Does this baby deserve parents like this?

[Patrick]

I will keep my opinions of beemer and patrick to myself(theyre both to busy being blowhards to listen anyway)If this gal had a history of hard drugs and or selling to people under 18 then maybe she was aware that society has a tiny problem with this.If she was just selling a bit of weed as the government hasnt found a way of taxing it(its ok to decriminilise prostitution which has many drug deals over tax payed fees)then the judge was a bit harsh.The cops would be better placed if we had a system where they could arrest and see fair penalty of the HARD criminals.Taking a baby off a mother who is in prison is cruel if just for innocent repettative pot sales.The dad was probably the grower who got his arse licked by the law.So an easy case for the officers aye.?????I never smoked tobacco around my baby and to this day never smoke pot around my child ... if any one sold it to him before hes 18 ill be livid!!I liken it to alcahol and tobacco......god I say it gambling!!!!Does that mean I deserved to go to jail and lose my child because I may have a bit of personal weed which I choose to use in a controlled manner.........whatever......one law doesnt work for everybody.....it just keeps cops in a job and gas in the bags

Yep, good on ya... keep your opinion to yourself then go about stating what they are... pfffttttt... tits in a tangle today sweetie?

In prison for a little bit of dope? Has a high security rating so she can't be housed in the units with her baby? Yep, sounds like she is in there for possessing a little bit of dope alright...

Riiiiiiggggghhhhhtt.

I will keep my opinion of you to myself......

[yungatart]

This is a little like shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted...for better or for worse this child has got those parents...can't do much about that now...what should be done is to help these parents to become better parents, while they are inside, so that on their release, this family can be productive members of society. That would be true rehabilitation, IMO.
For what its worth, I don't do illegal/recreational drugs, but I don't necessarily believe that those who do, are unfit to be parents.

[SixPackBack]

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[Patrick]

Both are legal patrick.......abuse at will!!

Drink driving is legal?

[Beemer]

I will keep my opinions of beemer and patrick to myself(theyre both to busy being blowhards to listen anyway)

This belongs with other similar statements that mean the opposite, like "I don't want to upset you, but..." and "I really shouldn't be telling you this, but..."

I didn't come on here asking people to AGREE with me, but I did expect that those who wanted to debate the issue would come to the table with their own views and opinions and not just attack like a rottie.

And Fish - we don't live in Amsterdam so what's your point. Likening me and others to Hitler is getting a bit tired so move along.

[magicfairy]

I didn't come on here asking people to AGREE with me, but I did expect that those who wanted to debate the issue would come to the table with their own views and opinions and not just attack like a rottie.

Exactly, we can all disagree but remain civil - agreeing to disagree. Like adults should.

[Grahameeboy]

Just cut and paste what I posted in the 'Stolen Merc' thread.

In the Herald today it says that this guy's Family had been under the care of Social Services since he was 2 which links up nicely with the Baby / Mother thread which became a battle with opinions divided.

This opens up a whole can of worms doesn't it.

- Did Social Services mess up?
- Was it the constant and unabaiting family issues that could not be resolved by Social Services that messed up?

I guess you could say that in some part they all messed up so referring back to the subject matter of this Post does anyone think or want to re-think about whether for the 5 month period that the Mother is in prison, what has happened is the right thing to do?

You see we can all draw upon our own bad family experiences and can say we can turned out allright, however, each case is different and it is all down to decisional balance which is never easy.

[SixPackBack]

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[jrandom]

Fish - we don't live in Amsterdam so what's your point.

I am pointing out that you're treating the letter of the law as an objective moral standard, which it simply isn't. It's fallacious to use the fact that something is illegal as justification for its illegality.

[Beemer]

Interesting choice of words. Pretty sure I could get another 2 pages out of you with that comment, particularly if the dog was female.

You must really be 'spreading the love' around if you have managed to red rep me FIVE times for this thread. You must be a really sad loser if a woman's comments can upset you so much.

[SixPackBack]

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[ManDownUnder]

I am pointing out that you're treating the letter of the law as an objective moral standard, which it simply isn't. It's fallacious to use the fact that something is illegal as justification for its illegality.

Agreed entirely (talk about a circular definition)... but...

I'd invite one and all to examine the effects, positive and negative, of various substances in the house and their impact on child rearing/upbringing. I have three particular concerns:

Anything producing fumes gives a child little choice except to partake unless those smoking them are extraordinarily careful.

At a young age a lot of development happens - rapidly. I'm not qualified to tell which of them are more critical than others, but the brain, lungs, liver and kidneys all seem to be obvious initial targets of airborn chemicals.

Breast milk will also carry some of the drugs to the child, albeit in a diluted dose, possibly altered in composition while in transit from the lungs to milk ducts.

All of the above possibilities concern me. I am aware it is not an exhaustive list - I'm sure there are other ares of possible concern. Fish - as you say the legality of a substance is not a standard against which a moral (and I pose medical) code can be based. I'd add for consideration that something not yet illegal (Party pills etc come to mind) can possibly be just as damaging to the health of children.

Child welfare is paramount and all reasonable steps need to be taken to ensure the innocents are not abused by malice - or oversight. I suggest some extraordinary steps may be warranted on occasion too.

[jazbug5]

- Did Social Services mess up?
- Was it the constant and unabaiting family issues that could not be resolved by Social Services that messed up?

I guess you could say that in some part they all messed up so referring back to the subject matter of this Post does anyone think or want to re-think about whether for the 5 month period that the Mother is in prison, what has happened is the right thing to do?

You see we can all draw upon our own bad family experiences and can say we can turned out allright, however, each case is different and it is all down to decisional balance which is never easy.

No, it isn't easy. At all. Particularly as nobody here seems to be (as yet) in possession of any actual facts partaining to this case. We all appear to have made at least some assumptions, though.
A baby needs to be with its mother. Five months is a very, very long time in infant development. Yes, occasionally it does happen that babies are born to women who are unmaternal or who are dangerous to their offspring. This doesn't necessarily mean that the mother will be a criminal. Or that a 'criminal' will be, ergo, an unfit parent. (Nelson Mandela was an incarcerated 'criminal' for thirty years or more, according to the laws of South Africa- but many people would consider him to be the father of modern post Apartheid South Africa.)

People just love to judge others. I've seen kids taken into care because someone had a grudge against a parent and gave false information to social services. And it's interesting how certain 'groups' of people are more prone to having their kids taken first and questions asked later. In one case I'm thinking of, the kid was taught to thieve by other kids in care, and how to sniff gas... which, along with the emotional trauma, led to heavy drug use. Brilliant outcome.

[Deano]

Having kids isn't a right ? In this nanny state it sure is. It isn't a privilege as it isn't just the privileged who can have children.

Having kids is as natural as breathing - is breathing a right ?

[Patrick]

Oh well, was good while it lasted... the little tacker can have his mummys drugged milk after all...

She applied for, and is able complete, Home Detention for her massive five months term, which in reality is only 2 months, which in reality is almost over....