Countersteering

[GSVR]

Yes, it appears we do differ.
Wikipedia actually has a good explanation of what's going on for you, and I quote
"A gyroscope is a device for measuring or maintaining orientation, based on the principles of conservation of angular momentum. The device is a spinning wheel or disk whose axle is free to take any orientation. This orientation changes much less in response to a given external torque than it would without the large angular momentum associated with the gyroscope's high rate of spin."

And again

"The wheel responds to a force applied about the input axis by a reaction force about the output axis. The 3 axes are perpendicular, and this cross-axis response is the simple essence of the gyroscopic effect."

It is the cross axis response referred to above which causes the bike to tip in as a response to a force applied about the input axis.

centripedal force - is this similar to centripetal force? Again, from the source of all things true "centripetal force is the external force required to make a body follow a circular path at constant speed (speed being the magnitude of velocity). The force is directed inward, toward the center of the circle or "oriented toward the axis of rotation"; force which is directed outward is centrifugal force."
So remind me, what is the force you refer to above which, to quote you is "pushing the bike to the outside of the corner"?

Sorry should of just not used the term Centrepedal sp centripedal. I've always called it centrifugal myself but theres always some smart type that wants to be pedantic.

I'm sure you understand the force I'm talking about (The one that wants to throw you off the roundabout)

[OutForADuck]

Dude concentrate on your lines and getting those right. Counter steering is something you should be aware of but its very hard to practice well until you are in a position to put some real effort into it. i.e. when you are building speed and riding a ligther bike counter steering is just too powerful and requires such small inputs to really get it.

But when you start to build speed and need to turn with a lot more agression the effort required is much more and counter steering becomes invaluable.

So practice your lines (in wide, out narrow, turn in point when you can see the exit, in most corners) threading one corner into another, building entry speed and suddenly one day you will find you need to turn the bike ALOT quicker and you'll start yanking on those bars with some gusto and wow... counter steering will make alot of sense.

[CookMySock]

Hey OutForADuck,

Dude concentrate on your lines and getting those right.

Ok I have no problems with these. I can accurately choose whether my front tyre goes left or right of some tiny knobule on the road, even mid-corner. Mostly - but good enough for now. I can even counter-steer mid-corner and have brain power left to change gears. ...applause dies down. But it is still quite a mind warp just yet.

Counter steering is something you should be aware of but its very hard to practice well until you are in a position to put some real effort into it. i.e. when you are building speed and riding a ligther bike counter steering is just too powerful and requires such small inputs to really get it.

Yes, this is where I am up to now.

But when you start to build speed and need to turn with a lot more agression the effort required is much more and counter steering becomes invaluable.

Yes, this is the stage I am up to.

So practice your lines (in wide, out narrow, turn in point when you can see the exit, in most corners) threading one corner into another, building entry speed and suddenly one day you will find you need to turn the bike ALOT quicker and you'll start yanking on those bars with some gusto and wow... counter steering will make alot of sense.

Yes, I can do this now, but I occasionally suffer brain farts during this - rapidly followed by moments of sheer terror, hard braking, rubber streaks on road, flat spotted tyres, so more apexing ala speed is not the answer.

It seems I should ;

a. don't be in such a hurry and let my experience consolidate over time

b. take time out to just slow down and enjoy the bike without going hard

c. concentrate on steering accuracy and let the experience build

d. slow down

e. look where I want to go, ie eyeball my exit.

f. stop gazing into space cager-style and watch what I'm doing


Off to Rotovegas this afternoon so time for a little practice, but otherwise just a quiet ride.


whew!
DB

[Ocean1]

It seems I should ;

a. don't be in such a hurry and let my experience consolidate over time, AND SLOW DOWN
b. take time out to just slow down and enjoy the bike without going hard, AND SLOW DOWN

c. concentrate on steering accuracy and let the experience build, AND SLOW DOWN

d. slow down, AND SLOW DOWN

e. look where I want to go, ie eyeball my exit., AND SLOW DOWN

f. stop gazing into space cager-style and watch what I'm doing, AND SLOW FUCKING DOWN


Off to Rotovegas this afternoon so time for a little practice, but otherwise just a quiet ride.


whew!
DB

If you're focusing on those wee pebbles and practicing "missing" them you're not looking far enough ahead, just be aware of them and keep your eyes up to where you want to be after the corner.

And SLOW FUCKING DOWN, if you're panicing at any stage through the turn your entry speeds are too high.

[discotex]

This thread has reminded me of two things.

1. How the physics of countersteering work is not important. The forces are real whatever causes them. Much like understanding hydrodynamics is not a requirement to operating a pleasure boat.

That countersteering is the only way to lean a bike moving at any significant pace is all you need to know.

2. Lay people debating physics always leads to

[GSVR]

This thread has reminded me of two things.

1. How the physics of countersteering work is not important. The forces are real whatever causes them. Much like understanding hydrodynamics is not a requirement to operating a pleasure boat.

That countersteering is the only way to lean a bike moving at any significant pace is all you need to know.

2. Lay people debating physics always leads to

Sounds good. The KISS approach works for me.

How the physics of countersteering work is very important but not to ride a bike.

[CookMySock]

If you're focusing on those wee pebbles and practicing "missing" them you're not looking far enough ahead, just be aware of them and keep your eyes up to where you want to be after the corner.

Yes. Wilco roger dodger, Victor. Amen.

And SLOW FUCKING DOWN, if you're panicing at any stage through the turn your entry speeds are too high.

Yup will do. Thanks for that. Let my experience build first. For a while. Quite a while. Gawd its tempting innit tho o.O a car to pass!


DB

[The Stranger:Me]

Sounds good. The KISS approach works for me.

Yes, I can see that.

[GSVR]

After a full review of all the material in this thread, I can say with absolute certainty that you are a complete tosser.
Why is it that you feel the need to pontificate on subjects you obviously know nothing about?

Yes it is. It helps to clarify for anyone else reading this thread and getting as confused as you, as to how and why countersteering works, that all your posts on the subject should be ignored as you really haven't a clue.

Yes, I can see that.

You'll never get any respect on here by abusing people. Why doesn't anyone take my skibike example and show me where its flawed.

Just throwing abuse because my logic doesn't fit in with your ideas makes me have a very low opinion of you as a person.

[Blue Velvet]

KISS

Yes

Get a room.

[GSVR]

Get a room.

If I started stalking you could we get a room?


Might as well post a link. Any Newbies if you want to learn about countersteering ...

http://www.soundrider.com/archive/sa...lls/RS-cc1.htm

[jrandom]

KISS

Yes

[discotex]

haha yeah thats plain scary. He has nads tho - hez acting like its just not there..

DB

RideYourRide is the first vlogger I found. He's pretty funny. Mordeth13 is the other fav.

Riding along in one he's like "yeah you know this shit is real. I mean I could crash and die at any moment.. There'd be all these people thinking 'why the fuck has he got a camera in his face?' That'd be pretty funny... "

[CookMySock]

Since my opinion is obviously so offensive to some people, i'll just remove it.

I'm more than happy to be corrected if I get something wrong, i'm still learning. But to call me a fucktard because of it? A little over the top.

ok I'm sorry I neg rep'ed you ok ? I really wuz just fiddling with some forum feature that I just discovered, and the damn thing has bitten me on the arse really fucking bad actually. I know how hard it is to get by on a daily basis, and we all really just need a hand up and onwards, so heres mine, ok ?

C'mon lets get back to this sportsbike learning curve and just keep having fun.

I'm sorry.

Can we get this man a pie ?

Steve

[CookMySock]

You really don't understand do you.

http://www.skibiker.net/id33.html

How does one counter steer a bike without wheels then?

BAHAHAHAHA hez got you there. lol.


DB