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Thread: Stop bitching and use your brains...

  1. #31
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    It's flawed now. Since that class don't pay anyway. Yet benefit from the resource.
    Do you realise how many holes there could be if people would just take the time to take the dirt out of them?

  2. #32
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    I dont know who's fault it is that ACC is fuct with the 13 billion dollar shortfall or whatever, but i sure wish they had it right in the first place. because now we all have to fix it at our own expence
    Thats whats up.

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by MSTRS View Post
    Fair enough. But I am limiting myself to appropriate comments in appropriate threads. Sanx included cyclists and pedestrians in his post, and because everything is linked, their drawing from the motor fund MUST be noted.
    Yes I know, it is just that SANX had a good line of inquirey going and most other ACC threads have gone to general bitch sessions and off the track.

  4. #34
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    Too bad the most of the public believe what they see on tv. We need more points of view like Sanx's out there on the news

  5. #35
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    Someone said a few of the leaders at ACC get like half a mill a year? if (say 3 of them) they didnt get 500,000 bucks a year, and more like 100,000 that would cut the amount of 'large motorcycle' affected to 428 from 2142. im no good with numbers but you know what im trying to say
    Thats whats up.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by octanepwr View Post
    Too bad the most of the public believe what they see on tv. We need more points of view like Sanx's out there on the news
    That is where credible, researched and referenced numbers win the debate against politicians.
    ACC have made their recommendations to the Minister, it is up to him to decide them (with very helpful debate he should crumble)

  7. #37
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    Hmmm. So, according to ACC's own statistics, motorcyclists - per claim - actually have cheaper accidents than other groups. Yeah - probably 'cos more of them get killed dead men don't requirement treatment - but the statements made about bikers having disproportionately more serious (by which I mean expensive) accidents is simply and demonstrably false.
    Correct. We have more injuries but less serious/costly.

    Makes sense . Car and bike tangle at an intersection. Car driver usually uninjured. Bike rider maybe has bruises and grazes. Treated either by ambo or A&E, either way goes down in ACC as a motorcycle injury, but low cost. Whereas if a car driver ends up in hospital it's usually fairly serious.

    I've passed that information on the MP Darien Fenton to use in the debate next week.
    Quote Originally Posted by skidmark
    This world has lost it's drive, everybody just wants to fit in the be the norm as it were.
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Vincent
    The manufacturers go to a lot of trouble to find out what the average rider prefers, because the maker who guesses closest to the average preference gets the largest sales. But the average rider is mainly interested in silly (as opposed to useful) “goodies” to try to kid the public that he is riding a racer

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by k2w3 View Post
    Hold on. How can they calculate it using "miles travelled" (or "hours on the road", either way) AND lump into the equation injuries caused by non-registered bikes, such as farm bikes and dirt bikes? The mileage travelled by those is unknown and therefore left out of the equation .
    First to do not get ACC statistics and NZLT statistics confused. They are two separate things. ACC may or may not lump off-road and farm motorcycle accidents under motorcycle accidents... but NZLT deals with road accidents. The ministers can still refer with NZLT for statistics.

    Mileage gets recorded every time you get a WOF. Random surveys will also monitor and count vehicle types passing over sections of road. These give more accurate road usage figures.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by ckai View Post
    I was gonna say that you bitch about others not doing anything and yet you haven't taken this sort of thing to the media BUT then I noticed where you are so I understand you not doing it.
    I might be a whinging Pom based in Australia, but I'm also a New Zealand citizen and therefore entitled to vote and have my say. I've written to the various involved members of the cabinet and written a couple of letters to Newspapers.

    Quote Originally Posted by dipshit View Post
    I think they base it on actual road use rather than the registered vehicle fleet.
    Injury accidents per million vehicle kilometres is one of the normal metrics used for comparing road accident data. However, if it is even collated in NZ, it's certainly not published. If that's the basis of the government's 16 times claim, they should at least publish the figures and have them subjected to public scrutiny.

    Quote Originally Posted by k2w3 View Post
    Hold on. How can they calculate it using "miles travelled" (or "hours on the road", either way) AND lump into the equation injuries caused by non-registered bikes, such as farm bikes and dirt bikes? The mileage travelled by those is unknown and therefore left out of the equation.
    There's nothing to say farm and dirt bikes WERE included in his figures. Even with those figures they still don't add up.

  10. #40
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    One other way the figures could be bollstered is in statistical forcasting models.
    The current growth (or decay) rate of injuries (pay outs) becomes circular in the algorithm over the specified future time period (currently to 2014 I believe). Treasury use this for GDP modelling.
    That assumes growth rate remains static at that percentage increase, which of course it isn't.
    And they would never implement it on a decline year would they.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanx View Post
    I might be a whinging Pom based in Australia, but I'm also a New Zealand citizen and therefore entitled to vote and have my say. I've written to the various involved members of the cabinet and written a couple of letters to Newspapers.
    Nice work mate. Unless you're thinking of heading back here in the next little while, it's good to see you getting stuck in to something that's not directly affecting you.

    Maybe we need more whinging poms! :

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by dipshit View Post
    First to do not get ACC statistics and NZLT statistics confused. they are two separate things. ACC may or may not lump off-road and farm motorcycle accidents under motorcycle accidents... but NZLT deals with road accidents. The ministers can still refer with NZLT for statistics.
    ACC don't include off-road accidents in their motorcycle section within the Motor Vehicle Pool statistics. These were the figures I used. They only include accidents that include a road-registered vehicle on the road, so a bunch of cyclists crashing into each other, or a cyclist plowing into a pedestrian whilst running a red light or [insert-name-of-favourite-KB-racer] crashing yet again on the track don't get included.

    ACC might have a motorbike-related accidents figure that includes off-road use, farm bikes etc. but it wouldn't be valid for calculation of ACC levy components for vehicle rego. And any attempt to say it was relevant could be shot down in flames very easily. NZ Transport Agency or Dept. of Transport figures could still be used, but they wouldn't take into account off-road usage either.

    Quote Originally Posted by dipshit View Post
    Mileage gets recorded every time you get a WOF. Random surveys will also monitor and count vehicle types passing over sections of road. These give more accurate road usage figures.
    Again, if these are the figures being used, they need to publish them.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by ready4whatever View Post
    Someone said a few of the leaders at ACC get like half a mill a year? if (say 3 of them) they didnt get 500,000 bucks a year, and more like 100,000
    Yeah, government jobs are much lower paid than the private sector.

    Can remember my first day starting work in the mining industry. Went to get a spare jacket from the locker room until my issued gear turned up. Someone told me later that the jacket i had on used to belong to someone that was on 1.2 million per year.

    People in the private sector laugh at the low paid government jobs.

    (edit; Point is - don't bother trying the tall poppy syndrome attack)

  14. #44
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    a well thought out & researched thread, makes for interesting reading ..

    bling sent
    Have to Karma ... Justice catches up eventually !!

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sanx View Post
    I've written to the various involved members of the cabinet and written a couple of letters to Newspapers.
    So this was you then I take it?
    http://www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/new...ike-levy-logic

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