IMPORTANT - Submission To The Government

**James Deuce** · 3rd October 2009, 15:28

Originally Posted by dpex

Personally, I think your Mum spent far too much time telling you you were special. Individuals hold no power in a Democracy. The key to preserving rights is organisation, a solid support base, lots of money, and a genial mode of operation.

Two points. The first being, my mother made both Atilla The Hun, and Vlad The Impaler look like pussycats who never spoke, only screamed. Good stuff. Served to toughen me up.

Second, this site does not have the space available for me to list the number of individuals who have made a small to a huge difference.

But what fascinates me about you, "What's the point submitting," lot is, 'Why not? What have you got to lose?' Or are you so inarticulate that you simply can't craft a half-readable letter?

There is no point making submissions as individuals. I've been involved in motorcycle "politics" in the past and I simply can't be bothered being involved ever again for the simple reason that human beings, motorcyclists in particular, cannot seem to understand that a simple message delivered by a collective of 1000s has vastly more impact than an unplanned letter writing campaign (usually APPALLINGLY badly written) pushing 1000s of indivdual barrows.

A managed campaign, fronted by rational well-presented individuals, rather than bearded, greasy, smelly, umkempt, shouting loonies demanding "rights" over other road users could easily insert motorcycles into the transport plan. That's all we need to do for a start. At the moment they are perceived as lethal toys and excluded from transport planning altogether.

I can write submissions. They are thoroughly pointless without any political weight behind them. Motorcyclists laud individuality over everything, but are incredibly inflexible in their approach to ever organising and achieving anything. The social framework has changed since the '60s. Successful partnerships by NGOs with Governments are achieved by actively seeking middle ground and creating an understanding around which both parties can work.

Every, and I mean EVERY "protest" action by motorcyclists in New Zealand for the last 25 years has done nothing to change public and political perception of motorcyclists. They amount to some untidy bush shirt wearing mongrel popping up on telly, growling unintelligibly, and then leading a ride on Parliament. Which achieves nothing but another increment in the entropic destruction of the Universe.

The feeling I have from following this thread is that rather than "motorcycling" engaging in a constructive manner with the transport planners, accident insurers, and the people cleaning up "our" (perception is everything) mess, "we'd" much rather go on a character assasination programme targetting other Kiwis doing the stuff that they enjoy to divert attention away from the perception that motorcyclists are at the head of the irresponsible idiots queue.

I've been looking around at the world at fatality stats and they all show a similar pattern. A doubling of registered motorcycles on the road in the last 5 years and a one third increase in fatalities. Motorcyclists in general are actually doing bloody well as road users, especially compared with automobile fatalities whijch have largely plateaued or begun a slight increase.

But there is no organised approach from informed and educated motorcyclists presenting the good PR. Just angry, threatening, entitlement syndrome afflicted Neanderthals demanding that someone do something about everyone else, without ever presenting documentation accepted as factual by the majority of NZ motorcyclists happy to be represented by people who talk the same language as politicians and regulators, with the clear goal of improving the status of motorcycles within the scope of the transport portfolio.

Can you not see how that looks to a panel of people charged with reducing injuries and fatalities on NZ roads?

**glanvillejon** · 3rd October 2009, 16:53

Hmmmm just fill in the submission, it's our chance to have a say about making our roads safer. There are some good things in there as well which we should show our support for, and something maybe we aren't too keen on. If the government DIDN'T want INDIVIDUALS opinions, they wouldn't have asked for it.

If you don't want your say, go and live in North Korea, I hear that is nice this time of year.

**James Deuce** · 3rd October 2009, 17:07

Originally Posted by glanvillejon

Hmmmm just fill in the submission, it's our chance to have a say about making our roads safer. There are some good things in there as well which we should show our support for, and something maybe we aren't too keen on. If the government DIDN'T want INDIVIDUALS opinions, they wouldn't have asked for it.

If you don't want your say, go and live in North Korea, I hear that is nice this time of year.

Too late. Closed yesterday.

Public submissions does not necessarily mean individual submissions.

So an organised response means a "Communist" response?

Don't forget to bitch and moan when ACC levies for motorcycles over 600cc go through the roof, simply because they are perceived as toys.

**Ixion** · 3rd October 2009, 17:36

Dog bear in mind that the Strategy document is NOT draft legislation. Before anything it proposes can actually become law , legislation must be drafted , and there is a formal process which must be gone through. Part of that process (usually) is an ability for the public to make (further) submissions on the draft law. Usually in more detail.

However, it is certainly better to quash silly ideas as early in the process as possible.

**dpex** · 3rd October 2009, 17:37

Originally Posted by glanvillejon

Hmmmm just fill in the submission, it's our chance to have a say about making our roads safer. There are some good things in there as well which we should show our support for, and something maybe we aren't too keen on. If the government DIDN'T want INDIVIDUALS opinions, they wouldn't have asked for it.

If you don't want your say, go and live in North Korea, I hear that is nice this time of year.

Yes! Glanville. That's the fact so many of these twits have missed.

That's the trouble with this land. We have so many freedoms to do whatever we wish, say to whom whatever we wish, poke a finger at Jonny Cop, snub our nose at the courts, and then expect ACC to pick up the cost when poke the finger and get it broken, then demand costs for breaking a leg when falling off a wall during an escape from prison.

You're right. So right. Ten minutes in North Korea or Afghanistan would cure many on this site.

But what do e do to inspire them? The answer is; nothing. The freedoms they have are so wide, and the constrictions they have are so few, that they simply don't care.

They will all wail and moan when the new regime comes into being, and demand to know why 'they' didn't do something about it. But in the end, they'll all just sit down and do nothing. The new regime, whatever it will be, will simply foll over them. They'll pay the fees, mumble at the cost and remain the most pathetic group of humans on earth.

Fuck me! Even the Inuits (those are folk who live in make-shift ice houses, AKA Igloos, and who leave their aged out in the snow to die, thereby lessening the impact on what little social welfare they have) have the balls to get up and protest about the politically incorrectness of New Zealand's very own Eskimo Pie....Although I suspect Green Peace had a bit to do with it.

But throbbing, take it slowly, protest works.

Look at 1080? When the Graff brothers made their video about this hideous poison all but hunters shunned it....well, there may have been a few 'Bambi TV watchers who were affected' but it went nowhere.

Suddenly, the Taupo District Council has realised the damage this shit is causing.

See the lineal progression? 1. A few hunters see what's going on. Most ignore them. The hunters then turn up with bags of native birds, and trout guts with weird polyps (I caught one of those just yesterday), and deformed Kura. Suddenly, they get a voice with the powers.

But It's taken years. We hunters have been batting on about 1080 almost since the end of WW2. Suddenly, sense has overtaken bureaucratic convention.

And that's what we're up against here. Bureaucratic convention.. Ergo, all bikers are a danger to themselves and others so we...the powers at be...have to enforce some more rules to prevent them hurting themselves.

More rules!? Fuck me! Look at the rule book now. It's almost novel length. And they want to add more.

I come back to a point I made some posts ago about reducing the injury/death toll below a certain level.

The bureacrats (read ACC want it at zero). Rationale says there is a certain level of chance below which no nation can descend.

To align us, as so many do with Northern European countries, and ask why we can't get down to their levels is insane.

In NZ we don't have six months of the year during which we are covered in snow and need chains to get our four-wheels from here to there.

We don't have four hours of daylight during winter.

Have any of you ever been to Sweden in winter? It's like being muffled in wall-to-wall white stuff. No wonder their annual crash rate is less than hours. But I'll bet that if you compared their summer crash-rate with ours....Given they're Swedes and Danes, and generally act stoned most of the time on account of they pay 85% taxes but live off timber sales....thy would be equal or greater.
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But let's not have a truth get in the way of a good statistic.

Protest. Fuck it! Protest! Make your voice heard.

David beat Goliath, the Russians beat Napolean and the bosch. David Tua beat....Oh well we might forget that one...

The point being, the little guy has beaten the big guy so often, yet the little guys of the future seem to forget.

We bikers are the little guys.

For christ's sakes. Get up and say your bit, and be heard.

**James Deuce** · 3rd October 2009, 18:40

Well, that confirms that then.

**kevfromcoro** · 4th October 2009, 03:28

I went to court on friday.
Did the crime and paid up
just one thing.. the courtroom was full of police.. i mean 8 or 10 of them..
seemed a bit unusual.... well i got sentanced and went outside.. there were 2 police guarding the door.. then these 2 big maori muthas came in.. but they had police badges on... they wanted to go in the court room.. but the police stopped them.. well not really police badges.. something made up.... when i was in the office they came in. and they started talking to me...started about the badges were different,, and this is our queen. not NZ queen..
they were there to stir shit,,, had note books and all the imfo about law
couldnt believe this was happening in NZ
anyone know about this lot?

Whoops.... looks like i put this the wrong thread.

**MarkH** · 4th October 2009, 08:00

Originally Posted by kevfromcoro

well not really police badges.. something made up.... when i was in the office they came in. and they started talking to me...started about the badges were different,, and this is our queen. not NZ queen..
they were there to stir shit,,, had note books and all the imfo about law
couldnt believe this was happening in NZ
anyone know about this lot?

Sounds like apartheid supporters. Somehow one law for all is not good enough for them.

**cromagnon** · 7th December 2011, 09:16

Not sure if this has been posted up yet... did a search but couldnt find the new link anywhere. The govt has put out the "Draft Safer Journeys for Motorcycling Guide" LINK. The following is from the email that was forwarded on:

The NZ Transport Agency (NZTA) has just released a draft version of our motorcycling safety guide, Safer Journeys for Motorcycling, and we need your input.
The intent of the guide is to address the disproportionately high crash risks associated with motorcycling in New Zealand, by providing best-practice guidance for reducing the numbers of fatal and serious injury crashes involving motorcyclists. The document reflects the Safe System approach, although it does emphasise safe roads and roadsides.
Thus far, the guide has been prepared with input from a variety of stakeholders who each represent a range of interests and perspectives. This includes the NZTA as the delivery agent, and other key stakeholders such as MOTO NZ (Motorcyclists Own The Options), road controlling authorities, and ACC.
But to help ensure success, we need to hear from everyone that has an interest in improving motorcycling safety.
Take a look at the draft version of Safer Journeys for Motorcycling and let us know what you think. Please forward this to any groups or individuals that you think might also be interested in contributing their thoughts.
For more information and to download a copy of Safer Journeys for Motorcycling, go to http://www.nzta.govt.nz/consultation...ide/index.html
Comments are needed by Friday, 20th January 2012.

Thank you for your support and participation.
Kind regards,
Patrick Golier
Principal Advisor - Network Optimisation
DDI 64 4 894 6440
E Patrick.Golier@nzta.govt.nz

NZ Transport Agency
National Office
Victoria Arcade
50 Victoria Street
Private Bag 6995
Wellington 6141
New Zealand
T 64 4 894 5400
F 64 4 894 6100
www.nzta.govt.nz