Sorry chaps, there is no room in $11.5 billion for a cut

[geoffm]

The surplus is a part of the picture. The other side of it is the bloated civil service - the growth in government "jobs" (and I use the word loosely) has caused a property shortage of offices space in Wellington. It used to be 40% of Wellington workers were government employees, be more than that now.
It is a good way of making the unemplyment figures look good - as long as the economy keeps going ok. When things go bad, you need to decimate the excess - in the original Roman tradition.

I am earning a lot more now than I was 10 years ago, although inflation makes the figures look less flash, but I have a worse lifestyle and less money than I did then> I have the smae cars and bikes as then, except now they are old enough to vote and i can't afford to replace them. I am giving some seriosu thought to becomign an economic refugee and moving to Oz. I have been offered work over there, and the after tax pay is higher than here.
Geoff

[paturoa]

The surplus is a part of the picture. The other side of it is the bloated civil service - the growth in government "jobs" (and I use the word loosely) has caused a property shortage of offices space in Wellington. It used to be 40% of Wellington workers were government employees, be more than that now.

yeah it takes a hole bunch a folks to administer the "income re-distribution" and collection!

[laf laf]

"im just an average rider, riding on below average roads". what more do i need to say.

[carver]

Ok, middle road post aye....

WTF can you do about it apart from write letter saying how dissapointed you are or vote for another party, WTF do you think that will do. Suddenly make MR Clarke change her mind about everything? How about staging a coup? Cant do that cause quite a few NZ'ers are opposed to being violent as well as talking big but running fast once the going gets tough. (Maybe I shouldnt say running, NZ does has a problem with obesity)

Tell me Mr Carver, what would you do?

BTW, I cant remember who I voted for cause I just ticked boxes. No matter what we were fucked.

I will complain when I feel like it, but in all honesty, I dont fucken care. I have my Fiance, a roof over our heads and a damn beautiful country I can jump on a bike or in the car and go see. Politics are way over my head.

honesty aye...
its not a case of what would i do, its what i do...
ya got to look ahead man, what can you do now and in the future..
im a affiliated with a political party, i also am the vice chair of a youth council.
pure grassroots stuff mate.

I will complain when I feel like it, but in all honesty, I dont fucken care. I have my Fiance, a roof over our heads and a damn beautiful country I can jump on a bike or in the car and go see. Politics are way over my head.

your right on here...you dont care, you wont do anything to change things...

[Sniper]

your right on here...you dont care, you wont do anything to change things...

The cuntry is fucked, nothing can be done (IMHO) to get it sorted as there are way too many different veiwpoints. Another reason I joined the army, so that I can get told what to do and only have to make desisions for myself and my team in a situation and never have to take responsibility for it.

Now if you will excuse me, I have a nurse coming to shave my stomach

[Winston001]

maybe if the government put out referendems and let us have our say(very little faith in overpaid mps lining their own pockets)then there would be less moaning!!!!the government makes decisions and rarely hears what new zealanders are saying....unless youre of a certain race of course.....

Must say I've often thought a referendum system would be good. Easy enough to set up these days online. Of course you'd only get computer literate and interested voters but that would still be a sizable chunk of 4 million.

[Dai]

I have only returned to NZ in the last 4 years, after an extended OE of 25 years in the UK.

The political situation here is still confusing to me as I havent really managed to get my head around this proportional representation as inplimented here. eg How can someone who has never been elected to represent the populace be in the position of possibly becoming the prime minister of a country?

That aside I just need to point out that in my experience all your gripes are echoed in the UK. Over there we complained about all the same things, they have a failing health system, they have what they considered bad roading, crime is dramatically heavier than in this country. Traffic offences there are classed as criminal offences and must be declared as such. The UK has VAT (GST) at 17.5%. The Uk is the most heavily taxed country in Europe. While this is not represented by the personal income taxes it is boosted by all the secondary taxes on everything else.

The government keeps growing out of proportion with what they actually require or do. The polititians are as corrupt as everywhere else. The "old boy" network is as alive as here. WHat they dont have, and I may step on a few toes here, is a problem with a treaty signed so long ago that no one alive then is around now, and all the different interpretations of such a document.

They have a massive problem with immigration and the current government there acts in a similar manner to the current NZ gov.

What I am reallytrying to say is the more things seem different the more they stay the same.

I am a firm believer that the current system of governments we have in the world are basiclly corrupt by nature. Wasnt it Plato who said that anyone who wanted to be a polititian wasnt fit to be a polititian. True 500 years BC true today.

Those persons elected , or in NZ's case appointed, to govern us forget that their duty is not to govern but to facilitate our wishes.

They make all these wonderful promioses whilst trying to get into power and then decide that they know what is best for us.

Anyway my rant is over. I hope I havent lost the plot here.

Cullen will never give away what he has clawed off us until there is some benifit to him or his friends and then it will only be a token.

BTW Income tax has only been around for just over 100 years. It wasnt implemented in the UK until 1911. A method of paying the government to tell you how much you have to pay them and for them to then tell you that they do not have enough to do as those they represent wish. Self perpetuating

[The Stranger:Me]

Aren't some of these buyers GST registered so they claim the bit back on initial purchase then with inflation govt gets bigger bit of their risk when they decide to sell..

No.
You can't claim GST on the purchase or inputs relating a residential rental property.

[Ixion]

,,

BTW Income tax has only been around for just over 100 years. It wasnt implemented in the UK until 1911. A method of paying the government to tell you how much you have to pay them and for them to then tell you that they do not have enough to do as those they represent wish. Self perpetuating

Not so. Income tax was first introduced (in its modern form) by William Pitt the Younger in 1799 . Repealed by Addington during the short lived Peace of Amiens, but reintroduced by that same on the resumption of hotilities in 1803.

Repealed again in 1816 following the Bourbon Restoration, but reintroduced by Sir Robert Peel in 1842, and made permanent (ie it did not need to be completely relegislated each year) in 1874.The buggers could not keep their hands off other peoples money.

The Budget of 1911 introduced an extension to tax the Unearned Increment, a form of capital gains tax.

[Dai]

Not so. Income tax was first introduced (in its modern form) by William Pitt the Younger in 1799 . Repealed by Addington during the short lived Peace of Amiens, but reintroduced by that same on the resumption of hotilities in 1803.

Repealed again in 1816 following the Bourbon Restoration, but reintroduced by Sir Robert Peel in 1842, and made permanent (ie it did not need to be completely relegislated each year) in 1874.The buggers could not keep their hands off other peoples money.

The Budget of 1911 introduced an extension to tax the Unearned Increment, a form of capital gains tax.

Thanks for the information. I have spent years under the original supposition. Its always good to be corrected.

I lived in Wales for years and there you can still see evidence of when the gov tried to introduce a "window glass tax". Rows of houses with bricked up windows.

I remeber the riots when the gov tried to bring in the poll tax, real fun.

Govs are always trying new ways to rip of those tyhey are supposed to be supporting. They take the word government too literally.

[doc]

No.
You can't claim GST on the purchase or inputs relating a residential rental property.

I'm surprised that you can't if your'e running a rental property as business ie you intend to speculate. For example if the property boom did collapse and turn ito a loss, you would be unable to claim it against your income as a loss. But surely you can claim maintaince and interest costs. Pardon my ignorance but I have been assessed by investment advisers as "Recklessly Conservitive"

[doc]

The cuntry is fucked, nothing can be done (IMHO) to get it sorted as there are way too many different veiwpoints. Another reason I joined the army, so that I can get told what to do and only have to make desisions for myself and my team in a situation and never have to take responsibility for it.

Now if you will excuse me, I have a nurse coming to shave my stomach

Tell you what Sniper if thats your genuine attitude your gunna have some problems adjusting to civi life when your 20 years is up. Been there done that got the T shirt. It aint easy adjusting with that for the attitude.

[The Stranger:Me]

I'm surprised that you can't if your'e running a rental property as business ie you intend to speculate. For example if the property boom did collapse and turn ito a loss, you would be unable to claim it against your income as a loss. But surely you can claim maintaince and interest costs. Pardon my ignorance but I have been assessed by investment advisers as "Recklessly Conservitive"

Speaking strictly residential only here.
Rentals were exempt from GST. You can not charge GST, nor do you account to the IRD for GST on rental income. Thus the IRD has no income from this source against which to balance the outgoing so no they do not allow it.

If you are speculating I would suspect the case would be different, however a property developer or speculator is in a different class and not really considered to be a property investor.

Much as the distinction between share investor or a share trader.

Even so, if you could claim GST on your residential purchase, you would no doubt have to pay GST on the resale, so would you really want to?

[Winston001]

Even so, if you could claim GST on your residential purchase, you would no doubt have to pay GST on the resale, so would you really want to?

Spot on. A professional landlord doesn't claim or pay GST on house sale and purchases unless he is trading in houses ie. buying and selling houses as well as renting them out. At that point, GST is payable but is also the least of his worries - he is up for income tax on what would normally be (for the rest of us) a capital gain.

[Winston001]

BTW Income tax has only been around for just over 100 years. It wasnt implemented in the UK until 1911. A method of paying the government to tell you how much you have to pay them and for them to then tell you that they do not have enough to do as those they represent wish.

Ixion has already explained this is incorrect. There have been taxes since before recorded history. They were called "tribute" and were paid to the tribal leader for various rights and favours. As populations grew, such payments were demanded by towns so you could cross their territory, hunt on their land, sell/trade stuff.

Taxes are not new. The reason governments change them from time to time is that they are constantly trying to find the ideal taxation system. A system which is fair to the greatest number of people with the least political pain.

I hate tax but I like schools, roads, and hospitals, so shrug and carry on.