When is a BMW not a BMW?

[clint640]

Well that just torpedoed that range.

The G650X is going to be a dead duck to all but the most one eyed BMW enthusiast come next April anyway. When the 690 Enduro KTM arrives with more hp, less weight, more fuel range, & based on rumours of US pricing, a price tag up to $5k less than the BMW, why the hell would you buy one?

It's hard to see why you'd buy one now actually when you can get a new TE610 Husky for $12k, but a lot of people are wary of Husky's reliability & support I spose.

Cheers
Clint

[warewolf]

The G650X is going to be a dead duck to all but the most one eyed BMW enthusiast

Not sure that the G series is targetting only the people who shit blue & white. Part of the raison d'être of the G bikes is to target a wider audience, which would include poeple who's values don't align with the aforementioned.

Shifting manufacturing to mainland Asia is the way of the world these days; Triumph have done it with some of the Bonnie range.

However China is still a difficult place to do business; anecdotally it is very common for quality to drop off significantly after the initial deal is done and early production approved.

But yes, I get your point vis-à-vis the 2008 KTM 690 Enduro:

[clint640]

Not sure that the G series is targetting only the people who shit blue & white. Part of the raison d'être of the G bikes is to target a wider audience, which would include poeple who's values don't align with the aforementioned.

True indeed. I really like the G-X's, they're well thought out & nicely put together. But at $17k they are priced so far into the stratosphere compared with the $9-$12k competition that you'd need a serious roundel fetish to consider one. Any real or perceived drop in quality from chinese manufacture would quickly rule out that set & spell the end for the G-X series.

Cheers
Clint

[cooneyr]

$8,898 us = $11,700 NZ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (at current rates)

Wasnt the 625 SXC/640 LC4 retailing for $13k?

Whats the self supporting rear tank? Is there a rear subframe or does the tank replace it?

Cheers R

[clint640]

$8,898 us = $11,700 NZ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (at current rates)

Wasnt the 625 SXC/640 LC4 retailing for $13k?

Whats the self supporting rear tank? Is there a rear subframe or does the tank replace it?

Cheers R

Yep, with the 2 obvious competitors for the 690E $5k apart in pricing (TE610 & G650X-Ch) It'll be interesting what they come in at. I reckon if they really want to sell a heap the $12k mark would do it, then everybody buying DR650/XT600 type stuff would be very tempted to just shell out a little extra... much more $$ & they'll only sell as quickly as the old 640, ie. not very. Gunna be at the local dealer who have one on order 2mrw so I'll ask.

The 625/640E have been priced at $14-$16k retail over the last few years, but they've been pretty slow moving so most of em have gone out as runout stock from $11-13k

It is a self supporting rear tank, no subframe. I reckon I could build some pannier racks to go on it pretty quick though.

Cheers
Clint

[The Stranger:Me]

I guess its a bit like all those Holden Commodore lovers

Some of them are made in Korea, I always thought they were crap, but this reinforces that

So koreans are too thick to assemble cars?

[HenryDorsetCase]

Not sure that the G series is targetting only the people who shit blue & white. Part of the raison d'être of the G bikes is to target a wider audience, which would include poeple who's values don't align with the aforementioned.

Shifting manufacturing to mainland Asia is the way of the world these days; Triumph have done it with some of the Bonnie range.

However China is still a difficult place to do business; anecdotally it is very common for quality to drop off significantly after the initial deal is done and early production approved.

But yes, I get your point vis-à-vis the 2008 KTM 690 Enduro:

I would love to have a KTM 690 Duke in my garage...... same motor but full roadbike.

If it was cheap enough.......................

[avgas]

I remember years ago some bloody Korean company, building suzuki bikes, shippin them off to japan, then sending them to us under the Suzuki brand.
Most people were none the wiser.
I hear they have their own brand now days - something starting with H....

[PeteJ]

Yep, I think you'll be right there, even the japs would make shit if they didn't have the quality control in place, I reckon BMW will be onto it enough to not accept any duds, after all, the chinese have been making small bikes for the big 4 for a few years now, although we don't get them besides the GN250, so can't really comment on the quality.

You'll be lucky to see BMW drop there prices though!

Suzuki AX100s sold new in NZ have been made in China for years, DH.

Come to that, plenty of US badged machines' componentry is made in eastern Asia, too.

Going on comments on various overseas adventure riding forums, my own experience of declining BMW quality since my first BM (in the early 1970s) through to recent times has plenty of parallels. I would not be very surprised to see BMW reputation for quality start to improve again with Asian-made product.

Some would say that quality to match the present pricing would be a good thing to see.

PS I have personal experience that a well-known designer known personally to me was contracted a couple of years ago to design a motorcycle engine range for one of the Chinese manufacturers. They are prepared to spend money, and to look internationally, to do things properly.

[SPman]

I guess its a bit like all those Holden Commodore lovers

Some of them are made in Korea, I always thought they were crap, but this reinforces that

No Commodores are made in Korea - do you mean the current Barina, which is.
Which is why we didn't buy one!
Got a Hyundai Getz 1.6 Hatch instead - 25,000k in the last 9 months and its great.

[avgas]

"Don't touch those bloody Japanese cars, they are crap"

They never were, look how many ratty shitbox corollas/civics still exist.....compare the maintenace of them to the equivelent mini, holden, ford, austin, jag, chev.....
Ideas change, people change - but some stuff is the same over a long period of time.
As for the new holdens built by Daewoo.
I reluctanly got one as a work car - and i can say they are fantastic, and feel alot better than most of the Japanese/Euro cars i have owned. Holden do quite alot of work on them so they suit NZ/Aus conditions.
When i did some research i found that there was nothing wrong with Daewoo - just an image that Korean cars were crap.
As you probably know now....that is not the case.

[PeteJ]

They never were, look how many ratty shitbox corollas/civics still exist.....compare the maintenace of them to the equivelent mini, holden, ford, austin, jag, chev.....
Ideas change, people change - but some stuff is the same over a long period of time.
As for the new holdens built by Daewoo.
I reluctanly got one as a work car - and i can say they are fantastic, and feel alot better than most of the Japanese/Euro cars i have owned. Holden do quite alot of work on them so they suit NZ/Aus conditions.
When i did some research i found that there was nothing wrong with Daewoo - just an image that Korean cars were crap.
As you probably know now....that is not the case.

Yeah, it's a continuum of development, all right.

The ratty shitbox Corollas/Civics keep on going after abuse that the equivalent Mini and Jaguar could never have taken (personal experience in each of these cases - and I still have Triumphs and a Jaguar, because I just like 'em, not because they are in any way better than Japanese alternatives).

Though I have no personal experience, I would not be at all surprised if the Korean cars turn out to be even more durable. There are certainly rustpile Jappers around, just as there are British and - to return to topic - BMW models that are notorious for rust.

[Motu]

They never were, look how many ratty shitbox corollas/civics still exist.....compare the maintenace of them to the equivelent mini, holden, ford, austin, jag, chev.....

As for the new holdens built by Daewoo.
.

You obviously weren't there at the beginning - early Jap cars were a joke,but they got better....so will Chinese stuff.I remember one of our customers sold his nice PA Vauxhall and got a Hino Contessa,it just about sent the poor old bugger broke.He just had to keep fixing it as it was a total orphan that no one wanted.My boss really hated having to tell the guy it was going to cost a shit load more to fix this time,and time and time again.I once worked on one of the first Toyota's in the country - a Toyopet.It was an aircooled flat twin of zero horsepower,with an auto trans that sapped it into the negatives.What a piece of crap that thing was.

Daewoo have been making cars for GM for a long time - the Pontiac Le Mans was a Daewoo,and they were made in the mid '80's.