Why do young guys buy cars????

[Ixion]

I agree, but I think its a good idea to be able to deal with things like give way rules, road signs etc without having to think about it. Its also a good idea to know the signs that are someone is about pull out, traffic is about to come to a stop.

,,.

Presumably, these are well known long before any question of a licence, as a result of push bike experience? Or have they stopped teaching the Road Code at schools now?

[inlinefour]

And young people these days expect so much - I expected nothing from life.

However I also believe that the kids these days are a product of the way society is heading. They want so much because to a large extent they have learnt its how the get what they want. Many of us older generation had to buy what it was we wanted growing up, so we went out and earnt the money to get what we wanted. These days we have the "I want it" generations with the parents who must be either too busy or unable to manage the behaviour?
As for teenagers wanting a car rather than a bike? The only reason I can see that happening is because of the boy ricer attitude. Many think its not cool enough to have a bike, or have a g/f who won't hop on the back of a bike? BTW, I find it really bemusing that there are others who have posted on this thread how they will not allow their kids to ride a bike, yet ride themselves. Are you people that much an inadequate parent that you are unabe to teach your kids how to safely ride a bike. Or are you like so many parents, so busy within your own lives that there is very little time for your children. My boy is just starting to get into bikes at a younger age that I did. I'm thoughroughly enjoying the task of teaching him to ride. Also I'm teaching him the dangers of motorcycles, which is having the end result of him being much more carefull and thinking alot more about what hes doing, which is great to see. I'm not interested in wrapping my kids in cotton wool and they will learn that there is such a thing as failure. Also if they want something, they are not just going to be able to ask or demand it and just recieve. Nothing wrong with the youth of today riding bikes, provided they are taught well. The ony problem with them riding bikes I see is actually in the heads of their parents. Yea they will come off, but not that many people who have ridden bikes don't eh.

[Mr. Peanut]

I don't agree about the 14 year old thing.

Manifestly, 14 year olds can control a motorbike, cos lots of them do so in off road events.

As to traffic, that is no different to a push bike, and until Precious Lamb almost all young guys had been riding pushies on the roads for years by the age of 14.

And, at 14 kids are still much more under parental control. Telling a 17 year what to do is not easy, a 14 year old is much less independant.And much more willing to accept advice from Dad .

And if the machine be restricted to <15 the speed issue does not come into it.

Being less removed from a 14 year olds mind I don't think I had the maturity to deal with 'difficult' traffic situations.

Skilled enough though they may be, some things cannot be taught.

A great deal depends on the individual, as with most other things.

[Ixion]

But I still HAVE a 14 year old's mind! I've repeated been told so.

Usually accompanied by "bloody young idiot". Until I remove the crash helmet

(One the other day still has me wondering -"You're a bloody young idiot, you silly old fool" )

[JimO]

thanks for the input guys someone said in a post to compare a cbr250rr with a mazda turbo etc but a first time driver wouldnt have one of eitherhave a look on tardme and see what you get for 1500 as a road bike compared with the same money in a car. Why can you buy a cbr600 for the same money that cbr250 sell for, i know its supply and demand but if the size limit dropped from 250 to 150 you wouldnt be able to give 250s away

[inlinefour]

But I still HAVE a 14 year old's mind! I've repeated been told so.

Usually accompanied by "bloody young idiot". Until I remove the crash helmet

(One the other day still has me wondering -"You're a bloody young idiot, you silly old fool" )

I get told the same thing also. I pulled into the carpark yesterday on the street magic. Admittingly I was not going that slow and scraped the stand as I leant it over, which really is not that difficult to do. 4 nurses were out in the carpark smoking (and they say riding is bad for my friggin health????) and was commenting about the kids using the hospital grounds as a race track and other derogitory things about the youf of today. They where quite surprised when I parked it next to them, almost doing a stoppie in the process (thought I had better not as Im a senior there and "have to set a good example"...). Their attitude apparently immediately changed as I took my helmet off and they admitted what they had been saying. We are not silly old fools. We just like to enjoy life much like the youf of today. Rather than live a mundane boring life that has very little excitement, maybe apart from sneaking outside to the carpark to have a smoke...

[Mr. Peanut]

YOU'RE 34??

I thought you were 20 something....

[chickenfunkstar]

Presumably, these are well known long before any question of a licence, as a result of push bike experience? Or have they stopped teaching the Road Code at schools now?

Of course the theory should be known, but it can take a bit of practice to apply this to the real world. The generally accepted give way rules can also be different to the ones written in the road code. At the junction between old north road and SH16, cars coming from the stop sign opposite old north road wanting to turn right onto SH16 hardly ever give way to a car wanting to turn left from old north road onto SH16, even though its a stop sign vs give way situation.

On a push bike I tend to give way to everyone.

[Ixion]

True, and very wise, respectively. And our hypothetical 14 year old will also have learned this lesson as a result of his (her) pushie experience. And hopefully, import such prudence and caution into his (her) motorcycling. The difference between a push bike and a small motorbike is not that great.

[GR81]

you cant take ya mates around on a bike easily.
get both!

[inlinefour]

you cant take ya mates around on a bike easily.
get both!

Tell the bums to go and get their own bike!

[NinjaBoy]

I've got a 14 year old who thinks that he will go straight to bikes. As a parent who has driven cars all his life and only recently moved into bikes, there is no way I am going to allow him to do that.
My perpective is that until he learns road sense and has the ability to recognise the basics, such as cages changing lanes without indication, I want him in a car where the early mistakes are not punished by a hospital visit.
Yes he will end up on bikes and I will fully support him (unlike my parents when I was his age). But I do feel that he needs to learn to read the dangers of the raod in a safer environment, where he has some sort of protection, before venturing out on a bike.
I'm sure there are a lot of parents out there that feel the same way.

I have to agree. Learning road sense is key to surviving our roads on a bike. Yeah everyone complains about Cage drivers who can't drive etc.... but its up to you to anticipate other drivers and look out for hazards. On a bike you have next to zero margin for error while make the same mistake in a car, you'll probably live to see another day.

Having been driving and riding for more than a couple of decades (now I feel old), I won't be letting my kids go to bikes until they have had a few years of driving under their belt.

[yungatart]

hXc got his bike licence three days after he turned 15, with our blessings. When he first mentioned that he would like a bike as opposed to a car, I was pretty much against it, for all the usual reasons... blah, blah. However, he pointed out several things in a bikes favour... not subject to peer pressure to take passengers outside of licence conditions, (no spare helmet on the bike), independent travel - on a car learners you need a licenced driver beside you, wouldn't develop the nasty habits of some car drivers, and having ridden a pushbike here, there and everywhere for the last umpteen years, he was already attuned to cagers not seeing him, not giving way to him etc. Plus he had ridden on a mates farm and had done some bucket racing and a lap or two on the Taupo track, well, I was convinced. He already had most of the gear he needed, bought secondhand, of course. I'm glad he chose a bike, now when he has to go off to some practice or other, I can stay home in the warm. I'm sure the back seat of cars is of particulart attraction to young guys with g/f in tow.. I can just hear the conversation,"Ah Mum, me and
(insert g/f's name here) just wanna get a bit of action in the back seat... do you mind waiting outside the car for the next few minutes... oh, and don't look!" Yeah Right!

[gamgee]

thanks for the input guys someone said in a post to compare a cbr250rr with a mazda turbo etc but a first time driver wouldnt have one of eitherhave a look on tardme and see what you get for 1500 as a road bike compared with the same money in a car. Why can you buy a cbr600 for the same money that cbr250 sell for, i know its supply and demand but if the size limit dropped from 250 to 150 you wouldnt be able to give 250s away

well you were the one moaning about $3000-$5500 bikes being too expensive, if you actually read my post you'd understand what i was saying, you can't compare a sports bike which is what you'd be getting in that price range with a slow old car that you'd get for $1000, but you can compare it with the likes of a gn250 which you would get for around $1000, don't know how to explain it any better, maybe:
$3000-$5500 = shiny sports bike
$1000 = a car that does the job
$1000 = a bike that does the job
get the idea?

[petesmeats]

Ok For starters... there is never going to be a hard and fast rule about this...
I think that it depends a lot on the situation... some 14 year olds just couldnt be trusted with a bike while others can...

I started when i was 15 but only on a GN250 that i bought for 270 bucks and got rego'd and warranted myself... (Good learning experience for a youngster)
On my learners i was only allowed around town (in 50-70k zones only)
I learnt a lot of my lessons about other motorists and other dangers on the road at low speeds.
Then i got my restricted and my parents loosened up a little bit more... Let me ride To the next town (10-15 mins away) to see mates... but no further than that. Then i got my bike stolen so was forced to get my car liscence (for lack of money to replace...)
When i got my car licence i already had a fairly high level of awareness when on the road due to my riding... My mates always hated taking me places because they thought that i looked everywhere too much....

I think that this was a good way for me to be introduced to NZ Roads...

I quite agree with Mr Jimjim about the absurd cost of entry level motorcycling.

But , in the end, the factor that will always incline young men toward cars instead of bikes, is the same one it always has been. Lack of a rear seat. Young blood runs hot.

Yeah sure the bike has no back seat but it still pulls the girls... Just not the ones with diseases like cars do...

Basically, some people have weird ideas about what entry level motorcycling is.... In my mind entry level is on a $3-500 18-20yo GN or SR... Not on a 5yo ZXR250.... And as for the gear... i picked up a helmet from big boys toys in porirua for $140 which doesnt exactly break the bank.

When i become a parent and my kids decide that they want to ride... i will be all for it but will restrict thier highway time to start with... and will encourage them to get their car liscences as well. I think that i would help them out with getting decent gear because adequate gear is key to riding.... (I havnt always had adequate gear and it is really dangerous)

As for starting on a scooter (KENDOG) ... DON'T DO IT... They may as well get a GN or a SR for a third the price and learn about gears and clutches and all that... Also i think that people that drive scooters do not wear enough safety gear...

I Also agree with Gamgee... Compare carrots with carrots and apples with apples and it works out to be similar...

As for whether they are better off on a bike or in a car first up... I think that kids should be exposed to it before they can legally take to the roads... Even just letting your kid drive from the front gate at the tip to the tip face is enough to show them the basics.... Ideally though: Off road riding... I would like to think that its better for kids to start on bikes purely for the fact that i am also on the road and if a kid has bad control of a car... HE/SHE COULD KILL ME>>>