Poll: Learner speed restriction change?

[Robbo]

There are some dangerous assumptions implicit in the current regulations relating to learner riders.

One is that having gained completed a learn to ride course and gained the necessary documentation to get a learner license, that the person concerned is competent to ride a 250cc motorcycle on the open road. Learn to ride courses are not that. They are basic handling skills courses. There's a big difference, as we discovered five years ago. Mrs H had never ridden a motorcycle prior to attending this course. Location of levers and their coordinated function was something that the instructor expected people to have a working knowledge of. The *instructor* wasn't interested in providing this level of coaching. I ran alongside Mrs H explaining things to her until such time as she was able to move off, change gears and come to a stop again. Two hours later she had a certificate enabling her to ride on the open road. I needed CPR.

Yes, i agree, the current courses do not appear to offer the skills necessary to cover the situation that i was referring to earlier. The whole course would need to be restructured and run by highly skilled and competant tutors or it would still be useless.
This is where a Govt Dept could make itself usefull for once as it relates directly to many deaths and injuries on our roads each year. Currently they only seem to be using our roads as a means to collect revenue from and don't really give a damn about the road toll.

[CookMySock]

I really don't understand why 100kph on the Northern Motorway is any more dangerous than 50kph (rather, 60kph) in rush-hour Newmarket?

Agree - it isnt dangerous. What is dangerous is doing it on a road where there is the occasional tighter corner, and running it out of road coz they dont have the balls or the skills to use that angle of lean.

The hours restrictions are silly, too. After 10pm is when I far prefer to be riding; no traffic, better vision (no distractions, just clear white lines and cat's eyes).

That is a statistics thing.. many young people are killed on the roads during these hours, and the easiest way to tackle this from a legislative point of view is to ban it. Perhaps old farts could be exempt from this as they are too trashed by 10pm to do anything except fuck..

DB

[xwhatsit]

Agree - it isnt dangerous. What is dangerous is doing it on a road where there is the occasional tighter corner, and running it out of road coz they dont have the balls or the skills to use that angle of lean.

And that's an issue whether you're coming into a marked 65kph corner at 100kph, or whether you're coming into a marked 45kph corner at 70kph. Hell, you come across corners like that in 50kph zones from time to time.

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics on driving/riding at night -- not being combative or anything, just would like to see what they have to say. I feel much safer on the roads at night, personally, and so do a lot of others I know.

Personally I've always suspected that the 10pm thing is to do with four young idiots packed into a car leaving from a party (or `chilling' or `going for a cruise'). That sort of atmosphere doesn't lead to sensible driving. On a bike, we don't have that sort of situation.

[CookMySock]

And that's an issue whether you're coming into a marked 65kph corner at 100kph, or whether you're coming into a marked 45kph corner at 70kph. Hell, you come across corners like that in 50kph zones from time to time.

I mean, 100km/hr corners on open road that your average cager would nip through without thinking.. A learner on a little 250cc bike going at 100k through these is non-trivial, and will run out of road for sure. 100k cornering is a completely different animal to 70k cornering, and as people have observed 100 clicks in a straight line feels perfectly trivial because it is. All is not what it seems.

I'd be interested in seeing those statistics on driving/riding at night -- not being combative or anything, just would like to see what they have to say. I feel much safer on the roads at night, personally, and so do a lot of others I know.

certainly. well I do not mean to present them as fact - that is just my understanding of them. I could not quote you my source.

Personally I've always suspected that the 10pm thing is to do with four young idiots packed into a car leaving from a party (or `chilling' or `going for a cruise'). That sort of atmosphere doesn't lead to sensible driving. On a bike, we don't have that sort of situation.

*we* don't - agreed. But in the scenario you mention the peer pressure is enormous to pull their (or their dads) shiny new bike outa the shed and show how big their dick is. Now we have a problem.

DB

[Ixion]

..
Personally I've always suspected that the 10pm thing is to do with four young idiots packed into a car leaving from a party (or `chilling' or `going for a cruise'). That sort of atmosphere doesn't lead to sensible driving. On a bike, we don't have that sort of situation.

Yes. That is exactly where it came from. Remember, all the GDLS rules were written for cars, then motorcycles applied as an afterthought (when someone suddenly realised that a motorcycle learner couldn't have a supervisor).

Statistics showed that numbers young people involved in serious crashes were disproportionately high at night . Not necessarily higher absolute number so f crashes , but more youffs and but high in relation to average traffic volumes. So, figured the wise Grey Sheeple, night time must be dangerous.

Of course, noone replied (Grey Sheeple being what they are), "Hey, maybe young drivers are out more at night, cos it's the only time they have. And at night they have their mates along ".

And of course , young drivers = learners/restricted drivers (well, in cars it's more or les true). So the obvious fix was a curfew for L and R drivers 9and riders) . Oh, and forbid them to take passengers. Sorted.

So we have the absurd situation that a 50 year old 6R rider, who has maybe been driving for 35 years, must be home tucked up in bed by 10pm

[steveb64]

Bah - this discussion is pointless - the way the damn LTSA is going, with their creeping rollback of speed limits (a la 80k Karangahake Gorge, and now Dome Valley), it won't be that much longer and we'll be back to a blanket 80kph limit on ALL 'open' roads.

BUT - I also know what those who have been tailgated by arse cage drivers, when they're doing tail end charlie duties for some slower riders, are talking about... Fucktards that were doing it to me and the missus were only about 5 minutes away from getting a 12" crescent through the side drivers window... ...or their friggin windscreen... Luckily for all, they gave up, once I managed to coax the missus to wring the black twisty thing a bit harder - at least she was on a full licence, but then we were doing more than 70 kph too...

[motorbyclist]

ok, i'm not reading all these posts but here's my opinion:

the current system is as near to perfect as it is going to be.

a LEARNER licence is for LEARNING. after 6 months you should know how to stop properly so you then prove it and get your restricted. it's only 6 months - toughen up. the idea is that you don't take the motorway - remember alot of learners don't have a car licence so are learning the road rules at the same time

as for increasing the cc rating. again bad idea. the 2 stroke 250cc bikes are bad enough. if you have nil experience, riding a 400 isn't going to help. plus once you increase the limit for learners, the 400s will bloody well double in market value. good if you own one, not good if you're looking to buy one.

an improvement would be resticting 2 strokes to 150cc

another change they could do is recognising that you may already have a car licence; so if you've already got your car full, clearly you know how to give way etc so maybe only do the bike learner for 3 months, and vice versa

[Manxman]

I voted for 100kph, but after much internal debate would like to change my vote to....100mph.


70kph is positively fuppin dangerous on some roads (esp motorways, which everyone should be entitled to use) and - along with L plates - attracts fuptards like flies to cowsh*t.

I started off commuting to Wgn from Fitby on SH1. That's a trip where you only go at 70kph for the first km - or less - then your survival instinct kicks in and you say to yerself "fup this for a game of fuppin soldiers. I don't care if I get pulled over by the fuzz (figuratively speaking), at least I'm still gonna be in one piece". 100kph, and no more, is the go after that.