Campervan accident - I'm puzzled how...

[Duc]

I think I will give up riding. Seems that there was nothing to learn and no matter how far or large the space is...there is no avoiding a head on according to some opinions here.

@Usarka : I never implied the following riders could have been riding better/slower/safer etc. Not my call and I said we do not know those details anyway. My question was "can I ride better/safer by learning from this because I did not understand how it happened to the following riders"

Why do we ride if it is so inevitable and unavoidable - now seems irresponsible to me for my family and friends sake?

[jrandom]

I think I will give up riding.

Toodles then!

[R6_kid:Me]

I think I will give up riding. Seems that there was nothing to learn and no matter how far or large the space is...there is no avoiding a head on according to some opinions here.

...

Why do we ride if it is so inevitable and unavoidable - now seems irresponsible to me for my family and friends sake?

You sound like a little moaning bitch.

If you are walking down the road and someone throws something at you unexpectedly I think it would hit you... question is how often does this happen?

The same thing applies to this situation. The first guy had no time to respond, and his friend behind him, even at say 20m back wouldnt have had much chance to avoid the oncoming van. Remember we are dealing with a moving object head out of a curve trying to correct itself back on course.

It would be my guess that the final two bikes would possibly have tried to avoid the accident rather than stopping completely. If a vehicle is coming towards you going off to one side, your survival reaction is to go the opposite, if the other vehicle was trying to change direction at the time and you were unaware then you just put yourself in it's direction of travel. Just like when you walk up to someone and both go the same way to avoid each other, expect that we do it at 2kmh and usually stop first. Not at a total speed of say 160kmh, with lots of momentum and fuck all room to stop or maneuver.

Biking is a risk, and this could have just as easily been four people in a car being killed. If being on the road scares you so much then perhaps it is better you throw in the towel all together and buy a teleporter.

[Duc]

So many in this Forum can't discuss anything serious without insulting someone.

20 metres back ! Good luck. What gang do you ride with?

[Ixion]

Gangs ride tighter than 20mtr. Close stagger in town, front of your front wheel level with the rear of your wheelman's rear wheel (but offset cos it's a stagger). Highway, loose stagger ,one bike length between (complicated bits, maybe more, take your lead from the Ride Captain or Pack Leader). And you better not fuck up. You really had better not fuck up!

[sunhuntin]

Biking is a risk, and this could have just as easily been four people in a car being killed. If being on the road scares you so much then perhaps it is better you throw in the towel all together and buy a teleporter.

or wrap yourself in cotton wool...

[avrflr]

I think I will give up riding. Seems that there was nothing to learn and no matter how far or large the space is...there is no avoiding a head on according to some opinions here.

@Usarka : I never implied the following riders could have been riding better/slower/safer etc. Not my call and I said we do not know those details anyway. My question was "can I ride better/safer by learning from this because I did not understand how it happened to the following riders"

Why do we ride if it is so inevitable and unavoidable - now seems irresponsible to me for my family and friends sake?

There's a long thread by Katman where he says, amongst other things, that motorcycling is no more inherently dangerous than other forms of transport and that, due to his great skill and exceptional judgement, he is extremely unlikely to crash.

Katman is a troll, but we are all guilty of this kind of hubris to some degree. Duc, you want to believe you won't be taken out by an oncoming vehicle because you leave such a large following distance. A large following distance is a good idea, but the only 100% safe following distance is from the vehicle in front all the way to the back of your gargre.

We put ourselves in a vulnerable position by riding a bike on the road. We put our lives in the hands of thousands of strangers, many of whom aren't worthy of that trust. Chances are, one day you will find yourself in a situation on the road where no amount of skill, caution or good judgment will save you.

We gamble with our own lives and the payoff is the enjoyment motorcycling brings us. We should make an honest assessment of the risk even if that is less comforting than blind faith.

As for having children ride pillion, I personally don't think it's worth gambling. Just my opinion.

[Duc]

I concur with all you say.

I will continue to give myself the best chance possible by riding to the conditions as I see them at the time. I am happiest riding solo in my own rythm and space anyway but this accident really made me think about group riding and possible consequences.

Wonder what would have happened if it had of been four cars in the same situation?


Ride safe everyone.

As I type this - another biker down on the news - @ Maungatarata (Police Car involved) !!!!!!!

[MaxB]

Don't give up biking, just accept that there are risks you can do very little about.

As for leaving the correct stopping distance, great in theory but since you are in Auckland you would know that continually dropping back to maintain the gap up here is just an invite for dumbfucks to pull out on you. So you have to compromise to stay in one peice.

[Duc]

I am not giving up biking.

(I was making a point at the time because I felt some responders were overly fatalistic)

[Paul in NZ]

This accident had stuff all to do with following distances and a lot to do with circumstance and just plain bad luck - the chances of ALL the factors coming together again in one spot are not worth worrying about.

You cannot manage some circumstances - despite our best efforts.

[Duc]

......Bingo.