Riding in the rain....

[jazbug5]

If I'm braking gently for lights etc I do use the back brake in an on off on off way, because I think car drivers take more notice mof the flashing brake light thaan they do of a steady one.

Thanks, Ixion- I'll be interested in what others have to say about the 'pulsing' technique- sounds like 'manual' ABS to me- if you get it right, no doubt excellent...

The blinking thing's an excellent idea; I sort of do that in a once, twice, thrice way (especially if I think the person behind me is particularly unaware) but actually making a constant flashing would probably be an improvement.

Another thing I was told to do some time ago was to periodically apply my brakes (lightly!) during a wet ride to get rid of some of the water in them. Especially after going through puddles etc.
What say you?

[Ixion]

..
Another thing I was told to do some time ago was to periodically apply my brakes (lightly!) during a wet ride to get rid of some of the water in them. Especially after going through puddles etc.
What say you?

Only for drum brakes of course. I find this is only an issue with long rides. But it can do no harm. The road code rabbits on at enormous length about it, but I've never been sure that it's not an old wive's tale

[Wolf]

Only for drum brakes of course. I find this is only an issue with long rides. But it can do no harm. The road code rabbits on at enormous length about it, but I've never been sure that it's not an old wive's tale

I was always told to "pump the brakes" in the wet to dry them out - drum brakes, of course. I've also often pulsed the brake to let people know I'm about to stop before putting it on for real - if I have time.

[jazbug5]

Interesting. Well, mine are disc, so I suppose I've been wasting my time!
Meantime, had a look at About.com for motorbike info on brakes - may be interesting for some of us. Here's a quote from it.

Since many beginners use the rear brake too much they often lock them up during panic situations and skid the rear tire. Please remember that if you find yourself in a rear wheel skid, DO NOT release the brake pedal. Ride it out. Releasing the pedal will often cause a high side incident where you will be thrown over the handlebars. This is the opposite of the advice given for a front-wheel skid with the front brake locked up. You need to know the difference between these two situations.

[Krayy]

I think that on average you loose 20% of a lean angle (more if the tires arent up to scratch for the conditions, or a crap tires) in rain...

Hell, I'd be impressed if the Dragstar could get over 20% in the dry!!

[jazbug5]

Another couple of links, this time from a U.K. site.

Real newbies look at this

Not-so newbies, look at this

Seems pretty good stuff to me, anyway.
Maybe we should have a sticky with links to useful sites like this? It might be easier than getting people to agree on a KB 'approved techniques' list sorta thingy...

[johnsf1980]

Hell, I'd be impressed if the Dragstar could get over 20% in the dry!!

I dont about about the % but I sure can lean it over quite a bit in the dry... thats the fun bit!

[Motu]

If I do have to brake hard in the wet I use a thing called pulse braking, which was shown to me years and years ago. I've never seen or heard mention of it so it may be horribly bad , and I do NOT recommend it (so don't blame me ) ; and if people who know more than me tell you it's bad then believe them. Works for me is all I can say.

Basically you "tremble" your hand / foot on the brake. Squeeze , let off a little but, squeeze, let off, but as fast as you can . And each squeeze a bit more than the last one, and each release a bit less. You don't let the brake off completely, just relax the pressure a little bit .

I wonder if it was the same guy who showed me all those years a go - you wasn't a Panmure Boy was you?

A highside is less likely to happen in the rain,just try and keep the bike straight when it locks up,you can use a fair bit of front brake,just keep the bike vertical and stay way from all the slippery stuff like painted lines and steel covers.This is where the left foot brake was so good in NZ - the road camber will naturaly make the rear step out to the left under braking,it was easy to maintain brake control and yet put the right foot down to steady the bike at the same time....you got no idea how many times a left foot brake saved me from landing on my arse in the wet.Bloody Yanks,taking away our freedom of choice.

[Ixion]

Interesting. Well, mine are disc, so I suppose I've been wasting my time!
Meantime, had a look at About.com for motorbike info on brakes - may be interesting for some of us. Here's a quote from it.

Since many beginners use the rear brake too much they often lock them up during panic situations and skid the rear tire. Please remember that if you find yourself in a rear wheel skid, DO NOT release the brake pedal. Ride it out. Releasing the pedal will often cause a high side incident where you will be thrown over the handlebars. This is the opposite of the advice given for a front-wheel skid with the front brake locked up. You need to know the difference between these two situations.

Probably true, though as Mr Motu notes, a highsider is unlikely in the wet (because the grip probably won't change quickly enough to initiate one). I tend not too worry quite so much about locking the rear, because it's relatively easy to ride out a rear wheel slide. Scarey, but usually if you just leave it alone you'll be OK. Mr pyrocam successfully rode out a rear wheel lock up at 110kph, so that shows what can be done even by someone without a vast amount of experience. Just keep the bike upright and pointed in a a safe direction.

[jazbug5]

Excellent stuff.
Yeah, that was more general advice about rear lock up, but it's good to know you're less likely to highside in the wet, what with the reduced traction etc.
I'm really enjoying reading everyone's input on this, especially from more experienced riders such as yourself (Ixion) and Motu: hopefully more people will put in their 2c and experiences. It's very educational stuff, and very worth reading, even if you have before or it seems 'obvious'.

[vifferman]

The blinking thing's an excellent idea; I sort of do that in a once, twice, thrice way (especially if I think the person behind me is particularly unaware) but actually making a constant flashing would probably be an improvement.

Yeah, I do this too, especially on the Harbour Bridge, where ther's this funny 'rubber band thing' going on, where the traffic speeds up, then slows down, then speeds up... So I keep an eye on the rear view mirror, and trigger the brake lever a few times to make sure the person behind me is awake, while looking for an exit route if they look like they're going to rear-end me.

Another thing I was told to do some time ago was to periodically apply my brakes (lightly!) during a wet ride to get rid of some of the water in them. Especially after going through puddles etc.
What say you?

Yeah, I've noticed my front brakes take a while to bite in the wet, even if it's not raining much. This is where the "Dual Combined Braking System" is good, because the brake pedal gives effective retardation with less chance of locking things up, due to the proportioning valve.
I've noticed that one of the car manufacturers (BMW?) is touting a system where the brake pads are lightly floated against the disks to ensure they are free of water so when they are applied they are more effective.

I used to ride in all weathers, including snow, hail, gale-force winds, etc. (apart from that one time in Chch when there was black ice ) But I realised that (a) I didn't actually much enjoy riding in the wet, due to having to don wet-weather gear, and due to the increased stress from concentrating; and (b) it was more dangerous, and I didn't need that; and (c) I was putting on a staunch attitude about the whole thing.
So now I try to avoid it if I can - not studiously, but if I don't feel like it, and I have a choice, I'll take one of the cars.

[Waylander]

Someone once told me that the back wheel was mainly there for power. That you could have it lock , slide, buck and kick ya around but aslong as the front was steady and straight then all ya had to do is ride it out. I've had the back wheel lock up on me before had something get caught in it, rode it out and got to a stop like Pyrocam did. Had heads of impressed looks from bystanders. Had it slide on some loose gravel. Even locked up the rear cause wasn't about to go through a red light I didn't see change. All times I just held the front steady and rode it out like I was told. I may be wrong (but if Ixion is right then I'm not) but it's always worked for me so I'll keep doin it till it doesn't.

[Motu]

Yep,this is one of my theories - it's seldom that you will lose control of both wheels at once(oh,believe me,you can do,and I have done) and it's much more preferable to have the rear wheel lose traction,it's much easier to control.Speedway,flattrack,MotoGP...all have the rear sliding as much as possible - that keeps the front planted.You can change a bad news front wheel slide to a rear wheel slide with a dab of rear brake.Keep the rear nervous and the front will be secure.

[vifferman]

Someone once told me that the back wheel was mainly there for power.

Well, that's true, unless you have one of those two-wheel drive Yamahas, or a motorunicycle.
Most of the braking force comes from the front brake, due to weight transfer as the bike slows down. However, any extra braking you can get from the rear wheel helps, and you can also use it as a 'rudder' when doing slow-speed manouevres, and to settle the bike going into corners (apply the back brake to transfer some weight to the front tyre).

[vifferman]

Keep the rear nervous and the front will be secure.

So if you're pillioning, as long as your passenger is nervous and jittery, you'll come to no harm?