What is wrong with these kids...

[Motu]

Right - the rules for modified vehicles have been in place for over 10 yrs....over 20% power increase,turbo,change of engine size/configeration all require a mod cert,with a plate in the engine bay detailing the changes.The point about the learner car driver being supivised is a good point though.

But how do these kids get to drive around in fast cars anyway...back when I was a teenager a Morris Minor was considered a pretty hot weapon to be lusted after,a MkI Zephyr was a Ferrari.It still comes back to the parents giving kids a powerful car to drive around in unsupervised - of course it was a totaly different matter when I let my daughter drive around in the Charade Turbo...my kids would never do anything wrong eh?

[scumdog]

This reply defines "too Hard".
Common engine mods are generally easy to identify. a pod air cleaner or modded exhaust should immediately require the car to be dynoed at an approved place to ascertain output, otherwise the factory figures apply. Vehicle weights are supplied by the factory, if the car has been lightened - too bad.
In fact, the exciuses they use for not restricting cars can be applied to bikes.
How many RD250's had 350 engines, I wonder?
Typically useless LTNZ, good at pointless gestures towards safety as long as it doesn't take money away from their precious advertising budget.

The thing is Lou, bikes are an 'individual' form of transport whereas (as per the LTSA letter) the first vehicle driven is often the family car which may seem mundane can be a bit of a Q-ship i.e. saw a Mitsi RVR turbo do a 14.4 1/4 mile and yet it looked like a basic family mover.

I guess if the Gov't hardened up they could make obtaining a drivers licence process tougher and the penalties stiffer but as you said, the farming types would squeal and it would costs votes and we can't have that eh.

[Ixion]

This reply defines "too Hard".
Common engine mods are generally easy to identify. a pod air cleaner or modded exhaust should immediately require the car to be dynoed at an approved place to ascertain output, otherwise the factory figures apply. Vehicle weights are supplied by the factory, if the car has been lightened - too bad.
In fact, the exciuses they use for not restricting cars can be applied to bikes.
How many RD250's had 350 engines, I wonder?
Typically useless LTNZ, good at pointless gestures towards safety as long as it doesn't take money away from their precious advertising budget.

Bikers are a small and unpoplar target. There is a body of opinion at the LTSA that would like them banned completely. So they can regulate us all they want. If they started regulating car drivers there would be opposition.

The motives are political not technical

[Ixion]

Research has indicated that applying engine capacity or power restrictions to vehicles driven would be extremely difficult to enforce. Measuring engine output is not a simple process and cannot be easily conducted at the roadside by the Police. It requires specialist equipment and specially trained staff, involving tasks that are more appropriately carried out in engineering workshops. Also, cc ratings can be easily altered through vehicle modifications and there are a number of other factors, such as turbo-charging systems, that can significantly increase the power output of a car’s engine

Why is harder on a car than on a bike ?

There are also concerns that imposing restrictions on the cars that novice drivers are permitted to drive could prevent some from being able to learn in family vehicles

How many Mums and Dads have *only* a super hotted rod. Most of the injuries and deaths occur in 'Hot" cars owned by the young driver, not in the Mum-and-Dad-Mobile

It should be noted that a key difference between novice motorcycle riders and car drivers is that novice motorcycle riders can ride unsupervised from the day they obtain their Learner Licence

This is the nub of it. Pisses them off no end, but they can't find a way round it. Total bullshit of course because if it were true there would be no justification for continuing the capacity limit into the restricted stage. A restricted car driver can drive alone in any capacity/performance car.

[Wolf]

A restricted car driver can drive alone in any capacity/performance car.

Except in the quiet hours of the night when it would probably be safer owing to less traffic.

The LTSA party line in that email said "There are also concerns that imposing restrictions on the cars that novice drivers are permitted to drive could prevent some from being able to learn in family vehicles"


Whoop-dy shit! We have to buy learner bikes and then sell them (complete with bent pegs, broken levers and other forms of "learner rash") later to get a bigger bike. Typical discrimination against bikers by LTSA - why do we bother paying our rego fees?

They have a "biker=scum, car driver=normal person" attitude, ergo I think that the LTSA should not be allowed to govern motorcycles as they are clearly not a dispassionate, objective body.

As has been pointed out here by various people - most families have more than one car these days and the cars that the boi racers are tearing about in are not "family cars" - not unless the "family" is heavily into illegal mods and penis-substitute sound systems (128-inch sub-woofer to compensate for half-inch cock). As these buggers obviously are buying their own cars (or having stupid rich parents buy them for them), the LTSA argument is absolute bollocks.

[Lou Girardin]

There lies the crux of the LTNZ problem, they cannot accept that learners should be taught solely by professional instructors. They still think Mum and Dad passing on bad habits and misinformation is OK.