Age vs performance:

[MikeyG]

Check out the Aussie LAMS system for bikes. It is based on power to weight ratio with a maximum weight and maximum power limits, only available in some states though.

The same states do not allow learner or restricted drivers to drive V8's or turbos.

We need some compulsary driver training as well.

From what I heard though the driver of the crashed teens was unlicensed/suspended license so more license restrictions would have had no effect on the end result.

[crack]

From what I see, no one wants more laws, and yes from a technology point of view, the ability to remotely shut a vehicle down, or track it has been with us for some time.
I do not think this the answer either.

Q: Do the police cars have GPS DATA recording?.

While no one like more LAWS, I do think, and this is only my opinion, that some of the LAWS we have are totally stupid, and needless, while as in the case of AGE vs PERFORMANCE I think we are lacking and have not evolved as have our cousins across the ditch:

As with all things you cannot please all the people all the time:

I am of the opinion the the Govt of the day,doesn't Govern, it leaves industry and commerce to regulate itself, and it developes consultants for this and that, that we pay for, in the mean time mayhem continues.

If I was to ask those that are parents , how they would react as I described in the posting, if the copper gave your son a kick in the backside and bought him home to you, how would you react:

If you are a Teenager, or slightly elder how would you react:

While I agree that most young drivers have generally good driving skills, it is the decision making process that goes with the young that is the problem.

IE: Peer pressure, all of a sudden in a situation outside of their control, I don't think we can just say re- education is the way to resolve it, teenagers and those in their 20's, will by nature do dumb things, the problem as I see it is that we have nothing in the system that will allow for the idiocy of youth.

Again I think we the elder need to be moulding the younger, this can only be done by parenting and good laws:

No one teach's us how to be parents, we use by and large, how we were bought up as a yard stick, and alter what we think we could do better in, or ignor and try something else all together.

As Jim said 20-1 success:

But one thing I absolutely abhore is the needless and sensless loss of young lives:

As some on here are in no doubt Coppers, Ambo's, Dr's, Nurses, Teachers, Lawyers, Judges, F--K probably even the odd POLITICIAN, I think that we need something, and the postings, I think refect this.

But hey I don't have the answers, only thoughts, and opinions.

[RT527]

Q: Do the police cars have GPS DATA recording?.

Yup And Laptops

If I was to ask those that are parents , how they would react as I described in the posting, if the copper gave your son a kick in the backside and bought him home to you, how would you react:

Id shake the coppers hand ...take my boy inside and give him another kick in the bum

[NighthawkNZ:Me]

Id shake the coppers hand ...take my boy inside and give him another kick in the bum

ditto...

[crack]

My 2 cents worth: DITTO also:

And correction, that should read 1 in 20 success:

[Ixion]

If I was to ask those that are parents , how they would react as I described in the posting, if the copper gave your son a kick in the backside and bought him home to you, how would you react:

When I was a young rider, that was the ultimate humiliation and degradation (except, I guess, crashing. that would have been naff beyond measure, but noone did that I recall, or if they did, they made sure to keep it a deep secret). To be brought home in the Snakemobile for the Snake to have a long chat with Mum and Dad.And your bike was taken to Snake Central, where it had to be collected the next day. But not by you, it had to be collected by Mum or Dad. Who had to have ANOTHER long chat with Snake Senior. (I doubt there was the slightest legislative warrant for any of this. But noone was going to argue with a Snake - we weren't *THAT* stupid)

Never happened to me, though one time I only got out of it by grovelling magnificently and swearing by everything I could think of that I'd never do anything foolish ever again, I've learned my lesson etc etc. Bastard did make me push the bike all the way home though, while he rode behind.

Did happen to several mates. It took a LONG time to live down the ignominy ("Hah, yer Mum got yer bike back for you yet, jeez fancy being carted home in the snakemobile like a lost kid yah yah "). And yes, the miscreant could be sure of a damn good clip round the ears from Dad, a long woeful dirge from Mum (" Why do you want that nasty dangerous thing, it's only cos we love you etc etc" - which actually hurt more than the clip round the ears), and in bad cases the invocation of Gran or Aunty or some other feared matriarch (" I always knew you'd come to no good, just going to break your poor Mother's heart , etc etc").And it went without saying that the errant one would be "grounded" for a LONG time. The shame of it, having the neighbours see the Snakemobile in the drive, Mum would never live it down.

Needless to say, I now think it an excellent scheme, and should I have a child brought home in like circumstance, the necessary clip would be promptly administered (and damn Sue Bradford), with thanks to the snake and apologies for wasting his time.

EDIT. I think it was the local SnakeShop that the bike had to be collected from, not Snake Central.

[Mr. Peanut]

I'm not paying for a better system thank you very much! I've got stadiums to build...

[Pixie]

I'm bored with this discussion.
Has anyone considered leaving the deadshits to kill themselves?
I'm more concerned should they survive long enough to reproduce

[imdying]

Has anyone considered leaving the deadshits to kill themselves?
I'm more concerned should they survive long enough to reproduce

The problem is they sometimes take others with them.

Sterilization I agree with though. Bit tough to dish out willy nilly though. Use it in place of the death sentence... take some of their swimmers on ice, on the off chance at a later date they are proven to be innocent because it does happen, and then sterlize them. This is of course on top of the regular sentence.

[Hillbilly]

Check out the Aussie LAMS system for bikes. It is based on power to weight ratio with a maximum weight and maximum power limits, only available in some states though....

Three good examples of this rule are the GS500(f) the Hyosung GT650/Comet 650 and the Ducati Monster 620.

The Suzukis are straight forward, 48hp 500cc, with a dry weight of 180kg. Now, the Ducati and the Hyosung are made in special LAMS versions, both restricted. I can only speak with cerainty about the Hyosung GT650 series. The bikes have longer carbie slides that don't fully open, restricting the rev range to just over 6,000 where things get athsmatic . The power output is dropped from 79hp to around 45hp. They're sold that way, and then when the owner gets their "P-Plates" (provisional licence) they can have it de-restricted for aroung $165 AUD back to the full 79hp. The GT650R weighs 195kg dry thanks to the twin spar steel frame. If it had an alloy frame like it's cousin the SV650, it wouldn't be LAMS approved.

The Ducatis however, are not able to be de-restricted. The LAMS "Lite" version of the Monster 620 weighs 177kg dry with an unspecified hp rating. Don't take my word for it. Check it out yourself here:

http://www.ducati.com.au/MOnster620lite.php

Just think, a Learner's own Ducati. Isn't OZ wonderful....

DUCATI MONSTER PRICE LIST

M 620 Dark/Lite 2-Disc Lite learner legal, ACT, NSW, TAS, SA
2006 AU$ 11995.00 NZ$ 14795.00

M 620 Av. in Learner Legal Version ACT, NSW, TAS, SA
2006 AU$ 12795.00 NZ$ 15795.00

[Lou Girardin]

I liek the idea of having limits on the vehicles available but should be more relevant to persons experience - alot of young drivers whom are doing rally racing and track racing whom i would allow to be exempt from limited car CC rating due to experience, same with bikes -.

Racing experience has nearly nothing to do with public road driving skills. There's more to driving safely on the road than car control.

[Mr. Peanut]

Why dont you just ask their teachers. Make driver training a part of the public school system, and set individual limits according to behaviour and ability.

[onearmedbandit]

Yeah, 'cos schools do such a great job as they are.

[LilSel]

Havent read the whole thread... but from the first one...

Why let teenage BOY racers, who think they have big dicks cuz they have fast cars, ruin it for everyone else???

I am 22.... I have had my car (Subaru 2L twin turbo) for a few years now... and not once have I crashed... Sure I can go stupidly fast in it... but its about being responsible... same with my bike... only 250... but still hauls when I twist the wrist... there is a time and a place for that tho.

I would've be gutted if I was not able to have my car/bike due to age.

It wouldnt matter if a boy racer was in a mini or on a pushbike... they'd find ways to go fast... it all comes down to being responsible and making educated decisions.... who's to say that they wouldnt just STEAL a car that goes fast seeming as they couldnt legally own one??!! or mummy n daddys cars being taken for joy rides=more accidents....

[Waylander]

Havent read the whole thread... but from the first one...

Why let teenage BOY racers, who think they have big dicks cuz they have fast cars, ruin it for everyone else???

Are you trying to imply that boys are the only idiot drivers? lol how many here have been cut off or had some other inconsiderate move done y a woman driving a car no matter the age.

Boys just do it all in one lump of years,women drag it out for thier entire lives lol


BTW, I'm stirring.