2015, 19:22

Brian d marge

13th February 2015, 02:13

:rolleyes:

Keep repeating lies until they become accepted as fact!

hey its what the young ladies believe that is important ....... just hope one of em doesnt have a ruler with them at the time ....:Oops:

Stephen

mashman

13th February 2015, 07:47

Clear evidential claim of USA bullshit campaign against Russia: http://rinf.com/alt-news/editorials/evidence-now-conclusive-2-ukrainian-government-su-25-fighter-jets-shoot-malaysian-airliner-buk-missile-ground-shot-involved/ :corn: USA? - :rolleyes:

Keep repeating lies until they become accepted as fact! - Obama on Ukraine and Russia! :weird:

It's nice to see the u.s. creating custom for BRICS :shifty: Does this mean that Obama has committed a war crime? Or is it all on the Ukraine? Which court will convict them?

george formby

13th February 2015, 09:58

oldrider

13th February 2015, 10:38

Uh oh. Tanks rolling in (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/ukraine-crisis-scores-of-tanks-moved-into-eastern-ukraine-from-russia-last-night-as-leaders-fought-over-ceasefire-terms-kiev-claims-10041421.html), allegedly.

So Ukraine, NATO and USA "CLAIM" as always - they are determined to have their war come hell or high water!

Interesting but not something that I want to see happen - a war won't end well (for anyone except?) no matter what!

Paul Craig Roberts on the peace deal:http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2015/02/12/minsk-peace-deal-farce-sellout-paul-craig-roberts/

SPman

13th February 2015, 16:25

The Saker on the peace deal

So so far, let's sum this up. M2A was:

1) signed by a person with no authority
2) on behalf of a junta with no powers
3) it does not say a word about the main reason for the meeting in Minsk
4) it contains clearly impossible sections

How is that for a brilliant text?

In truth, there is a short section of the document which does contain one realistic elements: a ceasefire followed by a withdrawal of heavy weapons. That's it. The rest is nonsense. See for yourself

http://vineyardsaker.blogspot.com.br/2015/02/the-useless-agreement-which-everybody.html

oldrider

13th February 2015, 19:20

What was the name of that whiskey that was not whiskey? - "Claytons" - well - yes this peace deal has a definite Claytons feel to it! :mellow:

The USA and NATO will start making mischief again and blaming Russia - nothing will change - the USA will eventually have their war! :wait: Timing is everything! :corn:

That which is politically desirable and physically able shall be made financially possible - (when you control the finances of the world) - war "will" be done! :thud:

mashman

15th February 2015, 21:16

Russia shrugs off US envoy’s ‘evidence’ of Russian troops in Ukraine (http://rt.com/news/232391-military-twitter-russia-ukraine/)... they should call it the photoshop war.

oldrider

16th February 2015, 09:59

Hey - What was it that he was saying again?:https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=FFOjQLonyRw

Of course he does say lots of things doesn't he!:https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=8YWQX5Joa6Q

Remember the boast: " With control of world finance - we can afford to do anything we like" - Are they doing it? :yes::corn:

oldrider

17th February 2015, 20:22

“Russian Aggression”: The Big Lie Blasted Worldwide Ad Nauseam: http://www.globalresearch.ca/russian-aggression-the-big-lie-blasted-worldwide-ad-nauseam/5430391 .America! - would they lie to us? :scratch::killingme

flyingcrocodile46

21st February 2015, 19:56

Just in case the MSM fed cattle missed it..

Published on Feb 13, 2015
These pictures purported to show how Russia is intervening in Ukraine, and were used as evidence by US Senators who were pushing for lethal aid to be sent to Kiev. RT's Lizzie Phelan has the details of an incident which has left some red faces on Capitol Hill. RT is also joined by political writer John Wight. Read More: http://on.rt.com/zbp0t4

http://youtu.be/a0nCFOBCaZ4

SPman

22nd February 2015, 14:45

The Saker did a good summation of his analysis of events, a year after the Maidan.....he got most things right except for the resistance put up by the Donbass troops and the uselessness of most of the Ukraine troops. His analysis for the coming year.....

In conclusion I will just say that if I believe that all the horrors of the past year were fully avoidable, I also believe that the horrors of the next, upcoming, year are not: the Ukraine has plunged over the cliff and is now heading for the very same future as Libya (another western "success story"). I hope that I am wrong and that I am missing something crucial, but I personally do not see any way to stop the implosion of the rump-Ukraine and my advise to anybody still living there would be to get out while you can.

and if I hear any more radio "news" items about the gallant Ukraine troops and the nasty Russian invaders, I'll throw up!

oldrider

22nd February 2015, 15:37

The Saker did a good summation of his analysis of events, a year after the Maidan.....he got most things right except for the resistance put up by the Donbass troops and the uselessness of most of the Ukraine troops. His analysis for the coming year.....

and if I hear any more radio "news" items about the gallant Ukraine troops and the nasty Russian invaders, I'll throw up!

Here we go then - :puke: ----- :blip:

What was started in 1917 has never been completed - Putin's Russia and the Eastern Orthodox Church survived the ordeal and despite all are getting stronger! :shifty:

The descendants of the perpetrators of the Bolshevik revolution also really control America and world finance - they will have their war! :yes:

Putin keeps getting in their way like in Syria, Iran etc not to mention that audacious "BRICS" banking initiative! - They are not best pleased with Mr Putin! :no:

Brian d marge

23rd February 2015, 00:21

oldrider

23rd February 2015, 10:49

Why many favour Putin (the warmonger?) over Obama (the Nobel peace maker?) :http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2015/february/16/putin-heads-off-a-us-russia-war/

When you scrape away the cover of US/NATO/Ukraine lies the truth begins to struggle out of the manipulative debris and shine brightly through. :corn:

Interesting American blog site:http://www.moonofalabama.org/2015/02/ukraine-use-of-former-us-ambassadors-false-flag-offer-aborted.html

Swoop

23rd February 2015, 18:34

I'm so relieved to know that Comrade Putin is the good guy.
Thank fuck he is standing up for what he believes in.

Better get your buckets ready.

oldrider

23rd February 2015, 20:32

I'm so relieved to know that Comrade Putin is the good guy.
Thank fuck he is standing up for what he believes in.

Better get your buckets ready.

Cant argue against that - cant argue for it either - but something is wrong with all the bullshit we are getting fed from our Western leaders MSM etc! :shifty:

oldrider

23rd February 2015, 21:18

I'm so relieved to know that Comrade Putin is the good guy.
Thank fuck he is standing up for what he believes in.

Standing room only here then - for your entertainment: http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/12/putin911bomb/

Brian d marge

23rd February 2015, 23:17

Standing room only here then - for your entertainment: http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/12/putin911bomb/
hahahahahahahahahaaaa

if it is the truth

and one thing about the truth it always comes out

watch the media stamp all over this one

hahahahhaaaaaa

yokel

24th February 2015, 06:04

hahahahahahahahahaaaa

if it is the truth

and one thing about the truth it always comes out

watch the media stamp all over this one

hahahahhaaaaaa

yes the truth will come out, and it'll be all over ya face.
there's good reason why "terrorism" is in the news every fucking day,

<iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/pLJ8YNBXpH4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Swoop

24th February 2015, 09:36

Standing room only here then - for your entertainment: http://www.veteranstoday.com/2015/02/12/putin911bomb/

I await with baited breath.
Someone knows ahead of time, what Putin is going to reveal in an "earth shattering" revelation? Then posts' all about it on the interdweeb?

Hmm.

oldrider

24th February 2015, 10:59

I await with baited breath.
Someone knows ahead of time, what Putin is going to reveal in an "earth shattering" revelation? Then posts' all about it on the interdweeb?

Hmm.

The one good thing about time is that it generally reveals all but that just adds to your Hmmmm doesn't it?

carbonhed

24th February 2015, 18:28

Oh Man! The Ukrainians have murdered Sasha Grey after subjecting her to unspeakable nastiness. That there is a crime against fucking humanity!

I'm switching sides... Russia FTMFW!!!!

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2015/02/19/porn-star-sasha-grey-denies-bizarre-propaganda-murdered-ukraine-soldiers_n_6711200.html

flyingcrocodile46

24th February 2015, 19:08

That's nothing

Ukraine defense minister ‘claims’ Russia used nukes.... Twice

I wonder if he has 8 year old photos from White Sands to prove it?

http://rt.com/news/189420-ukraine-nuclear-strike-russia/

carbonhed

24th February 2015, 21:37

oldrider

25th February 2015, 11:14

This is getting old hat now but does go to show just how hard USA went to try and falsely convince the world that "Russia" was starting the war in Ukraine!

The behaviour of the US driven Western powers (NATO) has been despicable!:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWlAARb0fN4

oldrider

26th February 2015, 15:03

Ol'e Brother Nathanial - always has an interesting take on the situation in Ukraine:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2og3JU0yUIk

Apparently USA and NATO seem to be determined to make war with Russia! :weird: something we could all probably do without! :facepalm:

mashman

26th February 2015, 15:16

Sounds like the media is about to be filled with "Putin's moving to take the land-bridge to Crimea, quick, get him".

oldrider

26th February 2015, 16:00

Sounds like the media is about to be filled with "Putin's moving to take the land-bridge to Crimea, quick, get him".

Interesting (long) discussion with professor Stephen Cohen on Obama and Putin: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lak7UsnHkwo Quite surprising and revealing.

angle

28th February 2015, 12:02

Russian occupant (English subtitles):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T65SwzHAbes

awa355

1st March 2015, 22:27

If this doesn't say something about the Ukraine Govt. being a puppet govt, nothing ever will.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11410094

Swoop

2nd March 2015, 08:20

I wonder what information the ex-leader of the Russian opposition party had...

Edit: Oh. About to leak documentary evidence of Russian involvement in the Ukraine.

Brian d marge

2nd March 2015, 14:09

If this doesn't say something about the Ukraine Govt. being a puppet govt, nothing ever will.

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/business/news/article.cfm?c_id=3&objectid=11410094

Jaresko's first success in the job came this month when she clinched a promise for a $40 billion four-year lifeline from the International Monetary Fund and Western nations.

that fked a perfectly good country ..... oh well

watch the assets be stripped.... and the wealth move overseas.....

they will bring in user pays next !! hahahahahaa

Stephen

trustme

2nd March 2015, 15:18

Jaresko's first success in the job came this month when she clinched a promise for a $40 billion four-year lifeline from the International Monetary Fund and Western nations.

that fked a perfectly good country ..... oh well

watch the assets be stripped.... and the wealth move overseas.....

they will bring in user pays next !! hahahahahaa

Stephen

Hell yeah , they absolutely thrived under the Russians. Some people just don't know when they've got it good.

Brian d marge

2nd March 2015, 16:38

Hell yeah , they absolutely thrived under the Russians. Some people just don't know when they've got it good.

Compared to the arse raping they are going to get ,,,

Stephen

blue rider

2nd March 2015, 20:39

shit one can't make up

britain to send military advisors to the Ukraine..
http://russia-insider.com/en/military_politics_ukraine/2015/02/25/3871

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/feb/24/britain-to-send-military-advisers-to-ukraine-cameron

Canada might do the same

and of course the Yank is shit hot for some action cause they don't get any

http://rt.com/news/231439-ukraine-us-army-training/
http://russia-insider.com/en/military_ukraine/2015/02/26/3903

and they are gonna train soldiers cause they are so good at it...

http://rt.com/usa/225499-us-military-instructors-ukraine/

ya'll feel safer now? :laugh:

Brian d marge

2nd March 2015, 21:31

remember those poor young fellas for king and country and all that . . . were fed the same horse manure

even if they did realize they still went . .finished the job

speaks volumes for the type of people they were

i want to say honest brave decent . etc but the words are failing me

when i think of them it makes my blood boil that scum like shonkey is doing what he is doing

i hope that one day they will be held to account shylock and his ilk scum

no disrespect to actual pond life . . real scum on which animals feed . .

shonkey aint even worthy of that

stephen

Brian d marge

6th March 2015, 06:59

shoot some officials ,,,,

well said Ukraine

neuland ur a cunt

Stephen

oldrider

6th March 2015, 07:37

I wonder what information the ex-leader of the Russian opposition party had...

Edit: Oh. About to leak documentary evidence of Russian involvement in the Ukraine.

Or the CIA or Mossad etc thought it would help destabilize Russia and create extreme division!

Now that would be unusual for them to think and behave like that! - Wouldn't it? - Surely a first for them! :killingme

Swoop

6th March 2015, 09:21

Or the CIA or Mossad etc thought it would help destabilize Russia and create extreme division!

Now that would be unusual for them to think and behave like that! - Wouldn't it? - Surely a first for them! :killingme

Attempting to assassinate a party leader in the Kremlin? Most unlikely.
I'm sure that the experts here will be able to explain why all the Moscow police were conspicuous by their absence (very unusual) that night.
Remind me who putin worked for again?
Remind me of how many ex-employees of that workplace are now working for him?

oldrider

6th March 2015, 09:42

Swoop

6th March 2015, 15:03

Remind us again how much disinformation comes to us from the USA!

Remind us again the ratio of interference into other countries affairs by USA compared to any other country!

Far too much disinformation from the USA, along with every other country providing their own versions of "the truth". The same applies with interference. It's called politics.
There is no end to it.
Sadly.

oldrider

6th March 2015, 16:10

Far too much disinformation from the USA, along with every other country providing their own versions of "the truth". The same applies with interference. It's called politics.
There is no end to it.
Sadly.

Very true!

Politics?

What a strange wobbly version we have here - all interchangeable - all inter-reliant self focused and unidirectional - finding where to direct your vote is a mystery!

Kinda like shooting pool with a piece of soft rope!

Anyway - I do not claim to know for sure where Putin (really) fits but I can clearly see that the USA is run by AIPAC and Israel is the tail wagging the big USA dog!

Why on earth would Russia behave the way that USA NATO etc claims they are? - it makes no sense!

Why on earth would Iran break years of non aggressive tradition - as opposed to Israeli history of aggression - the way Netanyahu claims?

Who can we believe with any confidence? (RT seems to be the least biased MSM outlet)

This situation does not fill me with confidence for our (grand) children's future!

flyingcrocodile46

6th March 2015, 16:51

Attempting to assassinate a party leader in the Kremlin? Most unlikely.
I'm sure that the experts here will be able to explain why all the Moscow police were conspicuous by their absence (very unusual) that night.
Remind me who putin worked for again?
Remind me of how many ex-employees of that workplace are now working for him?

Take that analysis and apply it to the Kennedy assassinations.

The way they operate? Regime change is all about creating a void by removal of one party, so another (better trained and more effective) party can be shoe horned in. The last guy was a nice guy but wasn't making traction. We can speculate who best profits from it, but the best evidence will be evaluation of what the new boy does. Will he have big sharp teeth, or pussy lips and gums?

Who can we believe with any confidence? (RT seems to be the least biased MSM outlet)

I have caught RT using the exact same segment of a Putin interview in separate releases about two different topics with two entirely different translations. While I wouldn't disagree with your analysis, it's only because of the extremely poor choices provided by mainstream media.

Have no illusions and search widely if you want a chance to figure out what's fact from fiction. I look at lots of countries mainstream media sites and find the public comments are often more revealing than the official story. Israel is quite interesting like that. Lots of heartening stuff if you look for it.

Hans

7th March 2015, 11:47

Russian occupant (English subtitles):

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T65SwzHAbes

http://youtu.be/8mlOfvk02_Q

Brian d marge

12th March 2015, 00:43

17 billion

thats the Ukraine fked then

watch Monsanto move in !!!

Stephen

oldrider

12th March 2015, 10:10

17 billion

thats the Ukraine fked then

watch Monsanto move in !!!

Stephen

He who pays the piper calls the tune - have been calling it all along beneath the covers! - Who needs enemies when they have NATO/USA for friends? FFS! :oi-grr:

SPman

12th March 2015, 12:42

thats the Ukraine fked then

Ukraine unofficially has 272 percent inflation - The Washington Post

http://bread-circuses-today.blogspot.com.au/2015/03/ukraine-unofficially-has-272-percent.html

"It's hard to overstate how challenged Ukraine is. Its economy has actually shrunk since communism ended in 1991. Or since 1992. Or even 1993. That's because communism never really did end. Ukraine just traded party bosses for oligarchs"

Brian d marge

12th March 2015, 13:35

He who pays the piper calls the tune - have been calling it all along beneath the covers! - Who needs enemies when they have NATO/USA for friends? FFS! :oi-grr:

he who has the majority of the voting rights in the IMF calls the tune ...a tune that was composed by Shylock and his mates ...

Ukraine unofficially has 272 percent inflation - The Washington Post

http://bread-circuses-today.blogspot.com.au/2015/03/ukraine-unofficially-has-272-percent.html

"It's hard to overstate how challenged Ukraine is. Its economy has actually shrunk since communism ended in 1991. Or since 1992. Or even 1993. That's because communism never really did end. Ukraine just traded party bosses for oligarchs"

272 percent .....are we talking a collapsed currency here???? wonder what will happen when the petro dollar goes belly up ......

Stephen

MisterD

12th March 2015, 14:02

"It's hard to overstate how challenged Ukraine is. Its economy has actually shrunk since communism ended in 1991. Or since 1992. Or even 1993. That's because communism never really did end. Ukraine just traded party bosses for oligarchs"

...so the EU saw an opportunity to expand itself, the people were dead keen on the idea of an end to the corruption but Putin decided that a West-looking Ukraine was unacceptable and here we are.

oldrider

12th March 2015, 14:57

...so the EU saw an opportunity to expand itself, the people were dead keen on the idea of an end to the corruption but Putin decided that a West-looking Ukraine was unacceptable and here we are.

Putin? - Just someone to blame! :shifty:

angle

5th April 2015, 15:14

A short documentary about a former Ukrainian Army officer from Donetsk:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XBPU02yNhns

mashman

10th April 2015, 07:56

oldrider

10th April 2015, 09:23

Ukraine bans communism & Nazism, celebrates UPA nationalists as 'freedom fighters' (http://rt.com/news/248365-ukraine-bans-communism-nazism/)... :killingme @ban hammer irony. Ultra right whinge dipshits banning themselves.

All fine bi-products of the USA interfering in Ukraine politics to set NATO against Russia in order to weaken Russia and Russian backing of Syria Iran and Egypt etc!

Powerful influence over USA congress - maintains a destabilising and weakening influence over every Arab country surrounding Israel.

Domino's anyone? - check your world map - the West is being conned big-time! :corn:

oldrider

13th August 2015, 14:48

Comments question and reply following Leuren Moret video interview on U Tube. *

Quote:
Reverend Galileo 9 months ago
Okay, I am just curious. A commenter a while back "accused" you, Leuren, of never saying the "Z" (Zionism) word. What is the difference between Zionisim and the Jesuits? Or are they the same entity? I am going to research this on my own, but I'm just wondering what your take is.
· 1

Leuren Moret 9 months ago
Hello R. Galileo - thank you for your comment. The hierarchy has the Jesuits at the top (although I am certain there are layers above that) with ancient bloodlines from Parthian/Etruscan/Roman/Italian bloodlines at the very top - some of whom are Zorastrian/Mithra followers (Parthians) including Farnese (own the US Pentagon built of the design of the 16th century Villa Farnese former headquarters of the Jesuits and much of Wash. DC), Aldobrandini, Borgia, Gitti (run the banks) etc. These families have Popes in their history, Jesuits, and they run the wars for thousands of years. Below them there are the Zionists across the world who carry out their schemes and agendas, and below the Zionists are the Freemasons who protect the Jesuits and the Zionists. The Jesuits are not even Catholics or under the Pope - only the Superior General (Jesuits are a military organization) has direct official communications with the Pope. Zionists in this case do not refer to Jews, although people sometimes get confused, but Colin Powell stated very clearly that anti-Zionism does not mean anti-semetic. And now a few weeks ago Netanyahu stated that the Jews in Israel, and Ashkenaz Jews specifically, are not Semitic of from the Middle East - but are Turkic from Central Asia from the Khazar tribe. He also stated that the Jews are taking over Ukraine because its their traditional and tribal homeland. I don't know why they are hell bent on living in a region undergoing nuclear war at this moment - with depleted uranium used by both sides in the conflict. End of Quote.

*Interview video clip: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ya82ljQmoGc To those interested - this clip is worth looking at!

Swoop

4th September 2015, 18:39

3 September 2015: Since Russia first invaded Ukraine in early 2014 they have insisted that no Russian troops are involved. This was not true and embarrassing evidence kept coming from Russia. Earlier in 2015 Russia passed a new law that made data about soldiers killed in peace time a state secret. That meant any Russian who revealed these statistics or discussed them could be prosecuted. That worked for a little while.

Despite all those precautions a Russian business magazine (Delovaya Zhizn) recently published an article on pay for military personnel and one of the charts showed the number of soldiers who died (over 2,000) or were wounded (nearly 4,000) in Ukraine. This was part of a discussion on benefits paid to the families of dead soldiers or living, but wounded, ones. Russian government officials soon found out about this and the article (in Russian) disappeared from the visible Internet. But Google, as part of its effort to make everything quickly available to its billions of users worldwide keeps copies of just about everything in severs (caches) worldwide. Reporters asked Google to retrieve one of the cached copies of the Delovaya Zhizn article and now the Russian government is quite embarrassed.

What is surprising about these numbers is that they are larger than earlier estimates based on fragmentary data from some families of Russian soldiers killed in Ukraine and complaining on the internet about how the Russian government is trying to keep the presence of Russian troops in Ukraine a secret. Suffering over 6,000 casualties in 18 months indicates a large force and an unusually high casualty rate. For example the Russians lost 15,000 troops during the 1979-89 Russian fighting in Afghanistan. This was out of a force that averaged 150,000 troops. During that time at least 1.5 million Afghans also died from the Russian violence. Total deaths in eastern Ukraine so far are under 10,000, most of them civilians and largely because of indiscriminate shelling of civilian areas by Russian or pro-Russian rebels. Now it is know that, as many had already suspected (because a lot of the rocket and howitzer firing was from weapons across the border in Russia) that most of these casualties were the result of Russian efforts.

Note that during 14 years of American operations in Afghanistan fewer than 2,200 American troops died and fewer than 100,000 Afghan civilians (most at the hands of the Taliban and various outlaws). The American combat force in Afghanistan averaged fewer than 50,000 troops.

Since early 2014 Ukraine and the West have complained about the growing number of Russian troops in eastern Ukraine (Donbas) and the growing number of attacks by the Donbas “rebels” (often very obviously Russian soldiers wearing uniforms with national insignia removed). These accusations and the growing body of evidence was ignored by the Russian government and, if addressed at all, said to be fabricated. The official Russian line has always been that there are no Russian troops in Donbas except maybe some Russian volunteers and all those aerial and satellite photos of Russian weapons (especially stuff Ukraine never had) in Donbas are Ukrainian and Western fabrications.
The Delovaya Zhizn revelations will also be denied. Opinion surveys show that Russians, exposed to more and more pro-war propaganda are still supporting their government but that majority is shrinking. The government needs an economic victory or they will be undone by privation, not military conquest (which is put forward as the NATO goal in Eastern Europe, to succeed where Napoleon and Hitler did not). Meanwhile more Russian troops and heavy weapons arrive on the Ukrainian border and, in small numbers, drive into Donbas. But the Delovaya Zhizn news spread inside Russia as well and that’s one audience the Russian government is having a more difficult time controlling.

Katman

4th September 2015, 18:40

I'd almost forgotten what a little Western propaganda mouthpiece you are.

Swoop

4th September 2015, 18:42

I'd almost forgotten what a little Western propaganda mouthpiece you are.

I knew that post would stir up a few around here...

R650R

13th December 2022, 11:53

Bump for interesting perspective before media coverage of present times

1/32 man

13th December 2022, 15:01

I’ve heard of Ukraine but what is “the Ukraine “?

husaberg

20th December 2022, 18:37

Old mashams and Oldracists and katspams plus r65Rs posts in this thread have not dated well now have they....

R650R

28th December 2022, 10:18

10% survival chance five mins to decide!!!! This policy will rapidly be emptying the gulags. I say as part of any peace deal Russia should take western convicts into its system. It will be a win for everyone, they will get there labour for making licence plates and railway lines andcwestern society will jump up a few notches.

https://youtu.be/W2Okpg9KkgA

R650R

14th January 2023, 21:13

An interesting perspective..

https://youtu.be/lgAxMdW5Jik

R650R

6th February 2023, 09:30

Some more recent analysis. This disaster has been going on for nearly a year now despite our media telling us that Putin has cancer, has Parkinson’s disease, is running out of bombs, is going to be over thrown by either the people/oligarchs/military coup...

https://youtu.be/aOPfJ6sbMxc

husaberg

6th February 2023, 12:21

F5 Dave

10th February 2023, 21:11

husaberg

10th February 2023, 21:26

Jesus christ! Look at this nutjob. Hes fucking mad as a bag full of rabbits.

Pretty sure it was the rabies that made him scared of the rabbi's........

mashman

22nd February 2023, 13:06

And then someone makes that point that can't be argued against :killingme...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX_enNDY_Co

pritch

22nd February 2023, 14:05

And then someone makes that point that can't be argued against :killingme...

The guy asking the questions is being dishonest. Countries that did not previously want to be in NATO have applied to join since Putin invaded Ukraine.
They can see what is happening and they will be aware of the speeches made on Russian TV advocating invading other former soviet bloc countries.

Any country sharing a border with Russia in 2023 has cause to be nervous.

mashman

22nd February 2023, 17:12

The guy asking the questions is being dishonest. Countries that did not previously want to be in NATO have applied to join since Putin invaded Ukraine.
They can see what is happening and they will be aware of the speeches made on Russian TV advocating invading other former soviet bloc countries.

Any country sharing a border with Russia in 2023 has cause to be nervous.

Dishonest? Is that you Kirby?

Poland, Hungary, Bulgaria, Latvia, Lithuania and a few others.

"not one inch eastward" U.S. Secretary of State James Baker

husaberg

22nd February 2023, 17:54

And then someone makes that point that can't be argued against :killingme...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FX_enNDY_Co

Dishonest? Is that you Kirby?

Poland, Hungary, Bulgaria, Latvia, Lithuania and a few others.

"not one inch eastward" U.S. Secretary of State James Baker

Lets see back in reality.

One of the key issues that has arisen in connection with the events in Ukraine is NATO expansion into the East. Do you get the feeling that your Western partners lied to you when they were developing their future plans in Eastern Europe? Why didn’t you insist that the promises made to you – particularly U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s promise that NATO would not expand into the East – be legally encoded? I will quote Baker: “NATO will not move one inch further east.”

Mikhail Gorbachev:
The topic of “NATO expansion” was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. I say this with full responsibility. Not a singe Eastern European country raised the issue, not even after the Warsaw Pact ceased to exist in 1991. Western leaders didn’t bring it up, either. Another issue we brought up was discussed: making sure that NATO’s military structures would not advance and that additional armed forces from the alliance would not be deployed on the territory of the then-GDR after German reunification. Baker’s statement, mentioned in your question, was made in that context. Kohl and [German Vice Chancellor Hans-Dietrich] Genscher talked about it.

All you are doing is parroting pro putin propaganda.

pritch

23rd February 2023, 08:04

Dishonest? Is that you Kirby?

Poland, Hungary, Bulgaria, Latvia, Lithuania and a few others.

"not one inch eastward" U.S. Secretary of State James Baker

The first country that came to mind was Finland which has a long border with Russia, which has experienced Russian invasion, and which had no desire to join NATO - until Putin attacked Ukraine. Estonia has been mentioned in Russia as a potential target, so too Montenagro. Eastern European countries have cause to want a collective defence agreement.

pritch

23rd February 2023, 09:50

Until recently I hadn't even heard of Transnistria. A narrow strip of land between Moldova and Romania, it is not recognised as an independent state by any other country. The people though do not want to be a part of either neighbour and there have long been Russian troops based there.

Although tiny it has potential to be a pawn in Putin's power games. If you want to know more: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-wi0BJrKOwo

mashman

23rd February 2023, 15:34

The first country that came to mind was Finland which has a long border with Russia, which has experienced Russian invasion, and which had no desire to join NATO - until Putin attacked Ukraine. Estonia has been mentioned in Russia as a potential target, so too Montenagro. Eastern European countries have cause to want a collective defence agreement.

I got what you meant when you said "since Putin invaded Ukraine", but Matt Lee (pretty well respected really), who you said was being dishonest, was asking about the encroachment that led up to the 'invasion', hence the mini list provided... something many geopolitical commentators have quite soberly been pointing out for the last 30ish years as a very real possibility given the numerous warnings given over that time and the constant encroachment. Well, that day arrived about a year ago.

With regards to the fear over Russia and countries signing up coz scared of reds under beds. The countries you mention already had a guarantee in place in the form of "not one more inch". Stupidity tests that ad infinitum. No one had to request to join and NATO did not have to accept. If Russia had gone on a murderous bender without at least some form of justification, the rest of the world would have piled in a la Iraq. None of that can be the case and Russia is unfortunately justified with regards to some of what they're doing. That it turns into a clusterfuck is not a surprise given the wars that we've seen in our time and the outright lies that were used to justify them. Meh, everyone was warned. Expect the worse or get Zelensky to back down with regards to the 2 regions that requested THEIR preference for 'ownership'. No one truly gives a shit that these 2 regions asked for Russian patrionage, which is odd really, because isn't that what international laws are setup to address? It seems not.

husaberg

23rd February 2023, 16:09

With regards to the fear over Russia and countries signing up coz scared of reds under beds. The countries you mention already had a guarantee in place in the form of "not one more inch". Stupidity tests that ad infinitum. No one had to request to join and NATO did not have to accept. If Russia had gone on a murderous bender without at least some form of justification, the rest of the world would have piled in a la Iraq. None of that can be the case and Russia is unfortunately justified with regards to some of what they're doing. That it turns into a clusterfuck is not a surprise given the wars that we've seen in our time and the outright lies that were used to justify them. Meh, everyone was warned. Expect the worse or get Zelensky to back down with regards to the 2 regions that requested THEIR preference for 'ownership'. No one truly gives a shit that these 2 regions asked for Russian patrionage, which is odd really, because isn't that what international laws are setup to address? It seems not.

Just because you double down on a lie doesn't make it true. it just proves you intend to mislead people.

One of the key issues that has arisen in connection with the events in Ukraine is NATO expansion into the East. Do you get the feeling that your Western partners lied to you when they were developing their future plans in Eastern Europe? Why didn’t you insist that the promises made to you – particularly U.S. Secretary of State James Baker’s promise that NATO would not expand into the East – be legally encoded? I will quote Baker: “NATO will not move one inch further east.”

Mikhail Gorbachev:
The topic of “NATO expansion” was not discussed at all, and it wasn’t brought up in those years. I say this with full responsibility. Not a singe Eastern European country raised the issue, not even after the Warsaw Pact ceased to exist in 1991. Western leaders didn’t bring it up, either. Another issue we brought up was discussed: making sure that NATO’s military structures would not advance and that additional armed forces from the alliance would not be deployed on the territory of the then-GDR after German reunification. Baker’s statement, mentioned in your question, was made in that context. Kohl and [German Vice Chancellor Hans-Dietrich] Genscher talked about it.

FJRider

23rd February 2023, 16:58

With regards to the fear over Russia and countries signing up coz scared of reds under beds. The countries you mention already had a guarantee in place in the form of "not one more inch". Stupidity tests that ad infinitum. No one had to request to join and NATO did not have to accept. If Russia had gone on a murderous bender without at least some form of justification, the rest of the world would have piled in a la Iraq. None of that can be the case and Russia is unfortunately justified with regards to some of what they're doing. That it turns into a clusterfuck is not a surprise given the wars that we've seen in our time and the outright lies that were used to justify them. Meh, everyone was warned. Expect the worse or get Zelensky to back down with regards to the 2 regions that requested THEIR preference for 'ownership'. No one truly gives a shit that these 2 regions asked for Russian patronage, which is odd really, because isn't that what international laws are setup to address? It seems not.

They are NOT scared of "Reds under the beds" ... they ARE scared of Russian tanks and troops rolling down their streets. They ARE scared of Russian aircraft bombing their cities and buildings, roads and bridges, their Government buildings ... power stations ... and any other structure that might aid the invading troops to overun their country.

Those countries that applied for NATO Membership ... are justified in being a tad nervous about The Soviets intentions. You would be too ... if you lived there.

How would our government feel about the Southland (or Otago) region requesting they become part of Australia ??

Perhaps you should look up the (International) rules regarding the declaration of independence. It seems you haven't.

mashman

23rd February 2023, 17:22

They are NOT scared of "Reds under the beds" ... they ARE scared of Russian tanks and troops rolling down their streets. They ARE scared of Russian aircraft bombing their cities and buildings, roads and bridges, their Government buildings ... power stations ... and any other structure that might aid the invading troops to overun their country.

Those countries that applied for NATO Membership ... are justified in being a tad nervous about The Soviets intentions. You would be too ... if you lived there.

How would our government feel about the Southland (or Otago) region requesting they become part of Australia ??

Perhaps you should look up the (International) rules regarding the declaration of independence. It seems you haven't.

I know what they're scared of.

They are, just as they knew the potential consequences of joining NATO might be the inviting of what they were trying to prevent.

That's silly.

Yawn.

pete376403

23rd February 2023, 17:43

I know what they're scared of.

They are, just as they knew the potential consequences of joining NATO might be the inviting of what they were trying to prevent.

That's silly.

Yawn.

Joining NATO guarantees assistance and help. Not joining NATO only gets offers of assistance and help, to a degree. No matter how insane putin may be, he wont take a chance on invading a NATO member (especially now russias military has been shown up to be less than effective)

george formby

23rd February 2023, 18:07

This is an interesting watch, the Suwalki gap and Lithuania.

Not Ukraine, I know, nevertheless relevant.

https://youtu.be/CqqnYs-BSQI

mashman

23rd February 2023, 18:25

Joining NATO guarantees assistance and help. Not joining NATO only gets offers of assistance and help, to a degree. No matter how insane putin may be, he wont take a chance on invading a NATO member (especially now russias military has been shown up to be less than effective)

Yes, there is no guarantee that you'll get NATO forces if you're not a part of NATO. Makes perfect sense. However, a country is likely to receive the backing of more than just NATO members if they're not. Either way there'd be support if Russia was involved, just coz.

TheDemonLord

23rd February 2023, 18:25

If Russia had gone on a murderous bender without at least some form of justification, the rest of the world would have piled in a la Iraq.

It's amazing how much simply having ICBMs goes to providing a 'justification'.

pete376403

23rd February 2023, 20:35

Yes, there is no guarantee that you'll get NATO forces if you're not a part of NATO. Makes perfect sense. However, a country is likely to receive the backing of more than just NATO members if they're not. Either way there'd be support if Russia was involved, just coz.

Its more like a guarantee that, if not a member of NATO, you WONT get NATO forces. Just as what is happening in Ukraine - there has been some hardware assistance but no NATO boots on the ground. All of those non-NATO countries that might offer assistance, just coz - while nice, cannot offer the fire power that NATO has. If russia is invading, you want more than thoughts and prayers, you want things that go BOOM, delivered to the invaders front door.

mashman

23rd February 2023, 21:15

Its more like a guarantee that, if not a member of NATO, you WONT get NATO forces. Just as what is happening in Ukraine - there has been some hardware assistance but no NATO boots on the ground. All of those non-NATO countries that might offer assistance, just coz - while nice, cannot offer the fire power that NATO has. If russia is invading, you want more than thoughts and prayers, you want things that go BOOM, delivered to the invaders front door.

I guess my distinction wasn't clear enough. NATO has member states supply part/all of their armed forces for use by NATO. Pretty much every single one of those countries has been involved in some war, sometimes all of them, outwith any NATO involvement, and with the same lethal hardware. If Russia is invading there'll be lots of things flying through the air to clear the way before much else happens. As you say, thoughts and prayers won't really cut it in response, but neither does poking the bear help either.

FJRider

24th February 2023, 15:53

I know what they're scared of.

They are, just as they knew the potential consequences of joining NATO might be the inviting of what they were trying to prevent.

That's silly.

Yawn.

No ... you don't know at all.. The "Potential" of joining NATO is the "potential" having their old Uncle (Sam) joining the (possible) fracas on their side.

Would Putin really need that threat if he was actually WAS seriously looking at crossing those borders .. ?? I doubt it.

The Soviets are having enough issues getting enough troops to deal with his current military movements.

If Putin starts another invasion somewhere else ... it doubles the required supply lines ... and troop numbers that are already stretched.

But I doubt an invasion elsewhere is on the cards.

The announcement of a partial mobilization of Russian citizens in September was the first time since the invasion of Ukraine that Russian President Vladimir Putin’s approval rating had dipped significantly. According to a survey by the independent institute Levada Center, the approval of Putin in Russia rose once more in the following months, reaching 82 percent again in January. The invasion itself had boosted Putin’s popularity at home from around 70 percent to 83 percent in March 2022. The Russian president announced during his annual address yesterday that the country was exiting the New START nuclear non-proliferation treaty with the United States, the only pact on nuclear weapons regulation for the two countries.

The Russian state-controlled media pushing the narrative of a mission to "denazify" Ukraine and to return it to Russia where it historically belonged explains why Putin’s approval can stay so high despite the country now being extremely marginalized in the international community and enduring the hardships of sanctions and war mobilization. Despite the surveys carried out by an independent researcher, Russians might still feel pressured to give a favorable opinion of the head of state due to the oppressive system they live in.

Putin's popularity with the Soviet population ... maybe with some degree of uncertainty with what their non-support could lead to ... but it gives him the ability to continue with the returning of Soviet territory to Rodina.

If he achieves that ... the awarding on the title Hero of the Russian Federation awaits.

mashman

24th February 2023, 18:37

No ... you don't know at all..

Ok then. You're right.

F5 Dave

24th February 2023, 19:36

Dadpole

25th February 2023, 09:17

I note that to show solidarity with Ukraine, Mr. Fothergill's Seeds is renaming the Giant Russian sunflower to Giant Single. :facepalm:

https://www.mrfothergills.co.nz/mrf-sunflower-giant-single.html

Shades of the idiocy of First World War renaming policy.

As an aside: My wife has been re-reading (since school days) Orwells '1984'. I keep hearing mutterings of "How could he know"

mashman

25th February 2023, 16:42

Jesus Krist. From FJs quote of mushed We can see the callous opinion of human life.

It's abhorrent. Fuck sake man. Can you not understand these people are being killed for trying to protect their own country? You are a nasty piece of shit. How fucking dare you?

Just read that out to my Wife and my 15 year old. They say that you're wrong on every count... after sitting there stunned that someone can not only be so utterly wrong about a human, but also be a total and utter cunt about just how sure they are.

I Will pray that God gives you the strength to stop drinking and posting utter bollocks... but I fear you're on your own in this one Dave. <3

FJRider

26th February 2023, 08:03

Jesus Krist. From FJs quote of mushed We can see the callous opinion of human life.

It's abhorrent. Fuck sake man. Can you not understand these people are being killed for trying to protect their own country? You are a nasty piece of shit. How fucking dare you?

Welcome to the real world.

BUT ... closer to YOUR world ...

Many New Zealander's are killing their own families ... or complete strangers on OUR roads. Just because they want to get where they're going a bit quicker. The scenes of the crash sites are in the Newspapers ... in TV ... and in the various Facebook "News" forums. Does anybody really give a toss ??? Nope ... they just ignore it. It couldn't happen to them.

Is the annual road toll dropping ... or at least staying constant each year .. ??? So far ... 22 people have died on the roads.

And it's only February.

What have YOU done (or said) to stop the needless deaths in this country.

Nothing ... ??

Berries

26th February 2023, 09:23

22?

Fake news you commie, it is in the mid 50's already.

I see dead people (https://www.transport.govt.nz/statistics-and-insights/safety-road-deaths/)

husaberg

26th February 2023, 11:15

https://thefacts.nz/wp-content/uploads/2022/11/theFacts_Road_Deaths_in_New_Zealand_Per_Capita_199 1_to_2022-1-1200x1204.png

TheDemonLord

26th February 2023, 18:21

From the Graph then - the question becomes - what happened in 2012/2013?

eldog

27th February 2023, 20:17

From the Graph then - the question becomes - what happened in 2012/2013?

Imports? Or Exports.

really need to see the population total overlaid.

what would it look like if we took out the main population areas. Are more people killed in the country?

One of the guys at work witnessed a driver recently who lost his head, not driving to conditions.:brick:

i have been doing my bit keeping the road safe, staying off it as much as possible. Been seeing so many bad decisions and bad aggressive driving lately.....

who was it who who said Statistics, statistics, statistics, you could make anything out of statistics?

husaberg

27th February 2023, 20:40

Imports? Or Exports.

really need to see the population total overlaid.

what would it look like if we took out the main population areas. Are more people killed in the country?

One of the guys at work witnessed a driver recently who lost his head, not driving to conditions.:brick:

i have been doing my bit keeping the road safe, staying off it as much as possible. Been seeing so many bad decisions and bad aggressive driving lately.....

who was it who who said Statistics, statistics, statistics, you could make anything out of statistics?

Its deaths per capita so its expressed as a ratio to the total regardless of changes in population
The trend is downwards, the individual years are largely irrelevant.
At its then record low some years ago, the fuel price was very high so speeds and km were down, The give way rule changed interlocks and harsher drunk driver penalties.
You also likely have an effect from an increased driver license age zero alcohol tolerance on under 21's or whatever it was. which was at a similar time.
To be fair the vehicles are safer every year as well.
but from 1991 to now the rate that die per capita has halved.

TheDemonLord

28th February 2023, 06:39

Its deaths per capita so its expressed as a ratio to the total regardless of changes in population
The trend is downwards, the individual years are largely irrelevant.

Until after 2013, when the trend starts to tick upwards.

At its then record low some years ago, the fuel price was very high so speeds and km were down, The give way rule changed interlocks and harsher drunk driver penalties.
You also likely have an effect from an increased driver license age zero alcohol tolerance on under 21's or whatever it was. which was at a similar time.

Interesting possibilities - but it doesn't actually answer the question.

Certainly fuel costs and KM driven are a factor - if the fuel price is high, then the only people that can afford long trips are (generally) those who have sufficient disposable income, and they tend to be driving late-model cars with the latest and greatest safety features.

but the other things mentioned, appear to have negligible effect, since they have remained in place and the trend has gone upwards.

It seems that Government regulation has little to no impact.

One thing that I'd like to see overlaid would be road condition(s) - I suspect that some of the trend upwards has a causal relationship to the fact our roads are falling apart.

To be fair the vehicles are safer every year as well.

Indeed, but then that doesn't account for the upward trend since 2014 then.

R650R

17th April 2023, 18:19

Via WION news... Ukraine ally Poland along with Hungary have banned/placing tariffs on Ukraine food crops like wheat and sugar etc. apparently with Black Sea route buggered bulk export food crops are being dumped in Western Europe.
Who’d have though too much food was a problem, well the local farmers do as it’s smashing prices down. So Polish and Hungary govts taking action.
Quite bizarre during a time of war, giving away millions in weapons but won’t subsidise own farmers

R650R

27th April 2023, 13:33

Apparently Zelensky has been on the blower with the Chinese and he wasn’t ordering any sweet and sour pork either.
It seems like the Chinese are going to broker a peace deal with China offering to rebuild Ukraine infrastructure. The Chinese people like to do business and they need Ukraine fixed as a gateway to Europe for a high speed rail link in the one belt one road initiative.
If it all goes well it’s the end of American international power in terms of dictating outcomes.
Interesting times ahead.

husaberg

27th April 2023, 17:44

husaberg

24th May 2023, 20:41

https://scontent.fchc2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/348846227_177593071926669_6084793856015722071_n.jp g?_nc_cat=104&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=KdHOsWY_mhIAX8aZ9dr&_nc_ht=scontent.fchc2-1.fna&oh=00_AfBi9EWFo-S0XNma1HRFB7fLkqbMA1HcyXKvIFXLKAkdvQ&oe=6472FA43
https://scontent.fchc2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/348675542_547250164283822_907240116359457770_n.jpg ?_nc_cat=105&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=730e14&_nc_ohc=mvbiC5k2b2EAX_w_iAV&_nc_ht=scontent.fchc2-1.fna&oh=00_AfAfP51ONSV45Oz3GUPuHak2CLBox9hqMaLEsAv92yC1 mg&oe=64723ED2

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2023/5/23/attacks-in-russias-belgorod-what-we-know-so-far

pritch

31st May 2023, 09:52

There has been a serious development, Moscow has been attacked by multiple drones. Putin says the drones were operated by the Ukranian military. If true, that's not a good look. It would imply the drones flew undetected across a few hundred kilometres of Russian territory. Or alternatively it could suggest Ukranian special forces are operating near Moscow. Neither reflects well on Russian defences.

Another possibility is that the drones were operated by non-state actors. A less likely option is that the drones were operated by dissident Russians.

It's not impossible that this is a Russian propaganda ploy.

We may find out the truth. Or we may not.

pzkpfw

31st May 2023, 12:43

From what I've read they were not long range drones, so would have been launched from within Russia.

The funny part is Putin (and thus Russian news) talking about "terrorism" by Ukraine, which of course already has thousands of homes, schools, hospitals ... that were blasted by Russia.

R650R

31st May 2023, 18:54

NATO has already told Ukraine off for the Belgirod affair, they can’t have Zelenskyy going off script and doing his own battles. Stolenberg has withdrawn nato support.

The real danger now is Poland is seeking to occupy western Ukraine as some kind of peacekeeper mission. This will be a disaster for everyone as it’s basically the Berlin Wall mark II.

It’s time for a negotiated peace but America doesn’t want that.

husaberg

31st May 2023, 20:41

Pursang

31st May 2023, 21:11

TheDemonLord

1st June 2023, 07:48

On the Drone attack - it seems to have been quite the cunning move.

It is not a problem - it is a Dilemma.

If you ignore the Drone threat, then the potential is that they will be able to do more effective strikes in the future.
If you don't ignore it, you need to pull men/equipment/resources in order to defend against it.

Brilliant move on the Ukraine's part.

pritch

1st June 2023, 09:12

It’s time for a negotiated peace but America doesn’t want that.
There is no need for a negotiations. All that's needed is for the Russians to go back to Russia.

R650R

1st June 2023, 16:53

There is no need for a negotiations. All that's needed is for the Russians to go back to Russia.

No dispute ends without negotiation give and take. Ukraine is in the fortress position. History does not favour that style of warfare. Continuing this war is just needlessly condemning people to death.
Russia has announced the war could go on for decades with coupe years of peace in between skirmishes.
This is like the tv show neighbours at war. There will continue to be needless destruction until an authority figure negotiates some kind of peace.

R650R

1st June 2023, 16:55

Unattributed Opinion .. worth what we paid for it!

I offer a full money back guarantee on all my free advice

Motorman Jerry Paladino - Ride like a Pro

pritch

1st June 2023, 22:02

No dispute ends without negotiation give and take. Ukraine is in the fortress position. History does not favour that style of warfare. Continuing this war is just needlessly condemning people to death.
Russia has announced the war could go on for decades with coupe years of peace in between skirmishes.
This is like the tv show neighbours at war. There will continue to be needless destruction until an authority figure negotiates some kind of peace.

Nah. Traditionally surrender has been an option. No negotiations much at all.

History hasn't seen much of this kind of warfare. We are inventing new types. The Irish "troubles" for instance. The first time in history one side had to give the other side a free shot.

Ukraine is fighting with one hand behind their back. Tradition suggests they should be doing to Russian cities what the Russians have been doing to theirs but that would be too scary. Personally I think that's a mistake. The Russian population had no idea what was going on. Young Russians in Ukraine could not convince their parents what was actually happening. The parents believed Putin's propaganda and thought their kids were mistaken. Now that large numbers of their sons have been shipped home in body bags the penny might be starting to drop. Hopefully somebody will decide Russia needs a new president.

TheDemonLord

2nd June 2023, 08:20

Ukraine is fighting with one hand behind their back. Tradition suggests they should be doing to Russian cities what the Russians have been doing to theirs but that would be too scary. Personally I think that's a mistake. The Russian population had no idea what was going on. Young Russians in Ukraine could not convince their parents what was actually happening. The parents believed Putin's propaganda and thought their kids were mistaken. Now that large numbers of their sons have been shipped home in body bags the penny might be starting to drop. Hopefully somebody will decide Russia needs a new president.

I think Tradition more suggests that engaging in all-out warefare against a Nuclear power is a massive risk.

I also don't think that Ukraine is fighting with one hand behind their back - I'm not sure they have the manpower and resources for a counter-offensive into a Russia. Yet.

pzkpfw

2nd June 2023, 10:00

... The Russian population had no idea what was going on. Young Russians in Ukraine could not convince their parents what was actually happening. The parents believed Putin's propaganda and thought their kids were mistaken. Now that large numbers of their sons have been shipped home in body bags the penny might be starting to drop. Hopefully somebody will decide Russia needs a new president.

There are some claims that's what the drone attacks on Moscow were for. Cause some trouble where plenty of cameras are, and plenty of people who will share the pictures on social media. Basically, get some news to the population - past the Russian censorship and propaganda.

(And also, somewhere away from where the ethnic minorities that bear the brunt of the fighting come from.)

pritch

2nd June 2023, 11:24

There are some claims that's what the drone attacks on Moscow were for.

Drones as used in Ukraine are interesting. Ukraine wanted cluster bombs, the US has them in storage but they are illegal now. Consequently the Americans were not keen to supply them.

Ukraine doesn't want to use them as cluster bombs though, they want to disassemble them and remove the bomblets. They want to drop the bomblets from their drones. Clever stuff.

pzkpfw

2nd June 2023, 11:42

husaberg

2nd June 2023, 20:26

Drones as used in Ukraine are interesting. Ukraine wanted cluster bombs, the US has them in storage but they are illegal now. Consequently the Americans were not keen to supply them.

Ukraine doesn't want to use them as cluster bombs though, they want to disassemble them and remove the bomblets. They want to drop the bomblets from their drones. Clever stuff.

The Russians were using cluster bombs in Syria they showed a video on RT then had to delete it later.:niceone:
http://www.stopclustermunitions.org/en-gb/cluster-bombs/use-of-cluster-bombs/in-syria.aspx

Convention on Cluster Munitions - Wikipedia
According to Cluster Munition Monitor 2022, the list of 16 countries that refuse to sign the convention and produce cluster munitions included Brazil, China, Egypt, Greece, Iran, Israel, India, North Korea, Pakistan, Poland, Romania, Russia, Singapore, South Korea, the United States and Turkey.

The difference is USA and other's unlike Russia dont tend to use them or thermobaric bombs on civilians .

R650R

3rd June 2023, 07:37

Drones as used in Ukraine are interesting. Ukraine wanted cluster bombs, the US has them in storage but they are illegal now. Consequently the Americans were not keen to supply them.

Ukraine doesn't want to use them as cluster bombs though, they want to disassemble them and remove the bomblets. They want to drop the bomblets from their drones. Clever stuff.

In his book about Iraq, tank commander colonel MacGregor describes cluster bombs as a nightmare to use in combat. This is due to a high failure rate among the multiple bombleys within a cluster. So you suppress the enemy but as you advance through area you lose tracks off vehicles and take out your own infantry on foot. It was so bad he eventually started going around those areas.
Whether or not the failure rate is same with drone Mount individual remains to be seen.
Post war civilians mostly children are injured playing with them.

R650R

3rd June 2023, 07:50

I think Tradition more suggests that engaging in all-out warefare against a Nuclear power is a massive risk.

I also don't think that Ukraine is fighting with one hand behind their back - I'm not sure they have the manpower and resources for a counter-offensive into a Russia. Yet.

What gets me is the continual announcement on mainstream media in advance of coming counter strikes and battle plans. It’s almost as if they’d like the Russians to know anything they might not have realised themselves.
Man power wise they have lost nearly half their population according to experts whether through conflict or escape to other countries. Russians have population base to keep grinding a war of attrition which is what is going on. This is Afghanistan mkIII

In the background we have chatter about war with China. Truth is west has about enough conventional weapons to wage full warfare for a week then out of resources. The Chinese would win based on population base and mindset, a couple million dead is no big deal to them.

In the west we are delusional about our strength. Post Vietnam the USA has consistently only battled with less than peer adversary’s and still stuffed it up often. Even the Wagner chief compliments Ukraine’s fighting spirit but war is a numbers game.

R650R

3rd June 2023, 07:58

Nah. Traditionally surrender has been an option. No negotiations much at all.

History hasn't seen much of this kind of warfare. We are inventing new types. The Irish "troubles" for instance. The first time in history one side had to give the other side a free shot.

Ukraine is fighting with one hand behind their back. Tradition suggests they should be doing to Russian cities what the Russians have been doing to theirs but that would be too scary. Personally I think that's a mistake. The Russian population had no idea what was going on. Young Russians in Ukraine could not convince their parents what was actually happening. The parents believed Putin's propaganda and thought their kids were mistaken. Now that large numbers of their sons have been shipped home in body bags the penny might be starting to drop. Hopefully somebody will decide Russia needs a new president.

We should be careful of what we wish for, we could end up with someone even more hardline in power. I’m sure Russian families feel sadness of war losses as much as any western families would. But they also know what an American puppet state/NATO base on their border would mean.
We got all upset here just about the prospect of China having bigger influence in Fiji and other pacific islands. It’s the same exact thing but without the big expanse of water.
Russians are quite a conservative society, after everything they went through under peristroika reforms I don’t think they are keen for change. There’s prob a limited appeal to the idea of standing in breadlines again….

husaberg

3rd June 2023, 09:18

. Russians have population base to keep grinding a war of attrition which is what is going on. This is Afghanistan mkIII

.
The Russians lost against Afghanistan as there own people were sick of there kids needlessly dying in another country fighting a war and the sanctions against the USSR were crippling them

pete376403

3rd June 2023, 09:44

The Russians lost against Afghanistan as there own people were sick of there kids needlessly dying in another country fighting a war and the sanctions against the USSR were crippling them

Similar in a way to USA /Vietnam. Not a popular war with the public and the financial costs were, if not crippling, then extreme. And Russia will (probably) loose in Ukraine for the same reasons. What major wars in recent (last hundred years or so) have been won by the country that started them? Being attacked is a compelling way of getting the populace onside with the government as well as allied countries.

husaberg

3rd June 2023, 10:34

Similar in a way to USA /Vietnam. Not a popular war with the public and the financial costs were, if not crippling, then extreme. And Russia will (probably) loose in Ukraine for the same reasons. What major wars in recent (last hundred years or so) have been won by the country that started them? Being attacked is a compelling way of getting the populace onside with the government as well as allied countries.

Yip same with Iraq and the yanks, i believe they lost the same amount of people in the open war as they did in the first month of occupation.
you can easily win a war when the combatant is weaker when you are fighting each other on equal terms but if the other side is not wearing a uniform and then blends back into the civilian population uses hit and un guerilla tactics or terrorist bombs etc has the support of the native population the invader can never really win unless they remove the population completely like the Germans tried to do with Poland.
In the Ukraine the people defending their country are far more motivated as its their own country the Russians on the other hand are conscripted against their will, fighting a war that means nothing to them but everything to those they are fighting against.

The yanks with Afghanistan and USSR like the Russians did with Vietnam supplied the resistance extensively with expensive weapons to even out the odds.
stinger missiles in 1986 Sams and rpgs in 1962....
Three of the first four Stingers fired each took down a Mil-24D helicopter gunships deployed by the Soviets to enforce their control over Afghanistan.
The stingers cost (at cost price for the US govt) $36000 each in 1986.
the av income in USD then for an Afghani was about 800usd. That's 45 peoples full earnings for a entire year.

R650R

25th June 2023, 08:12

Well so much for the coup everyone’s being waiting for….

https://i.stuff.co.nz/world/europe/300913399/live-putin-vows-to-crush-rebellion-as-wagner-mercenaries-seize-military-sites

My moneys on the Wagner chief being served up a big Mac with a side of polonium at a future lunch date….
I hope Jacinda was watching all this, smart people turned around a private battle hardened army of 25,000 people with nothing to lose by merely accepting a form of dialogue was needed.

Of course it could all be a well managed psy-op by Putin tricking Ukraine fresh reinforcements to charge into another bahut style trap…

husaberg

10th July 2023, 10:27

R650R

2nd June 2025, 14:14

Game changer or WW3 and mushroom clouds time???

In a massive Pearl Harbour type surprise attack drones have damaged or destroyed about 40 long range strategic bombers deep inside Russia.

The analyst says this was a long term operation taking 18 months with drones secretly built inside Russia territory then launched from cargo trucks near airbase with fibre optic guidance so they couldn’t be jammed.

In the past all superpowers have regarded an attack on nuclear capable assets as start of WW3, let’s hope the Aurora is the only bright lights we see in sky tonight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z86eHptMB4

TheDemonLord

2nd June 2025, 15:42

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2z86eHptMB4

I've always liked Mover's analysis.

Pursang

2nd June 2025, 23:40

It's Not a Game!
356339

pritch

3rd June 2025, 11:15

the invader can never really win unless they remove the population completely like the Germans tried to do with Poland.

Or like the Israelis are currently doing in Palestine.

husaberg

3rd June 2025, 18:18

Or like the Israelis are currently doing in Palestine.

Well that's what happens with that tit for tat, eye for an eye biblical stuff. Its a zero win scenario.
I am sure if that was the aim it would have been finished with long ago. The cards are well stacked in Israels favour.
Russia like Germany was in Poland/Ukraine is actively and purposely engaging in targeting civilians.
but you could also suggest the poms and the Brits did this too in WW2 even if they were targeting the factory areas and transport hubs they still knew that they would destru hundreds and thousand s civilians
where as, with Israel, the Palestinians happen to purposely build "military facilities in built up areas" and fire rockets from schools yards or hospital grounds etc etc. I don't see any other country doing this.
Its a zero win scenario. The Israelis leadership do themselves zero favours as they cant ever seem to be restrained enough. Instead they engage in massive retaliation to any provocations. Thus tend to play into the Palestinians terrorists aims.

People also have pretty short memories of what Hamas did when they took over in Gaza. That was genocide. Just like the Balkans was.

The Palestine population has grown far faster then NZ to now out populate us from starting from one million or some people 60 years ago to over 5 million now.
Its a zero win senario.

TheDemonLord

4th June 2025, 13:45

So - on the recent Drone strike - I have seen some discussion as to whether or not this was a War crime - and I found the discussion interesting.

The argument is along the lines that this was a War Crime because it was using a weapon disguised as a Civilian Truck/Shipping Container.

I personally don't think it is a War Crime - but because I am me I did a bit of reading on it.

Specifically, this article (https://digital-commons.usnwc.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1409&context=ils)

where it talks about the legality of disguising objects as civilian items as a legitimate Ruse - but then talks about the specific instance - how it was not near a Military base.

However, I also read about Sailing under False Colours - which is a valid ruse so long as the correct colours are shown before the attack commenced.

If one is so inclined to consider a shipping container/truck to be a civilian item, then I would say this is the same as the Royal navy Q-Ships pretending to be merchant vessels - perhaps one could argue that the Trucks ought to have flown the Ukrainian flag before the attack commenced for it to be all above board - but I think this is a minor quibble - especially because of the above article:

According to Rogers, “in the first case the tank crew do not feign protected status at all; in the second, the soldier lures the adversary into danger by pretending to have the protected status of someone hors de combat.”

Solis takes a similar position, claiming that:

the wearing of the ubiquitous camouflage field uniform is not perfidy. Although the camouflaged soldier hopes to kill, wound, or capture the enemy, his wearing of camouflage does not involve any assurance of protection under LOAC

Anyways - I found it interesting.

Katman

4th June 2025, 14:02

However, I also read about Sailing under False Colours - which is a valid ruse so long as the correct colours are shown before the attack commenced.

How would you classify the actions of a soldier dressing in the uniform of the enemy in order to infiltrate their line so he could then shoot them in the back?

TheDemonLord

4th June 2025, 14:28

How would you classify the actions of a soldier dressing in the uniform of the enemy in order to infiltrate their line so he could then shoot them in the back?

It depends.

Using disguises to commit espionage or sabotage are explicitly fair game. Some sources even talk about that a Saboteur, in a false uniform may be entitled to use lethal force, without comitting a War Crime.

However, there is a lot of opinion and it is divided.

It *seems* to be that if the Sabateur has been made (e.g. recognized as an enemy combatant) - then because the enemy are no longer decieved - they can attack.

However, targetted assassinations do not have such a protection.

I must also stress that going about in disguise means you forfeit certain protections as an Armed combatant - for example, Spies are allowed to be summarily executed.

It's all wonderfully grey and murky that makes for a cracking good read.

Katman

4th June 2025, 14:37

It depends.

Using disguises to commit espionage or sabotage are explicitly fair game. Some sources even talk about that a Saboteur, in a false uniform may be entitled to use lethal force, without comitting a War Crime.

However, there is a lot of opinion and it is divided.

It *seems* to be that if the Sabateur has been made (e.g. recognized as an enemy combatant) - then because the enemy are no longer decieved - they can attack.

However, targetted assassinations do not have such a protection.

I must also stress that going about in disguise means you forfeit certain protections as an Armed combatant - for example, Spies are allowed to be summarily executed.

It's all wonderfully grey and murky that makes for a cracking good read.

In this particular instance, he won a Victoria Cross for it.

TheDemonLord

4th June 2025, 15:33

In this particular instance, he won a Victoria Cross for it.

Clive Hulme?

Katman

4th June 2025, 18:27

Clive Hulme?

Yeah, when Joachim Peiper did it, it was a war crime.

But when Clive Hulme did it he was awarded our highest decoration.

Go figure.

TheDemonLord

4th June 2025, 19:00

Yeah, when Joachim Peiper did it, it was a war crime.

But when Clive Hulme did it he was awarded our highest decoration.

Go figure.

I'm not uniquely familiar with either situation.

Katman

4th June 2025, 19:08

I'm not uniquely familiar with either situation.

I have no doubt you'll remedy that.

- but because I am me I did a bit of reading on it.

pritch

9th June 2025, 09:37

Ukraine has pulled of another stunning drone attack. A train carrying military equipment also included some wagons for carrying grain. The latter opened to allow drones to launch. The drones first attacked and stopped the engine then systematically destroyed the tanks and armoured vehicles.

The comments at the top of this item reflect the view of a Russian.
https://countylocalnews.com/breaking/2025/06/07/ukraines-daring-drone-assault-military-train-obliterated/

husaberg

9th June 2025, 17:23

pritch

11th June 2025, 13:38

It seems Russian losses of armour have been such that the Russians are now resorting to using motorcycles. The best use of the bikes would be to head east at speed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RXBPe1IBFNU