Why the WRB campaign is going nowhere.

**Jiminy** · 7th July 2008, 18:12

Originally Posted by Katman

I suppose it comes down to where you want to try and introduce the change in that sequence of events. I'm trying to take it one step backwards from the WRB stage and if a change can become more widespread at that level there'd be a whole lot more lives saved than if we just concentrate at the WRB stage.

Two hundred and fifty-five posts later, I'm still not sure I understand all this. Katman & co want riders to take more responsibility, Maha & co want to replace the WRBs or get them safer. The two are not mutually exclusive, as far as I can see.

I believe that bikers should be more responsible for their actions. But I also believe that we all make mistakes, me included (that very belief motivates me to ride more carefully every day). I would hate interfering with the campaign against the WRBs and letting them spread around the country in the name of personal responsibility just to realise one day that having safer barriers would be handy as I am sliding on the road (be)heading for a WRB.

If you don't believe in the campaign, fair enough, just stay away from it.

**Katman** · 7th July 2008, 18:25

Originally Posted by Jiminy

I would hate interfering with the campaign against the WRBs and letting them spread around the country in the name of personal responsibility just to realise one day that having safer barriers would be handy as I am sliding on the road (be)heading for a WRB.

I don't believe I'm interfering with anything. I'm actually suggesting we address an issue that, if we (and the general public) could see some real improvement in, could strengthen motorcyclists position in getting the powers that be to listen to us.

(If it's decided that WRBs are here to stay I will happily accept that, as long as consideration is given to how they can be made safer).

**Number One** · 7th July 2008, 18:41

Originally Posted by Katman

I don't believe I'm interfering with anything. I'm actually suggesting we address an issue that, if we (and the general public) could see some real improvement in, could strengthen motorcyclists position in getting the powers that be to listen to us.

How long do you think this 'real improvement' would take to get noticed to the point where it would as you suggest strengthen our position to get the powers that be to listen to us.

This lofty attidunal shift of the general public which you speak of wouldn't happen over night...infact I seriously doubt it would happen in anywhere near enough time (if ever - people will always hold a certain mental model about motorcyclists no matter what) to assist with the WRB issue or to save many more lives.

Your taking things 'back a step' assumes you have more sway with your target audience than I believe you do.

Focus needs to be kept on the WRB campaign - people will ride like they wanna ride despite your rantings.

**Katman** · 7th July 2008, 18:44

Originally Posted by Number One

Your taking things 'back a step' assumes you have more sway with your target audience than I believe you do.

No-one ever said it would be an easy ride.

**Maha** · 7th July 2008, 19:14

Originally Posted by Jiminy

Two hundred and fifty-five posts later, I'm still not sure I understand all this. Katman & co want riders to take more responsibility, Maha & co want to replace the WRBs or get them safer. The two are not mutually exclusive, as far as I can see.

I believe that bikers should be more responsible for their actions. But I also believe that we all make mistakes, me included (that very belief motivates me to ride more carefully every day). I would hate interfering with the campaign against the WRBs and letting them spread around the country in the name of personal responsibility just to realise one day that having safer barriers would be handy as I am sliding on the road (be)heading for a WRB.

If you don't believe in the campaign, fair enough, just stay away from it.

Make them safer, got to be realistic here and understand totally that they will never be removed.

Originally Posted by Katman

I don't believe I'm interfering with anything. I'm actually suggesting we address an issue that, if we (and the general public) could see some real improvement in, could strengthen motorcyclists position in getting the powers that be to listen to us.

(If it's decided that WRBs are here to stay I will happily accept that, as long as consideration is given to how they can be made safer).

They are here to stay, wont challange that. To have no more installed and the ones already in existance made safer, is the objective.

Getting individual bikers to change thier riding style is more of and uphill battle than getting the Government to hear what we have to say on the WRB issue, which BTW has already been acccomplished! They have listened

**FJRider** · 7th July 2008, 19:23

Originally Posted by DEATH_INC.

Just thought I'd point out that I do accept 'rider error' in some cases, I have 'been there done that' too....

I have had a "few" accidents that WERE my fault...just not watching what was happening around me. And it hurt... Some prangs I've had, I was the only one there (another story), can't blame anyone else for them...
The first thing a lot of people ALWAYS SAY (bikers too...because bikers are people) after a prang is "it wasn' my fault"....regardless. After talking it through... they admit they could have "reduced the risk" and maybe could have prevented it.
I assumed (assumptions are the mother of ALL fuckups) you were/could be one of those people.
MY APOLOGY FOR MAKING THAT ASSUMPTION.

**Katman** · 7th July 2008, 19:25

Originally Posted by dipshit

I got it from a July 2007 SuperBike magazine article.

http://www.photoshare.co.nz/PhotoSha...5040ul1803.jpg

http://www.photoshare.co.nz/PhotoSha...5041ul6173.jpg

http://www.photoshare.co.nz/PhotoSha...5042ul1119.jpg

And for those that haven't already, I'd recommend everyone reads the article that dipshit has posted.

**The Stranger:Me** · 7th July 2008, 19:57

Originally Posted by Jiminy

Two hundred and fifty-five posts later, I'm still not sure I understand all this.

Don't worry, you're not alone.
katman is even more confused than you are.

**dangerous** · 8th July 2008, 06:33

Drove part of the Kaikoura coast yesterday... only one WRB left (in a straight section well of the road edge) and it is the 3 cable type that dosent cross over (IMO a beter idea)
Brand new barriers are most of the way through the Hunderleighs they are the old style.
so something is working

**Wasp27** · 8th July 2008, 07:03

Originally Posted by Jiminy

If you don't believe in the campaign, fair enough, just stay away from it.

Why enter into any correspondence with this faction????....it's obvious they're getting off on the controversy. It's quite simple...just ignore em. Better to focus on the positive....surely

**MSTRS:Me** · 8th July 2008, 08:45

Originally Posted by Wasp27

Why enter into any correspondence with this faction????....it's obvious they're getting off on the controversy. It's quite simple...just ignore em. Better to focus on the positive....surely

There is some sense in that...but it's still better to stand up to their particular form of ignorance and bullying. Otherwise they might think we agree with their spoutings.
"All it takes...is for good men to do nothing"

**Katman** · 8th July 2008, 08:49

Originally Posted by MSTRS

their particular form of ignorance and bullying.

Oh, you poor petal, you.

**MSTRS:Me** · 8th July 2008, 08:52

Oh, you poor petal, you.

Oh that's right...I forgot to mention the self-serving holier-than-thou arrogance - as witness the above quote

**yungatart** · 8th July 2008, 09:31

Re personal responsibility..yesterday I had the opportunity to ride my bike to farewell a very much loved friend, the last ride I would ever have with this friend after so many funfilled excursions in the past.
My friend's death affected me deeply and caused quite some loss of sleep. On top of that my daughter has been critically ill, leading to much stress and even more sleepless nights.
I chose to lend my bike to someone else and pillion instead. Not heroic or sefless, more like self preservation and common sense...the thing is, most of the people I ride with, or know from these forums, given the same shit, would have made the same decision.
Maybe I am blessed in that I surround myself with decent, sensible folk or maybe most people do exercise personal responsibility....