Ulysses please explain why you're selling us out

[RiderInBlack]

Obviously a "Divide And Concur" tactic by Nick Myth. I wouldn't buy into it. Can't see the Ulysses Riders up here going for that.

[Tank]

Ulysseus has been pulling funding from govt agencies for some years.

Back your statment up with figures Steve !!!!!!

MY UNDERSTANDING IS they get funding from a govt department to run their training courses. MY UNDERSTANDING IS it is from ACC.

You, or any interested person, should verify this yourselves. On the Internet, my opinion is ONLY MY UNVERIFIED OPINION.

FFS - If you dont know something dont put it forward as you did in your first post as FACT (until someone calls you out on it).

It dosnt help at all and as is the way with the internet - Someone may actually believe you and repeat it as fact to back up a valid argument - then they start laughing at us as we cannot even get basic facts right.

Of course this is assuming anyone actually believes you - its a remote possibility - but I guess its possible that someone would.

So - PLEASE try - along with everyone else (at least in the ACC threads) to only post information that you KNOW to be correct.

Not something you may have heard off a bloke at the pub who once dated the sisiter of a guy who knew someone.

[Tank]

For what it is worth - their official position is:


Statement of Position from the National Committee 8th November 2009

The Ulysses Club is against the current changes to ACC put forward by the government.

They will adversely impact on many New Zealanders by increasing levies and/or reducing services.

In particular, we are very concerned at the punitive approach being taken with regard to the heavy increases in ACC levies being proposed on motorcycle registration.

This has been done without consultation with the motorcycling fraternity
and totally disregards the efforts made by this club and others to improve safety on the road for all riders.

We believe that it is time for a comprehensive review of ACC and the way in which it is now operating.

The government should establish a robust and transparent public investigation
to conduct this review and to include the accuracy of ACC’s stated statistics on its present costings, the methodology of acquiring the statistics, and the analysis of them in the review.

We offer the opportunity to ACC and the government to engage in omprehensive dialogue on all matters relating to motorcycles and to work towards a fair and equitable resolution for all concerned.

The Ulysses Club would also support a return to injury prevention and other programmes focussed on reducing the risks to motorcyclists.

[mashman]

Anyone think that maybe Smithy thought he was away laughing because he'd "consulted" with a single person from Ulysses?

It had crossed my mind!!! The guy seems ignorant enough!

[firefighter]

They have no right to accept anything on behalf of anyone apart from their own members, and to sit there and "accept the new levies" is just crap.

From what iv'e seen from them so far, they need to take a back seat, sit down and shut the fuck up.

Going by the fact they're all 1000 years old, with all that "life experience" and mid-life crisis professional members, they would surely have something intelligent and valuable to add to the cause. So far all they've done is embarrass themselves on television and then show a total lack of will to fight for a fair deal.

With the cirtieria of being over 40 being a pre-requisite, surely Ulysses have some members of high calibre to step forward?

A lawyer? Polly? Surely.

I'm sure they could find a more media savvy and well groomed member for any further talks.

BRONZ are the only organisation in my eyes who represent us all without prejudice, so only they can accept the new fees, in leiu of motorcycle training......



NOTE: If it is bollox then apologies where appropriate.

[Tank]

I have had Ulysses emailed asking them if this is indeed correct - I will post when I receive a reply.

[duckonin]

They have no right to accept anything on behalf of anyone apart from their own members, and to sit there and "accept the new levies" is just crap.

From what iv'e seen from them so far, they need to take a back seat, sit down and shut the fuck up.

Going by the fact they're all 1000 years old, with all that "life experience" and mid-life crisis professional members they would have something intelligent and valuable to add to the cause. So far all they've done is embarrass on television and then show a total lack of will to fight for a fair deal.

BRONZ are the only organisation in my eyes who represent us all without prejudice, so only they can accept the new fees, in leiu of motorcycle training......

Fucken idjits.

Next they'll be voting Winnie back in.

Sit down you old farts brfore you break another hip.

NOTE: If it is bollox then apologies where appropriate.

Bronz also has ulysses members on the committee, the 1000 year old saying is united we stand divided we fall, and in time u yourself shall be a 1000 years old not long from now, then you shall hear the same crap from someone like yourself.....It will be your turn to listern to the words of wisdom coming from another like yourself, to sit down and shut the fuck up.."Fucken idgit"

Any contribution to a problem is welcome as long as it is constructive

[firefighter]

Bronz also has ulysses members on the committee, the 1000 year old saying is united we stand divided we fall, and in time u yourself shall be a 1000 years old not long from now, then you shall hear the same crap from someone like yourself.....It will be your turn to listern to the words of wisdom coming from another like yourself, to sit down and shut the fuck up.."Fucken idgit"

Any contribution to a problem is welcome as long as it is constructive

I merely ask for it's "wise" members to be put forward. Rather than hairy rough bastards. I can only assume there must surely be some legal professionals etc amoungst the ranks?

I have'nt offered "words of wisdom" because i'm still waiting for the oldies to cough it up. It seems there is none.

Oh, and I am the old bastard amounst my circle, so I already have to hear the same crap coming from someone like myself!

Ulyssess members may be on BRONZ's commitee, which is great (really) but only BRONZ should be representing motorcyclists and making deals. (unless there is another group of equal stature out there)

[duckonin]

I merely ask for it's "wise" members to be put forward. Rather than hairy rough bastards. I can only assume there must surely be some legal professionals etc amoungst the ranks?

I have'nt offered "words of wisdom" because i'm still waiting for the oldies to cough it up. It seems there is none.

Oh, and I am the old bastard amounst my circle, so I already have to hear the same crap coming from someone like myself!

Ulyssess members may be on BRONZ's commitee, which is great (really) but only BRONZ should be representing motorcyclists and making deals. (unless there is another group of equal stature out there)

There in lies some of the problem.( legal professionals amongst the ranks) better to use opinions of the hairy rough bastards, more words of wisdom can be obtained at times...

[STJim]

Well it is important not to offend, and I agree with your cautious approach.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS they get funding from a govt department to run their training courses. MY UNDERSTANDING IS it is from ACC.

You, or any interested person, should verify this yourselves. On the Internet, my opinion is ONLY MY UNVERIFIED OPINION.

YMMV, do the math, cap fits or not, square peg/round hole, etc, shoot own foot etc, standard disclaimer applies.

But who wouldn't exploit a new funding source?

Steve

With respect steve an unverified opinion are dangerous. At this stage most Ulysses Traing courses have been funded at a local level.
Hamilton branch has been running courses for some years. The funding has all been negotiaed at a local level -some from ACC a lot from another local source

[Reckless]

You, or any interested person, should verify this yourselves.

I would generally let it go, but you directly quoted me, so I respond thus

I don't think its up to me (or anyone else) to verify your accusations my friend.
You made serve, I returned the ball, its still your court to substantiate the claims IMHO.

[Ixion]

I do not think BRONZ would consider itself to have a mandate to "make deals" on behalf of motorcyclists.

We can advocate for motorcyclists in general, and express what we believe to be the opinion of the motorcycling community ; and convey information and opinion to that community.

But I do not think that any motorcyclist has expressed any agreement for BRONZ (or any other organisation) to strike a deal on his or her behalf.

We may intimate to TPTB that we think that such and such would be generally acceptable or unacceptable to motorcyclists, but that would as far as we would go.

[StoneY]

Bottom line is Nix Myth will desperately grab at any straw to assist with justifying his increases

I know Peter Mac has been 'keen' to work with Minister Smith all along as where the rest of us want to hang the pratt so Nicky boy will cling to Peter Mac's offer like a holy grail

All we can do is make sure the minister is aware, Ulysses are NOT representative of the NZ Motorcycle community, theye are a club that represents it own members, and ONLY its membership

I have sent Nick an e-mail stating as such, and as I am the person he INVITED to negotiate at the BIKEOI with up to 11 colleagues.....it will carry a little weight I would hope.....

[Bald Eagle]

Bottom line is Nix Myth will desperately grab at any straw to assist with justifying his increases

I know Peter Mac has been 'keen' to work with Minister Smith all along as where the rest of us want to hang the pratt so Nicky boy will cling to Peter Mac's offer like a holy grail

All we can do is make sure the minister is aware, Ulysses are NOT representative of the NZ Motorcycle community, theye are a club that represents it own members, and ONLY its membership

I have sent Nick an e-mail stating as such, and as I am the person he INVITED to negotiate at the BIKEOI with up to 11 colleagues.....it will carry a little weight I would hope.....

I still have a concern that he is going to try and use the bikeoi meeting as his section 330 consultation.
A legal opinion on what constitutes consultation would be nice. We also have yet to receive / ask for the promised meeting to do that.
Given yesterdays ACC media release, which I see has been gratefully regurgitated by the Harold and others I believe it's time to stop playing nice.

[Reckless]

I still have a concern that he is going to try and use the bikeoi meeting as his section 330 consultation.

Surely for it to be legal that would have to be stated and agreed before hand?

Secondly how do we know he hasn't already had a meeting with some group somewhere and solved this Issue. Would have been a good question to put directly to him last night!