Biker fatality on SH16

[Lou Girardin]

Now I'm confused again. Is the bend NORTH of the Kanahoi turnoff , or SOUTH?

NORTH!

[Lou Girardin]

I know for a fact that Speed was the MAIN factor in the accident,.

Yeah, the speed of the car. You're starting to sound like a poster boy for LTNZ.

[Paul in NZ]

Yes they do. Heard of inconsiderate driving? Ever ticketed anyone for holding up traffic?
A common offence and a rarely ticketed.

Yeah well, in some places Lou, doing 140kph is pretty inconsiderate...

[Lou Girardin]

Ah yes,we can see it now.Plenty of signs and the driveways are pretty damn obvious - if you've ever been on this road before you'll know they are there.The poor buggers coming up - they had no way of knowing what was going to come down their side of the road.If the 140kph is correct,that's waaaay too fast through there.

I don't know about that Motu, the only reason I don't take that at more than 120 odd is to allow for dicks pulling out of Kanohi Rd.
But uphill is way more fun.

[Motu]

I don't know about that Motu, the only reason I don't take that at more than 120 odd is to allow for dicks pulling out of Kanohi Rd.
But uphill is way more fun.

Zigactly - so now you admit his speed was excessive and one should be aware of people pulling out?

[Scouse]

I took three photos to illustrate where the accident occured, or at least where I can presume the accident occured. This is based off what news reports and Pixie has suggested in previous posts.

I'm not going to elaborate on what I think happened (as I did that in my previous post) so this is as objective as I can make it.

Make your own assumptions.

Photo 0 - Wises Map of SH16 section concerned. Each addition photograph is mapped out (approximately) to where it was taken. This provides you with some perspective. The First photograph (and they are numbered visually, look at the top of each image) shows the entry into the downhill sweeper.

Great for speed.

The second image shows the start of the blind spot (or there abouts) and the third then shows the vanishing point which ends the blind spot. The two driveways are "almost" only visable at the point of vanishing/apex.

There are additional driveways which are guestimately 100m, 150m (respectively) past the vanishing point/apex/end of blindspot.

Hey Swanny
that dose not look to me like where the accident happend

[SwanTiger]

Hey Swanny
that dose not look to me like where the accident happend

You are correct however we've established that.

And I've learnt not to believe even the most simple facts published in newspapers to be true.

[Lou Girardin]

Zigactly - so now you admit his speed was excessive and one should be aware of people pulling out?

Kanohi is well south of the accident scene, and there's good vis.
I go slow because I'm old you see, the reflexes aren't what they were and I want to live long enough to be supported by my wife.

If I was younger I'd ride like loosebruce.

[Ixion]

Arggh. Ruddy newspapers that can't tell north from south. At last I know where it is.

Can't say that I'd consider 140 grossly excessive on the run into that corner, though I'd want to slow down to a lot less than that for the corner itself just cos it's blind.

Prolly not go in quite that fast though myself , cos of the driveways and potential gravel and such like things. Wouldn't call 140 approach speed a mistake in itself though.

I can see why he braked, changing line to go round the car with the bikes coming uphill would be tricky , and he was probably already setting up braking for the corner. Just saw the car , went ohh arrr and gave it too much front brake.

I doubt the car would have very good visibility up the hill . Bloody silly place to have a driveway, but maybe it's been there for donkey's years.

Biker a bit too confident , not allowing for the "what the hell factor"; prattish cager, doddering out (if I HAD to emerge from that driveway, I'd come out like a cork out of a gun!); and rider error in overbraking - and maybe , only maybe, electing to brake rather than go wide around the car - which still might have collected the Triumphs.

Lessons? Bloody driveways. And SH16 is nowdays really too busy for high speeds. And ABS is a Good Thing.

[Skyryder]

Speed is relative. 140 is nothing if the conditions / road are okay. I've driven on the autobahn at speeds of up to 280 and it's perfectly safe. Of course there's no kiwi's there or third world roads. Many european highways are 120+ and in Sweden GET THIS, the transport agency are trying to increase it on some road becasue they realise cars are a lot safer now, the roads are good and they want to improve travel time. Well fuck me.

Man and machine will occasionally fuck up. No laws (apart from physics) will ever change this.

Speed is relitive to what.............conditions/road? Well yes, that's true. It's also relitive to an evasive manouvre.................like do you have time? I'm simply saying the faster you go the less time you have to avoid the problem. That's as applicable here, as there, or anywhere.


Skyryder

[scumdog]

Kanohi is well south of the accident scene, and there's good vis.
I go slow because I'm old you see, the reflexes aren't what they were and I want to live long enough to be supported by my wife.

If I was younger I'd ride like loosebruce.

Me too - at 19 my 'cruising speed' never dropped below 85mph - about 135kph.
Less car/bikes/cops on the road in the 70's

[Finn]

Speed is relitive to what.............conditions/road? Well yes, that's true. It's also relitive to an evasive manouvre.................like do you have time? I'm simply saying the faster you go the less time you have to avoid the problem. That's as applicable here, as there, or anywhere.


Skyryder

Well Ixion thinks it's safe and he's higher rank than you so you'll just have to retrench.

[scumdog]

Speed is relitive to what.............conditions/road? Well yes, that's true. It's also relitive to an evasive manouvre.................like do you have time? I'm simply saying the faster you go the less time you have to avoid the problem. That's as applicable here, as there, or anywhere.


Skyryder

For you that makes FAR too much logical sense!

[Indoo]

Yes they do. Heard of inconsiderate driving? Ever ticketed anyone for holding up traffic?
A common offence and a rarely ticketed.

Yes and yes. Do you actually understand the offence? There is no obligation to accelerate to normal traffic speed 'quickly', hell otherwise every big rig, grandma and people mover full of 10 illegals would be ticketed.

But sure, show me the case law where someone has ever been charged for not accelerating 'quickly' enough. There is certainly case law where people have been ticketed for accelerating too quickly, but for not flooring it?

I know you love to accuse the LTSA etc of being indoctrinated into the speed is bad dogma, but your just as bad in the opposite. I don't understand how you can claim on the basis of the facts that the cage driver should be charged with careless driving causing death.

Did the MOT have to ban you from attending any car v bike collision?

[Skyryder]

Whats wrong with that? Maybe there right and your not?
Where you there Lou? I didnt see you, you shoulda come up and said hi.

We're all experts in cyberspace. It's just that there are so few of us here who know it.

Skyryder