Vehicle noise tests - New rules

[Pixie]

There will be some who will consider this as being bad for the bike but ....... Back on the farm we would roll up some chicken wire and shove it up the exhaust to kill the noise when required. Don't leave it in too long or it'll soot up and kill the power big time, but this was quick, easy and effective.

What would be bad,would be to use a whole chicken

[huck farley]

A stamping into the OEM exhaust end can reads TRIUMPH in a square box has the letter and numbers E11
Then goes on to say Quote: This Triumph exhaust system 2200372 meets US EPA noise emissions requirements of 80 db (A) for the following motorcycles SMT or MLN 750 1050
The installation of the system on motorcycles other than specified may violate federal law (unquote)

Now this is saying to me I cannot put this exhaust system on another bike less than 750cc or not above 1050cc

But it doesn't say that I can't replace it. I have a REMUS end can on it at the moment and it has a removable baffle. With the baffle out it is very noisy. But with it in is very quiet, and has a lovely note to the ear.
As I will be away on the bike when the yearly WOF runs out. I took the bike into a testing station to have the WOF renewed.

I sat in the waiting room whilst my bike went through. I got the nod to pick the bike up and I was issued with a new WOF the examiner said to me he loves the Moto GP look of my aftermarket can, and also commented how nice it sounded without being obnoxious. Wished me compliments of the season and I rode of a happy chappie. So as Defiant explains it all depends who you strike at the testing station on the day. And what mood he is in (I guess)

The other thing that I may or may not have been right to think was that the OEM system was passed for Europe and the USA. standards...But not the Southern hemisphere. I stand to be corrected on the latter paragraph.

I changed to a Remus as I have soft luggage and the OEM is a high system and would have burned my soft luggage. Plus I didn't go for the Triumph luggage as they wanted $2700 for the full set. Plus the panniers were to small anyway. The pannier on the exhaust side had a cut away moulding inside of it to accommodate the Muffler, and made it an even a smaller capacity.

[huck farley]

What about my Harley?, its standed mufflers don't baffle shit, its over 110 dba with standed mufflers

Think it may be struggle to pass the test, being a harley. As to many rotton apples may have spoiled it for you. Then again who knows who you are going to strike on the day. I think a Monday would be a bad day.

[skidMark]

Get a WOF from a bike shop...

Very fast you learn young padawon.

[Defiant]

I think you may be confusing the rules about entry certification and those about in service testing (ie WoF).

All vehicles entering the country henceforth must meet the decibel limits set out. If they do not , even if the exhaust is standard, they will be rejected.(ie they will never getto be sold here)

But the situation is different for vehicles already in the country.

Here is the actual wording of the rule



Note the "or" that I have highlighted. If the exhaust is standard it must not be (significantly - note "similar") louder than when new - whatever that loudness may be. Or pass the decibel limits.



If you are being told that in service original good condition OEM silencers (ie ones which are not noiser than when new) will fail WoF then I believe that you are being misinformed and I would be happy for BRONZ to seek official clarification

EDIT: From the LTSA Q&A

Nope im not confused....I should know i am the one who has to comply vehicles to the new standards........all vehicles registered pre 1985 are subject to the old levels of 95 decibals for light vehicles and motorcycles over 125cm3 are to stay at 100 decibals....ALL cars registered after 1985 whether they have a WOF or not will have to comply to the new 90 decibal limit along with all newly registered vehicles, Motorcycles will REMAIN UNCHANGED at 100 decibals....THE DECIBAL LIMIT FOR BIKES OF THAT SIZE AND OVER IS 100 DECIBALS and has not and will not change!......the if a new bike in over 100 decibals it will have to be made to comply.....ALL bikes new or old WILL have to comply.....LISTEN CLOSELY!!!.....in the past you just had to get a WOF, now if the WOF tester THINKS its too loud you WILL need to get it complied or have it tested to show that it is on or under the decibal level that may mean having the exhaust modified to comply with the 100 decibal level....even before the new law you still had the limit but stuff all testers bothered to worry bout it so long as they thought it was reasonable....if you get a WOF and dont have a cert for the exhaust a cop MAY and CAN make you get it tested to prove it is on or under the 100 decibal limit for big bikes......

Geeeeze....read the whole damn thing would you i know what the shit is i am in the position with a heaps of others here that have to put up with the shit from customers when they think their bikes are legal and then get made to go and have a test done just to prove it.....the other thing is bikes i know are over the limit and i am the one who fitted the damn exhaust now i got to say to them sorry its too loud.....it all sux sorry to say bt what can we do ?

[Ixion]

Nope im not confused....I should know i am the one who has to comply vehicles to the new standards........all vehicles registered pre 1985 are subject to the old levels of 95 decibals for light vehicles and motorcycles over 125cm3 are to stay at 100 decibals....ALL cars registered after 1985 whether they have a WOF or not will have to comply to the new 90 decibal limit along with all newly registered vehicles, Motorcycles will REMAIN UNCHANGED at 100 decibals....THE DECIBAL LIMIT FOR BIKES OF THAT SIZE AND OVER IS 100 DECIBALS and has not and will not change!......the if a new bike in over 100 decibals it will have to be made to comply.....ALL bikes new or old WILL have to comply.....LISTEN CLOSELY!!!.....in the past you just had to get a WOF, now if the WOF tester THINKS its too loud you WILL need to get it complied or have it tested to show that it is on or under the decibal level that may mean having the exhaust modified to comply with the 100 decibal level....even before the new law you still had the limit but stuff all testers bothered to worry bout it so long as they thought it was reasonable....if you get a WOF and dont have a cert for the exhaust a cop MAY and CAN make you get it tested to prove it is on or under the 100 decibal limit for big bikes......

Geeeeze....read the whole damn thing would you i know what the shit is i am in the position with a heaps of others here that have to put up with the shit from customers when they think their bikes are legal and then get made to go and have a test done just to prove it.....the other thing is bikes i know are over the limit and i am the one who fitted the damn exhaust now i got to say to them sorry its too loud.....it all sux sorry to say bt what can we do ?

I'm sorry. some of what you are saying is simply totally at variance with both what LTSA are saying, and what the Rule states. Either LTSA are wrong or you are wrong.

Specifically:

You say

ALL cars registered after 1985 whether they have a WOF or not will have to comply to the new 90 decibal limit along with all newly registered vehicles,

LTSA say

The following table lists the new objective tail-pipe noise test decibel limits:
Vehicle class............................................. .................................................. .......................dBA
Motorbikes with engine capacity of 125cm3 or less (classes LC, LD, LE).........................................96
Motorbikes with engine capacity of more than 125cm3 (classes LC, LD, LE)...................................100

Cars, 4x4s, light goods vehicles (classes MA, MB, MC and NA)
- if first registered in New Zealand before 1 June 2008.............................................. ..................95
- if first registered outside New Zealand before 1 January 1985
and first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.............................................. ........95
- if first registered outside New Zealand on or after 1 January 1985
and first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.............................................. .........90
- if a new vehicle first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.......................................90

and

4. Why does the limit for cars, 4x4s and light goods vehicles already in the fleet remain at 95dBA?

The Rule targets the gross emitters – those exceeding 95dBA. The current 95dBA limit for vehicles already in the fleet is retained to minimise the impact on these vehicles – the vast majority of which are already compliant. The Rule brings a reduction in overall fleet noise over time by reducing the limit to 90dBA for post-1985 vehicles entering the fleet.

That is quite clear. The 1985 bit refers ONLY to new entrants. The limit for any car registered in NZ before I June 2008 REMAINS at 95dB (there is no similar clause for existing fleet motorcycles, because, as you note, the limit for motorcycles is not changing)

With my BRONZ hat on, I am very concerned that compliance staff are at variance with LTSA public statements (and the LTSA statements appear to me to agree with the Rule). I will take the matter up officially with LTSA in the new year, when they return. With a view to having them correct thier official statements (if you are correct), or memorandumise compliance testers to clarify the requirements(if LTSA are correct)

[Defiant]

No confusion here iXION, we are but refering to different parts of the rule.

IE: - if first registered outside New Zealand before 1 January 1985
and first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.............................................. ........95
- if first registered outside New Zealand on or after 1 January 1985
and first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.............................................. .........90- if a new vehicle first registered in New Zealand on or after 1 June 2008.......................................90

The debate was originally about the harley's being louder than 100 decibals from standard with standard pipes(which most are not). If it was louder than 100 decibals from factory it would not have passed the test before the new law came in anyway, but usually got passed on the ear of the tester at the time of the WOF, so my argument originally was that the individual doing the WOF has the power to cost you $$ for a decibal test on a bike may very well pass and therefore a waste of $$ to the end customer, thus if you have a harley or any other bike of similar size that was thought to be legal regardless when it was registered it still has to comply with the 100 decibal limit. This has nothing to do with the OEM pipes being modified or not. If a new exhaust is fitted to the bike the new exhaust must not be noticably louder than the original assuming that the original was on or under the decibal limit but still has to meet the 100 decibal limit.

I can see that i should have been clearer and not mixed my comments between cars and bikes. I have two bikes of my own that i know won't pass both being around the 104 & 114 decibals and i have no intention to change them, when the time comes to deal with that problem when that time comes.

The addition to my argument was that if the fitter of such an exhaust thought it sounded OK, AND the wof station thought it was ok you got the wof.......NOW all the bikes we complied back then MAY have to be tested just to see if it passes, cause if a wof is issued and the bike gets pulled over the next day by a cop he MAY/CAN still send the bike to be tested anyway, if it doesnt pass we get pinched, and if it was a bike modified before the law we have to deal with the....." well you guys said it was ok all these other times!!!.....what are you gonna do bout it?" type shyt from the customer....From now on we intend to tell all customers that all new exhausts if the new exhaust is not a bolt on replacement for a factory system that we know will comply we will be charging and quoting for a compulsory decibal test.

[huck farley]

Ah, the enchanting poetry of your discourse. Seriously Huck when your arguments have merit it's easier for others to appreciate without a cloud of abuse obscuring your points...

Another Harley owner that hates me, (sigh) never mind, I can handle it. Be safe and have a happy and prosperous new year to you RDJ

[Conquiztador]

I had a look/read of this thread from since I did my initial post. And surprised re the postings. Why all the venting and venom on here? There is new laws passed monthly. Some will affect us more, some less. But they are here to stay. The lowering of noise is just part of the green image we are supposed to all embrace.

Count your self lucky re the dB levels in NZ for bikes. 100dB is not bad! There is countries in Europe where 85dB is max. And if you are caught riding a bike w/o a sticker on the pipes stating that they have been tested and are legal, your bike is off the road, plates gone, you have a fine and an addition to your demerits. Add to that a full re-Rego with all that it includes.

Again: When you get stopped on the road by the police and they are unhappy with your mufflers (or lack of..) and demand you get a new WOF, do what we have always done in the northern countries: Fit a set of quiet mufflers, ride to the station, get your WOF and you are on your way. Allow for 2 - 5 times a year. Part of biker life. (Same ones you got the WOF with in first place...)

But surely not worth getting pissed off with other bikers for???

[Ocean1]

But surely not worth getting pissed off with other bikers for???

Well I, for one, don't have a problem with other bikers. But I'm sure pissed about some fucker telling me how to live. Again.

Is it time to break out the 12 guage yet?

[Defiant]

Again: When you get stopped on the road by the police and they are unhappy with your mufflers (or lack of..) and demand you get a new WOF, do what we have always done in the northern countries: Fit a set of quiet mufflers, ride to the station, get your WOF and you are on your way. Allow for 2 - 5 times a year. Part of biker life. (Same ones you got the WOF with in first place...)

But surely not worth getting pissed off with other bikers for???

Exactly what i intend to do but didnt wanna say it....lol...cause i do EVERYTHING by the book!.....like most of them here....LMAO

if we followed EVERY law in the book we would probably have a boring existence and not have a dog called sue, take a crap on sunday, or some shyte like that......lol

There are some stupid laws out there and this just adds to them, if they wanted to clean NZ up they could start but making it compulsory for all suburbs to use wheelie bins instead of leaving half torn dog attacked rubbish bags on the street.....

[huck farley]

It is a good idea, annoying that you are going to piss customers off by saying they need to get it tested only to find out its perfectly legal. Extra expensive they have to shell out for. At least its only once I guess.

What happens when you meet another bloke next time around at the testing station. He says it's not legal. "to loud".

But, but, but, Sir I have this paper to say it is legal. It may have been then son, but I think it's been tampered with. So no WOF until It's been tested again....... Now this bull shit could be ongoing.

A bit like years ago we used to swap tyres with a mate who had good tyres to get a WOF after we got one. We would put the bald ones back on the car. But when pulled over by a cop. That WOF meant nothing. We just used to get booked for running around on tyres that didn't have sufficient tread depth....

[HRT]

Fair point about exhausts being tampered with, tyres not the best thing to compare to since they are an item that wears but I see your point.

The proposal for the car exhausts being certified was actually a picture of the exhaust system and some details about what was fitted to the vehicle at the time of certifying. Maybe cans on bikes are going to have to be stamped with a matching serial number to the cert or something similar to prove they are the right system for the cert?

Easy answer, don't go to VTNZ

[Defiant]

.......Maybe cans on bikes are going to have to be stamped with a matching serial number to the cert or something similar to prove they are the right system for the cert?

The stamp is what they intend to do but tell you one thing and all the guys here with there cert hats on........NO C@%T is gonna be stamping my cans, $2500 S/S system, I'll be stamping their fore head if thhey pull that shyt. Im gonna be swapping for a crap system if it gets tested. I wonder if the dicks down in parliment would mind if i stamp their flash campany cars with TAX PAYER OWNED! across the bonnet!.....

[huck farley]

The stamp is what they intend to do but tell you one thing and all the guys here with there cert hats on........NO C@%T is gonna be stamping my cans, $2500 S/S system, I'll be stamping their fore head if thhey pull that shyt. Im gonna be swapping for a crap system if it gets tested. I wonder if the dicks down in parliment would mind if i stamp their flash campany cars with TAX PAYER OWNED! across the bonnet!.....

Good call mate. No bastard will be stamping my exhaust system either!!