What IS the rule?

[dpex]

fuck the rule --Its just plumb really bad economics to use those Motorway edges.All the nails and busted glass and other debris ends up there. Believe me -many years of Motorway commuting. More holes in tyres from when the law allowing bikes in buslanes was still a bit vague.
than the whole time splitting lanes

Can't agree here. On Sunday I used the inside and outside 'scrubby-bits' all the way from Papakura to the New market fly-over and never saw the slightest hint of debris. And, given the surface is a light orange-brown colour, foreign objects would show up quite clearly.

Perhaps your experiences occurred before they invented road sweepers. :--))

[FROSTY:Me]

Hmm on and off 15 years of Motorway commuting Vs 1 day. But hey dont believe me. Have a quiet word to le motorway cop.

[MSTRS:Me]

And I'll bet it's a similar scenario in every major city in NZ.

... Alexandra

Does anyone know what the rule is regarding using the rubbish-surfaces to the left or right of the main motorway lanes?

Don't know for sure about the section to the right of a marked lane, but there is a law about the section to the left. The section between the (usually) solid white line and the edge of the seal. Usually very narrow, but on the more major roads it can be as wide as a lane in itself. It is not a legal driving lane. Its purpose is as an emergency stopping area (breakdown lane) and sometimes as a cycleway. If you proceed as normal in this 'lane' you risk being charged with something like 'creating a second/third lane where none exists' or words to that effect.

[Jantar]

There was an item in Bike Rider magazine about 4 years ago covering this very topic. A rider using that section to the right received a ticket for "driving in an unavailable lane". He measured the width and determined that it wasn't a legal lane, so opted to defend the charge. The cops ammended the charge to "did drive outside his lane". He could find nothing in any law that said it was illegal to drive or ride outside a lane, other than in a safety zone (ie the section on the left of the motorway). He took the matter to the Minister of Transport before it went to court, and the next thing was that the whole matter was dropped.

BRM interviewed a lawyer, Bill Dean, (was my lawyer a few years ago) who also said that that there is nothing in law to prevent anyone from riding along that section.

So certainly use it, but be prepared that you may get a ticket, but that if you fight that ticket you should win.

[Ixion]

Yep. That's my understanding also. The bit between the lanes has no legal status (unless it is a painted median) .The reason you can't use the bit on the left is because there is a law specifically prohibiting it. Note that there is also law against actually riding ON a median (the grassy bit that sometimes is between the opposing lanes) , so the chookchasers are out of luck.

The "unavailable lane" rule is intended to deal with the situation when a lane is closed , eg by cones or such like.

Do note both Mr Frostys comments, and that the central bit is a bit risky cos sometimes it disappears down to zero width. And that cops are not likely to be amused! (Though, it legal to overtake on the right within a lane and a cop on the roadside would be very hard put to argue that you *weren't* actually overtaking on the far right of the right hand lane )

I've used the central bit on occasion, but usually only when some cunt blocks lane 1a.

[Bass]

Can't agree here. On Sunday I used the inside and outside 'scrubby-bits' all the way from Papakura to the New market fly-over and never saw the slightest hint of debris. And, given the surface is a light orange-brown colour, foreign objects would show up quite clearly.

Perhaps your experiences occurred before they invented road sweepers. :--))

I'm with Frosty and I'm talking recent experiences.
They really don't get swept very often in comparason to the traffic volume the m/ways carry and the crap that gets spread on them.
Every wooden pallet or packing case on the back of a truck is a potential source of nails, for example.

But hey - you've been lucky, I haven't. Perhaps things will carry on that way.

[Big Dave]

So have you had any response from your offical nod at the officials?

The police spokesperson's phone always goes straight to message and has never returned my calls. Due diligence - gave up.

A few KB Bike cops have kindly made themselves available for an off the record/after hours chat about several matters and I haven't had sh*t together enough to follow up.

I currently have a backlog of bike tests to write up < irony.

[vgcspares]

And I'll bet it's a similar scenario in every major city in NZ.

er No ... most have a cattle grid at front and rear, but no motorway network and no jams (save Wellington of course)

[firefighter]

I don't think you are allowed to use them. I agree that there seems to be a lot of resistance to saving fuel and cutting congestion with motorcycles since I am from the UK where filtering (lane splitting) is legal precisely because it reduces congestion and emissions.

Not to argue with ya, I certainly would'nt considering that's ya birth place in all!......but I heard you get charged with dangerous driving over there, for lane splitting......? (I cannot for the life of me remember where I got this from, but it was very recent, I think it may have been on cops (whatever the british one is-I watch a lot of that shit lol)

You will never change that culture it has become too embedded in the national psyche.

We can thank the biker-gangs for this attitude towards motorcyclists in N.Z.......

[peasea]

So dimmer view that they have little ticketing binges .... well at least they do here in Wellington.

Been ticketed for using the emergency lane; stinking hot day, accident on southern motorway, traffic backed up to the North Shore, puddling along, doing (maybe) 50kph, the tosser caused a major hassle getting to me and then caused another holdup by creating a line of slower moving rubber-neckers.

They'll uphold the law at any cost, even if they have to kill you to do it.

Ask Mrs Wallace.

[peasea]

We can thank the biker-gangs for this attitude towards motorcyclists in N.Z.......

While 'outlaw' M/C's probably don't help I'd say sports bike riders have a lot to answer for also.

In my thirty six years around motorcycles I've seen more stupid things done by sports bike riders than any other group of bikers.

As for car drivers....

[MarkH]

even if you get a driving ban you can apply to drive to work. Back in the UK if you lose your licence and then lose your job because you liost your licence well tough titty. Which is the way it should be.

Hmmm, you are saying that if you get 3 speeding tickets over 2 years and earn enough demerit points to lose your license for 3 months (as well as the 3 fines you have already paid) then it is fair to also lose your job, possibly your house (the job was paying the mortgage) and be unable to support your family? Is this really your idea of justice? It seems a little over the top to me for infringing on some technicality in the driving regulations.

In law there is a requirement for the punishment to fit the crime, there have been people that that had convictions quashed because the effect of having those convictions on their records would be out of proportion to the severity of their offending. Being punished for breaking the law is one thing, but over the top severe penalties for minor infractions is not fair or just. We don't hold with imprisoning a person for 2 years for being rude to officials in this country, thank you very much. http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/austral...ten-and-jailed

[peasea]

Hmmm, you are saying that if you get 3 speeding tickets over 2 years and earn enough demerit points to lose your license for 3 months (as well as the 3 fines you have already paid) then it is fair to also lose your job, possibly your house (the job was paying the mortgage) and be unable to support your family? Is this really your idea of justice? It seems a little over the top to me for infringing on some technicality in the driving regulations.

In law there is a requirement for the punishment to fit the crime, there have been people that that had convictions quashed because the effect of having those convictions on their records would be out of proportion to the severity of their offending. Being punished for breaking the law is one thing, but over the top severe penalties for minor infractions is not fair or just. We don't hold with imprisoning a person for 2 years for being rude to officials in this country, thank you very much. http://www.stuff.co.nz/world/austral...ten-and-jailed

Just as well, I'd never get out.

Seriously though folks.....one of the reasons I'd never go to any of those fucked up countries, beautiful as they may be, is because of the nutty officialdom. (It's bad enough here...) I get plenty of jollies right here in NZ, love the place, the scenery, the food, this is a bloody great country in many respects. Nowhere is perfect but this ain't bad.

[Swoop]

We can thank the biker-gangs for this attitude towards motorcyclists in N.Z.

I don't think so. Jim is referring to the "car" mentality of NZ... "Cars always come first, cars are best, cars have priority" which is brought about due to the lack of decent public transportation here in this Banana Republic of NZ.
Couple that with the availability of cheap asian reject cars and bingo!

[FROSTY:Me]

Sorry re talking to Mr policeman Im talking check out the tyres on any motorway bike cops bike. A good mate of mine used to be mechanic at the north shore mway base. A bifg part of his work was fixing flat tyres.
If ya don't believe me find a safe place to stop and have a looksee