Call to WAR

[BoristheBiter]

Well i Hate to burst your bubble but I have spoken to about 20 people today and SHOWN them whats going on.
Finaly they accepted that the bikers have been a smokescreen.
So much attention on us they didnt see what was happening.

Two employers didnt even realise they were being lumbered with increases, Didnt even know employee levies were goin up. One guys employer levey is just over $15k now.

Somehow we gotta get it out there that every single person got shafted.

People are not happy with national at all and that includes some real diehards i spoke with.

That’s what I just said.

Joe public doesn’t care because they don’t think it is going to affect them , like the people you just spoke to didn’t care until they found out it would cost them more.

Stony was right that the bikeoi was a complete success; it showed we would not stand for the massive price rises or a change to the principles to acc,

We said it was a start and now we continue, loader and loader until the rest of NZ can see it is going to cost them a shit load more, whether in higher costs or because we are forced back into cars or that fact that we will just not get a rego.

[StoneY]

Yeah he'll be there ! One of the clubmembers knows and was in the car with him, seeing he lost his licence !
He actually has a profile on here haha ya won't miss him if ya scroll the acc threads !

Sweet, that car had an interesting....atmospheric presence when I said 'hi' to them

[drummer]

I'm KEEN as,but what do you propose? They're obviously not going to listen to "PEACEFUL PROTESTS".
If you think they're going to take notice of "RATTLING OUR SABRE'S",well WE MIGHT AS WELL CONCEDE TO THEM!

They're ronly going to listen,if we start to disrupt their lives,or shut/block the cities.

I reckon public support wont have waned either,seeing as they have been targeted aswell.

Peaceful protests... or lawful...?

"They" (and I am unsure as to who "They" are... the Nats... ACC... Nicksta and his advisers.. the public) will not listen or have to pay attention to a few KB members talking of disruption and "War".

Dusrupting peoples lives IS NOT going to win us the so called war.. good grief... use your heads.. politics is what will win us the fight.. I have said time and time again that the way to fight party policy (and NEVER forget this IS our fight... you want to fight the whole Nat government... I hate to say this... you're dreaming) is to attack the party thinking from the weakest link... firstly..,. do you really believe for one tiny moment in your talk of disruption "shutting down cities" and public annoyance that Joe and Mary Blow will think "Oh gosh... them bike riders are right... NO they think we have won a concession... and we should be grateful.. It may be the wrong perception.. but who gives a dam about that? Its THEIR perception.

Also re the talk about unions joing our fight and marching with us.. oh give me a break... union membership is at it's lowest in years. Plus the Nats don't care about unions.. why? Because they all vote Labour anyhow! Also... want to alienate half the bikers in NZ... simple.. get unions involved... no.. this is OUR fight... let them do their thing... and have their flag waving banner bearing little shouting marches in the rain outside some place... but ever seen the numbers of people in them.. and talked with them... no Nats at all.. and numbers decreasing all the time.. the last one I saw was a group of drenched men outside some factory in South Auckland saying let us in... let us in... great protest... and not very intelligent... from what I know it failed... the factory was shut up next time and the lease up...

Fundementally what we as KB passionate motorcyclists need to do is to firstly convince ALL.. well as many as we can.. (and thats a big task) riders that we the motorcycle and scooter ridrs of NZ need to be united in a common cause... bring the groups together.. right now I know people who ride who just shake their heads when all this war and disruption is mentioned.. I was at a staff Christmas function last night.. spent half the night explaining the reality of our plight to three guys and a lady ho rode bikes... but who never protested or even knew about any actions... strange huh... NO... but to people here it would seem strange... I mean ... lets see 5000 bikes at Welly... about 100 at the important Smith meeting in Auckland... how many rego'ed bikes in NZ? A lot more I know that for sure. I also know ALL of the people I spoke with were surprised that I, a former Nat exec branch member was unhappy... and ALL of them were Nat voters.

I even see here an attack and name calling of scooter riders... give me strength... attacking the fasted growing sector of NZ transport and some very intelligent people aint going to win us those people...

There you go... some of you want war... disruption...personal attacks against Smith.. thats an uneducated illinformed way to change policy... We at the moment are lets face it are a small voting block whose members mostly are left leaning... lets get real... However.. many many many motorcyclists like myself are not left leaning... I actually like John Key as a leader... but.. and this is the crux... a few policies including this major one re ACC have me really pissed off.. for every one of "me" there are huge numbers out there from all political angles who are the same. They won't and don't support a small group of bikers who want to disrupt traffic, "close down cities", cause mayhem and annoy the great working public... these people mostly drive cars to work... I do... to carry my guitars drums and amps etc.. try that on a bike... then there are those who ride scooters to look "cool"... Guys in K road, little chickie babes who's miniskirts blow up at any speed... great look... but totally unsafe... just go round Tamaki drive on a hot summers day and see what I mean.

Do you really think that traffic disruptions, threats, declarations of war and involving left leaning unions in chanting walks down city streets is going to change the (popular.. look at the polls!!) governments policies..? You must be dreaming.

No folks... to attack a cause... stealth organisation of resources and intelligence is required... in modern warfare even... its not about dropping bombs on everyone.. its about SMART bombing and stealth..

So what do we do?... I have started a new thread (Approach to the future of our cause) to discuss this and put this post as first post... where am I coming from? I have been involved with politics and political change for nearly 30 years... 17 years in Australia.. I saw the Hanson thing happen before my very eyes... I was close to the action and didn't agree with her at all... Together with a dedicated group we totally changed the face of politics in an area of nearly 200,000 people.. and a wider region of more than a million and brought change Nationally in certain areas...

I know the National party here.. I know how they work and the structures they use... war by disruption and fuelled by emotional anger is a way to failure.. I can PROMISE you that... however.. if you want to call it war do so... but I call it pressure... put unbelieveable pressure on the weakest links by as great a number of ordinary motorcyclists and scooter riders we can muster... some of us need to embrace the concept of working within the system... and at times outiside when we face a brick wall... but if you think we are facing a brick wall now and the only way is to break it down, then sorry... you WILL NOT achieve the end result. The wall will grow far larger.

We need a goverment who thinks its very own supporters will turn... will leave the party membership... stop the donations, and essentually make the next election a tough one... the biggest thing political parties need apart from voters getting them elected is people who give their time assisting in things... putting up signs, door knocking etc... branches have a little competition within electorates to sign up the most members... and get the most money... like I said... do you really honestly think scaremongering by carpet bombing is the answer?

Lets discuss and plan a co-ordinated strong intelligent effective mature approach to our problem... lets come up with a strong co-ordinated argument that gets as many motorcycle riding and scooter riding people on board... lets attack with stealth and a groudswell of people who will eventually convince this government riding high in the polls that the ACC levies are unfair, unworkable and unjustified.. Lts convince this government and it's allies like ACT, Unied future and the Maori party that it will be if anything a minority unworkable government at the very most after the next election IF it continues its present policy lines.. and for us thats ACC levies and dare I say it the climate change issues regarding the advantage of people riding bikes.. lets get the people who matter onside by intelligent co-ordinated public debate about our nation's future and a system that has worked well for a good deal of time... let's make John Judge feel uneasy... and give the government no choice but to sack him... look at his failures... there are too many to list.

Who here wants that?

Or who here wants to disrupt, annoy and declare war on the majoirity..and truly believes it is the way...? Who wants to confront angry car drivers who just want to get to work? Who here wants to get scooterists offside by calling them names... ?

Not me!

Peter (Drummer on KB)

[drummer]

I aint stoppong till the Nats are out, and we can have a government that WILL restore ACC to its intended principles

You are going to be waiting a VERY long time.. the Nats are riding high... they are smart... and many of us here would rather have John than Aunty Helen or Goff... but what we don't universally want is a government policy that is unfair on motorcyclists and Scooter riders whilst allowing Rugby players, bicycle riders and such to get away with paying no targeted levy IF we as riders have to...

Another thing... come on.. do you honestly believe that Labour wouldn't raise our taxes in other ways... look at the past years under Auntie Helen... it was not all beer and skittles..

Think policy change not government change... we are a minority... and getting smaller by the day... some are rolling over... but small groups can become large... by embracing ideas and putting aside party politics for the sake of policy change... its a very very important difference and one that we here need to understand...

Peter

[NONONO]

Peter.
you are sounding more and more partisan, and a bit desperate.
Chill

[drummer]

Peter.
you are sounding more and more partisan, and a bit desperate.
Chill

Neither... but I am being realistic... don't you call calls for "War" desperate.. me desperate... nonono!

hehe

Peter

[Flip]

We just sent them a polite message with lots of advance consultation, that was an old fashioned visitor calling card.

Next time we arrive on our terms and in much larger numbers.

I'm in again and this time my wife will come with me which doubles the attendance from my household

[fridayflash]

im in for sure, id be happy to turn up and frisbee my number plate at
parliment house and declare motorcycles to no longer subject to
fees of any sort....5000 bikers doin that would fuck 'em

[idleidolidyll]

If all you do is watch TV and read the Herald: you'll only ever hear the propaganda, try something with balance and depth:



User-pays ACC approach picks off groups one by one
The Government’s treatment of ACC motorcycle levies is symptomatic of an increasing user-pays approach which is picking off groups of New Zealanders one by one, says Labour’s ACC spokesperson David Parker.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00165.htm


-------------------------------------------



National scaremongering on ACC and Super exposed
National’s scaremongering over ACC and Superannuation has been exposed by the continuing strong performance of the ACC and Super investment funds, Labour Leader Phil Goff says.
“The Budget decision to suspend contributions to the Super Fund with National saying it was losing money was stupid. All funds at the height of the financial crisis were losing money.

“That decision now looks even more short-sighted given the latest figures from Treasury show the fund bouncing back strongly with higher than forecast returns of the $1.3 billion for the four months to 31 October.
“The time to invest is when prices are low but National squandered the opportunity by suspending the payments which jeopardises the future pensions of all New Zealanders.
“It is the same situation with ACC. John Key and National used the lower returns from the ACC investment funds to justify huge levy hikes and cutting of entitlements.
“But ACC’s investment funds had returns of $600 million in the four months to 31 October. This was also higher than expected.
“National’s changes to ACC and Super funding made no sense at the time. They make even less sense now,” Phil Goff.
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00077.htm

[idleidolidyll]

Pay-as-you-go way to go for ACC

Thursday, 10 December 2009, 11:51 am
Press Release: Green Party
http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/PA0912/S00155.htm

[craneman]

Tell me were and when and Ill be there.

[sunhuntin]

if the war falls on a weekend, i may have a bit of hassle attending, but can always call in sick or something. during the week... no worries. just tell me where and when.

[Noidy]

Peaceful protests... or lawful...?

Fundementally what we as KB passionate motorcyclists need to do is to firstly convince ALL.. well as many as we can.. (and thats a big task) riders that we the motorcycle and scooter ridrs of NZ need to be united in a common cause...

This affects more than just motorcyclists. Lets expand the group and not limit ourselves. Target boy racing groups and convince them that they will be next and to get on the band wagon with us. A group of motorcyclists can make some noise but a group of auto enthusiasts will make more

[spacemonkey]

mm I have yet to don my ACC Protest tshirt... impatient!!!!

The protest shirt is not just for wearing at the protests..... wear it as much as you can in everyday life when your out and about, its all part of getting out message out there in full view to as many people as possible.

Get the message in peoples minds, KEEP it in peoples minds.

[Tink]

The protest shirt is not just for wearing at the protests..... wear it as much as you can in everyday life when your out and about, its all part of getting out message out there in full view to as many people as possible.

Get the message in peoples minds, KEEP it in peoples minds.

that would be great if it wasn't super huge, (so I can wear it over my jacket)... otherwise sure....