Countersteering

[CookMySock]

Yes the spinning wheel does help as any of the big wheelie guys on here will confirm.

Can the wheelie boyz confirm that "during the wheelie, cranking the steering left and right gyroscopically moves the bike around?". (has been 20 years since I had the front wheel of anything up..)


DB

[Zoolander]

There are so many ways to try and explain how countersteering works, if anyone out there is a newbie rider and struggles to understand some of the more complex science behind it, try thinking of it this way: if you push on the right bar, you turn the wheel to the left. Because of the foward momentum of the bike you are actually "tripping" the bike so it will "fall" onto the right side of the front tyre. The side of the tyre is a smaller radius than the middle, so the wheel instantly tracks a tighter line, turning the bike right.

Sorry if somebody has already posted this, I didn't feel like scrolloing through 15 pages to find out.

But hope this is useful to somebody.

Dave.

[The Stranger:Me]

You'll never get any respect on here by abusing people. Why doesn't anyone take my skibike example and show me where its flawed.

Because, unlike yourself, most people don't want to be drawn on subjects they know little about. Personally I have never ridden a skibike. Have you?
However, I suspect that the glaring clues to the issue liein the first paragraph on steering a skibike in the link you posted.

However discussion on the skibike with you is an exercise in futility as you are impervious to logic. You have a closed mind and are not prepared learn.

Just throwing abuse because my logic doesn't fit in with your ideas makes me have a very low opinion of you as a person.

Don't be silly, I am not throwing abuse because your logic (and I use the term loosely) doesn't fit in with mine. See my first post, I thow abuse because I get sick of twats sprouting shite on subjects they know nothing about.

[Maha]

However discussion on the skibike with you is an exercise in futility as you are impervious to logic.

You sound like Mr Spok!

[Subike]

There are so many ways to try and explain how countersteering works, if anyone out there is a newbie rider and struggles to understand some of the more complex science behind it, try thinking of it this way: if you push on the right bar, you turn the wheel to the left. Because of the foward momentum of the bike you are actually "tripping" the bike so it will "fall" onto the right side of the front tyre. The side of the tyre is a smaller radius than the middle, so the wheel instantly tracks a tighter line, turning the bike right.

Sorry if somebody has already posted this, I didn't feel like scrolloing through 15 pages to find out.

But hope this is useful to somebody.

Dave.

did I read that right?
where is the science in that ??????push the right - turn left
that will happen with any central pivot point steering

I think something is missing in that one

[Zoolander]

did I read that right?
where is the science in that ??????push the right - turn left
that will happen with any central pivot point steering

I think something is missing in that one

Not sure I get what you're saying here. Of course it will happen on any bike with central pivot steering. I'm just trying to break down the simple steps so newbies can understand exactly what happens during countersteering. I never said it was a scientific explanation!!

[Ocean1]

Can the wheelie boyz confirm that "during the wheelie, cranking the steering left and right gyroscopically moves the bike around?". (has been 20 years since I had the front wheel of anything up..)


DB

It does. But at the speeds I ride with one wheel briefly up the effect, while noticable and usefull, is minimal.

[moT]

Ok Heres a Question I know how countersterring works bla bla and you hang off with ur body as much as possible to get best turning and so on. I am haveing a few issues with this technique so if you dont know 100% for sure how to answer this plz dont try i dont want to hurt myself. So im in a corner leaning as much as i can, hanging off as much as i can. Going really hard and i want to "flick" the bike over into the next corner as fast as i can what is the best way to do this???

[moT]

i think i may be in the wrong thread

[GSVR]

Because, unlike yourself, most people don't want to be drawn on subjects they know little about. Personally I have never ridden a skibike. Have you?.
However, I suspect that the glaring clues to the issue liein the first paragraph on steering a skibike in the link you posted..

I love discussing interesting subjects especailly ones like motorcycle dynamics. If you think know everything on a subject why bother as you wont learn anything you don't already know.

So your calling the guy on the skibike link a lair when he writes about countersteering?

However discussion on the skibike with you is an exercise in futility as you are impervious to logic. You have a closed mind and are not prepared learn.

I actually think your set on your gyro model and don't want to accept any other theorys on the subject.
Roll a motorcycle tyre down a hill it stays upright due to gyrosopic precession. This same effect helps to keep a motorcycle upright but can also have negative effects on the handling.

Don't be silly, I am not throwing abuse because your logic (and I use the term loosely) doesn't fit in with mine. See my first post, I thow abuse because I get sick of twats sprouting shite on subjects they know nothing about.

You must abuse alot of people then. Maybe anger management.

[CookMySock]

[trim] So im in a corner leaning as much as i can, hanging off as much as i can. Going really hard and i want to "flick" the bike over into the next corner as fast as i can what is the best way to do this???

Assuming you are originally laid over quite happily cornering to the right, then simply push on the opposite bar (left) and the bike will very smartly swap to the left. You will not need to "move your weight" in any manner whatsoever, and the technique is best demonstrated if you do not weightshift.

Instead of swapping from one lean to the other, try simply pushing on the left bar (assuming you are originally cornering to the right) as you exit from the turn, and watch the bike right itself with a snap. You will have such a grin on after you see this for the first time. It still makes me chuckle.

disclaimer: right in the middle of getting this correct myself
DB

[GSVR]

Ok Heres a Question I know how countersterring works bla bla and you hang off with ur body as much as possible to get best turning and so on. I am haveing a few issues with this technique so if you dont know 100% for sure how to answer this plz dont try i dont want to hurt myself. So im in a corner leaning as much as i can, hanging off as much as i can. Going really hard and i want to "flick" the bike over into the next corner as fast as i can what is the best way to do this???

To lift the bike back up from full lean your countersteering. Pushing on the right bar in a left turn to lift the bike upright and then over to turn right.

Only way to learn is by riding. If you want to get really agressive and fast at it the only good place is a trackday.

Top riders like in MotoGP can go from upright to full lean very quickly.

[The Stranger:Me]

So your calling the guy on the skibike link a lair when he writes about countersteering?

This is pretty much the kind of "logic" I expect from you.

You must abuse alot of people then. Maybe anger management.

No, actually, you are one of the few, I tend to reserve it for the more serious cases.

[GSVR]

Might as well post a link. Any Newbies if you want to learn about countersteering ...

http://www.soundrider.com/archive/sa...lls/RS-cc1.htm

Oh and this guys full of shit too.

[Pixie]

There are so many ways to try and explain how countersteering works, if anyone out there is a newbie rider and struggles to understand some of the more complex science behind it, try thinking of it this way: if you push on the right bar, you turn the wheel to the left. Because of the foward momentum of the bike you are actually "tripping" the bike so it will "fall" onto the right side of the front tyre. The side of the tyre is a smaller radius than the middle, so the wheel instantly tracks a tighter line, turning the bike right.

Sorry if somebody has already posted this, I didn't feel like scrolloing through 15 pages to find out.

But hope this is useful to somebody.

Dave.

You are absolutely correct.
A bike leans due to the forces against the side of the front tyre as it is moved off the bike's centre line by the steering geometry.
The degree and speed is related to the mechanical moment between the tyre contact patch and the bike's CoG.
Centrifigal effects of the wheels and other rotating masses have minor effects on road bikes and larger effects on racers.

If you dont believe me, make a jig to spin up the wheels of a bicycle while you sit on it at a standstill.Turn the steering and see if it leans - it won't.

Other wise a ski bike or the wet bike wouldn't work.