ACC Survey

**madandy** · 15th December 2006, 11:35

I don't live in Auckland but I do ride around there a fair bit...have E-mailed a reply anyways.
Any extra prizes for attatching a bright orange flag on a tall stick to our bikes?

**davereid** · 15th December 2006, 11:37

Extra shiny coats wont help you be seen.

I've had drivers make eye contact, and then pull out in front of me. I've also had them pass me, then turn right in front of me.

I think its all to do with the way the brain processes information. We evolved from animals that were hunting other animals, and being hunted themselves. So our brain is very good at processing data that involves prey, or threats.

Mostly when we are driving, we are relying on primitive parts of the brain. We sometimes cant even remember parts of our trip yet we were driving perfectly, cos age old parts of the brain were in charge.

And when drivers are in that auto-pilot mode, and come to an intersection to give way, when we see a car or truck, the brain recognises the threat, and we do something about it. But smaller objects don't pass the threshold, and even though we see them, they arent processed and we dont deal with it correctly.

Thats why I get cut off or ignored lots more on my scooter than I do on my Harley. I simply am recognised as a threat when I'm on the Harley, even though I am very little more visable than when I'm on my scooter.

And its the same in reverse - I know I am more vulnerable on my bike, so my brain does a better job of identifing threats, and so I ride my bike much better than I drive my car.

**Ixion** · 15th December 2006, 11:37

Originally Posted by madandy

I don't live in Auckland but I do ride around there a fair bit...have E-mailed a reply anyways.
Any extra prizes for attatching a bright orange flag on a tall stick to our bikes?

I tried that, but it wasn't very successful. Too hard to get a stick that didn't have issues at speed, ditto the flag, they disintegrated or tore off, and the sticky out stick thing, if long enough to be useful, would hit stuff when banked over. But I'd be interested to hear from anyone who had better results

**Crisis management** · 15th December 2006, 11:41

Ixion, you need fluoro gaiters so when you go arse over kite we can find you again....just a friendly tip from your local ACC office!

Did the survey but wasn't impressed with the narrowness of it, what is to be gained from it?

**davereid** · 15th December 2006, 11:43

Whats to be gained ? Compulsory fluro-pink jackets for all bikers. For your own safety of course !

**sunhuntin** · 15th December 2006, 11:57

Originally Posted by davereid

Whats to be gained ? Compulsory fluro-pink jackets for all bikers. For your own safety of course !

10 effin chars

**MSTRS:Me** · 15th December 2006, 12:02

Originally Posted by davereid

Whats to be gained ? Compulsory fluro-pink jackets for all bikers. For your own safety of course !

But only for Aucklanders, since the majority of us are excluded from adding our 2 cents worth...

**vifferman** · 15th December 2006, 12:04

I've had seven (7) significant accidents, and hi-viz would've made not the slightest bit of difference:
1. I clipped a car, because it was dusk, dim lighting, and I was wearing a blue-tinted visor.
2. A cyclist crossed my path without turning her head to look. I hit her because (a) I was going a bit quick, and (b) I was a relative noob, and hadn't learned to use the front brake properly.
3. A car failed to give way to the right on an uncontrolled intersection. A sharp thump in the centre of the car (and a subsequent bill for the damages for their car and my bike) soon gave them the learn.
4. I lowsided on a squashed softdrink can, because I didn't see it as I tipped in to the corner. Oh wait - THIS one would've been helped by hi-viz, if the CAN had been wearing it! It had all the paint abraded off, so it blended too well with the asphalt.

5. I hit a pedestrian who stepped in front of me, after I'd slowed, tootled the horn melodiously, then swerved. She didn't see me, because the silly bitch turned AWAY from me! Perhaps if I'd had flashing hi-viz clothes, she might've seen the glare reflecting from a nearby building or other traffic?
Never mind - a leg broken in two places, a week spent in hospital reflecting on her idiocy, and a bill for $3k helped give her the learn...
6. A BMW driver suddenly decided she was in the wrong lane, and changed lanes, confirminating as she went. I think she might've looked AFTER I hit the deck, because she stopped.
7. I hit a car that u-turned into me. He may have looked when he first took off from the kerb/curb/kurb/cerb/kirb, but he sure as hell didn't check his mirrors again before he cracked the u-turn WITHOUT INDICATING!

Anyway, as others have said, hi-viz gear is teh ghey, flaps, is hard to put on, and sux. Even if it was compulsory, I wouldn't wear it.
Fuck the Safety Nazis.

**Whynot** · 15th December 2006, 12:13

Originally Posted by vifferman

Fuck the Safety Nazis.

hear hear

**vifferman** · 15th December 2006, 12:13

Originally Posted by davereid

So our brain is very good at processing data that involves prey, or threats.

Here's an interesting observation (or not).
Back in the days when my bike appeared to be black (it was actually "Granite Blue Metallic" - i.e., black), I temporarily was in the position of having two bike jackets and a couple of choices of glubs. When I was commuting wearing ALL black (coz my helmet was black, as were boots, pants, leather jacket), people actually moved out of my way more than when I wore my red/black jacket and ghey Spidi Pro 1 glubses (black/yellow/white/silver).
Why?
Because it was more threatening.

I've had a guy on an all-black VTR, with black Roof helmet, dark visor, all black gear and loud pipes come up behind me, and even though I was on my bike (which was kewler), I found it somewhat threatening. The blackness, and not being able to see a face or anything resembling a face is quite a threat. Why do you think Darth Vader was all black, with dark visor, even though he turned out to be such a pussy? (not that I've actually ever seen any Star Wars movies. Well... maybe just the first and second ones, which apparently were actually the fourth and fifth ones, or summat...)

**vifferman** · 15th December 2006, 12:18

Originally Posted by Whynot

hear hear

Seriously. If you think about it for any length of time, it becomes very apparent that the Safety Nazis are fucking up the world. Not just because it's getting more boring, but because they're taking away our freedom, and poisoning the way people think and act.
The latest bit of stupidity? In The Harold this morning, a church in someplace somewhere has banned real candles for Christmas vigils by kids, because "their hair might catch on fire"

even though in the bazillion and seven years they've been doing it, there had been no such incidents reported.
FFS!! Hair (apart from Michael Jackson's) isn't even particularly flammable.
But maybe they're right: maybe today's kids are so namby-pambied, cuddled and cossetted, and unadventurous, that they don't know how to handle dangerous things like candles...

**Nutter34** · 15th December 2006, 12:19

Well, I'd like to think that a headlight is way more noticeable than a flouro vest will ever be. Specially considering there will be fairings, tank bags, etc. blocking the view when seen from the front. If plebs in cars don't even notice said headlight, what difference is a vest going to make?

Maybe vests are useful when viewed from the side as on motorways but then you're still relying on said car pleb to do a head check, ie a blindspot check.

As for my gear, wear full leathers most of my rides and if I use the bike at night, the gear has reflective strips... Once again, if they miss the lights, reflective strips won't make any difference.

**Whynot** · 15th December 2006, 12:22

Originally Posted by vifferman

Seriously. If you think about it for any length of time, it becomes very apparent that the Safety Nazis are fucking up the world. Not just because it's getting more boring, but because they're taking away our freedom, and poisoning the way people think and act.
The latest bit of stupidity? In The Harold this morning, a church in someplace somewhere has banned real candles for Christmas vigils by kids, because "their hair might catch on fire"

even though in the bazillion and seven years they've been doing it, there had been no such incidents reported.
FFS!! Hair (apart from Michael Jackson's) isn't even particularly flammable.
But maybe they're right: maybe today's kids are so namby-pambied, cuddled and cossetted, and unadventurous, that they don't know how to handle dangerous things like candles...

I am all too familiar with safety nazi-ism ....
work is covered in it, we are barely able to take a shit without filling in an incident report

**Ixion** · 15th December 2006, 12:25

In Auckland type traffic, I don't think headlights are particularly noticeable nowdays.

Reason is that headlights used to stand out because they were *different*. The thing about people noticing something that is a threat is valid, but people also notice something that their brain can't "classify". In the jungle, the unknown is assumed to be dangerous. A headlight in daytime used to invoke a "WTF is that?" reaction.

But now there are so many lights , and a lot of cages have headlights on too, so the novelty factor is gone. And peole don't notice them any more.

I think the same thing is happening with Hi vis vests now so many people are wearing them, roads works crew, truck drivers etc. People used to notice them because they stood out , they weren't part of the familiar scenary. Now they've just become part of the "normal background"