Three cops shot - 1 dead (Napier, 7 May)

[Patrick]

Is that not the most immeasurably pathetic thing you've ever heard?Dave

This post was.

I wonder why cannabis is illegal....

To prevent shit like this happening perhaps?

Seems stupid his mum is put on the spot,

Not her fault. He is a 51 year old, big enough to make his own decisions.
The strange thing is when cops shoot a person there is a hue and cry over them being trigger happy,why did they do it( ala ma Wallace),but if the cop is shot first it is different,why?

This is true. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

All the comments about being ex-army.....

Still taught survival skills. Better than the average gang banger.

while he is in the house he is contained, there are only so many doors and windows the cops have to watch, they probably have a team under the house listening for him cutting through the floor or roof.

They are picking there time. No sense it risking more lives when they can wait this guy out.

Exactly. Its a two story house, lotsa view points.

What I can't understand is how this all developed in the first place. Didn't the police know who's house they were about to search? If they had done some reasearch I guess they would never have gone in there unarmed. A little preparation would have prevented this sorry mess from happening in the first place. It seemed easy enough for the media to find out that he is a well trained, armed Rambo type... Why did the police not gather this information before they went in there?

My sincere condolences to all who have suffered because of this.

The media spoke to the family and friends after the thing unfolded and gleaned info that is willingly supplied.

What you are suggesting is that Police speak to his friends and family and say what...?

"We are going to bust his arse for drugs. Tell us all about him." Kinda lets the cat out of the bag, dontcha think?

He is a 51 year old, known to Police for minor stuff, with no arms licence. There is no "alert" for anyone who has been in the army. Just if you have a licence to drive or shoot, thats about it.

[QUOTE=Gremlin;1129203849]I think plenty are forgetting the primary objectives of the various departments. Even the STG still have public safety in mind.

which is working quite well....

Its only when you get to army level that they stop giving a fuck about public safety (to a degree) and depending from country to country.

Ultimately, he has no hostages, he presents no real threat to people other than himself. Trying to compare this to someone taking control of an air tower really isn't the same strategy wise...

True, but not everyone has been removed from the neighbourhood. So he still poses a serious and real threat....

Remember, they bash in, casualties etc, and the public lynch them for being disorganised. They sit back, get a reasonably peaceful solution, and the public/media still lynch them. Fuck, what an awesome job.

No win situation... again...

How about a big buldozer with a big blade,
aim it at the house and let it go.
let the bugger try and stop that.
Im sure that by the time the front wall has been flattened
he will be either flattened with it,
need a clean pair if undies
or running out the back door souting "fuck this"

It is about protecting lives in the end,
even if the life to be protected is the person causing the problem.

but what do I know, I'm not there, I'm just a spectator on the side,
watching the drama via rose coloured glasses

Its believed he has bombs and the house is rigged.

[QUOTE=Mikkel;1129203924]If the guy was selling cannabis it would most likely be to support a P-habit... that seems to be the way the drug-driven foodchain works.

P-use would seem to fit the bill in this regard too - aggressive, paranoid and emotionally detached. (I don't care what you people say, but if you shoot down 4 unarmed people you'd have to be all of those.)

Some are suggesting it was just for a few plants..... Way more to this for this type of an over-reaction, don't you think?

[Patrick]

It is quite possible from what I've just heard that there is a hostage (or collaborator?) in there with the guy. Rumours etc are rife, but a second presence would explain the reluctance to 'go in'.

Anything is possible. Explains a lot, actually....

Dunno if this is actually the case or not....

[MSTRS:Me]

Anything is possible. Explains a lot, actually....

Dunno if this is actually the case or not....

And neither do I. Was just talking to someone who knows some of the background of this nutter, and has 'ears' closer to this event.

[DougieNZ]

Sorry, but this "wait him out/he's not hurting anyone" rubbish doesn't go down well with me.

This guy is a killer - and the situatiuon needs to be bought to a head. He has stopped innocent people going about their business for long enough. he has been given plenty of opportunity to surrender. Much more opportunity than he gave his victims. Enough is enough.

People talk about his "rights":

What about the rights of the dead/injured?
What about the rights of the law abiding people to live their lives and go about their lawful business?
What about the rights of the family of the deceased policeman who has been lying there all this time to have him looked after and start the grieving process?

The solution is reasonably straightforward. The place is surrounded by heavily armed and well trained police...

1. Fill the place with tear gas.
2. If he comes out armed - shoot to kill
3. If he comes out unarmed - send the dogs in to make sure, then arrest him.

[MSTRS:Me]

Exactly, DougieNZ. But if there is a second person in there (and I would assume that infared/thermal imaging would be there to confirm) then what?

[DougieNZ]

Then the 2nd person will evacuate the premises and be arrested... If he/she comes out armed, then heshe deserves everything he gets!

This guy could have enough food to drag this on for a month... Sorry, but it ends NOW!

[Finn]

What if they've got the wrong house?

[MSTRS:Me]

If the (mythical?) second person is a hostage? Cops are not going to want to precipitate his/her death too...
Or is the time come for acceptable collateral damage?

[short-circuit]

I'm outraged that you can only think of your nipples at a time like this!

Had to take a two hour break from this thread and pectorial masturbation to do some work, but I'm back and my niplets are quivering for more

[Katman]

Sorry, but it ends NOW!

Oooww, how forceful.

[DougieNZ]

If the (mythical?) second person is a hostage? Cops are not going to want to precipitate his/her death too...
Or is the time come for acceptable collateral damage?

If there is a 2nd person them fair enough... But they have ways of finding that out. It is probably more of a rumour being spread by the family to prevent the cops going in. The key is here that the situation needs to be dealt to. The cops should not go IN. They should give him no choice but to come OUT. Hence the tear gas. I have tried it a couple of times in the '80's... believe me, you do not hang around where tear gas is present!

[Finn]

If there is a 2nd person them fair enough... But they have ways of finding that out.

I'm surprised they haven't tried the old pizza delivery trick.

[MSTRS:Me]

From what I've seen of the various media photos etc, this will be the house involved. Unless it is the one up on the skyline. It is last on the left just at the point that Chaucer Rd splits at Spencer St. Old 30s, small rooms, all doored, small windows and not many of them.
Have a look for yourselves... http://maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

[Finn]

From what I've seen of the various media photos etc, this will be the house involved. Unless it is the one up on the skyline. It is last on the left just at the point that Chaucer Rd splits at Spencer St. Old 30s, small rooms, all doored, small windows and not many of them.
Have a look for yourselves... http://maps.google.co.nz/maps?hl=en&tab=wl

It's number 41, further up the street in lovely dutch colours. Check it out on google earth, it's the one with all the cops around it.

[MSTRS:Me]

I don't have G.Earth. 41 is not particularly close to the top photo here http://www.stuff.co.nz/national/2393...-may-last-days and is on the same side of the road, further up the hill on the right.
This one?