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Thread: Fail: Sea Shepherd

  1. #226
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    Couldn't read all the posts. Some interesting arguments here but you are all missing the point. If NZ wants to get serious about whaling it needs to claim some of the Pacific and the southern Ocean (along with Australia - gotta compromise sometimes), stick a Greenpeace sticker on a navy ship or two (are there two?), and go hunting whalers. Blow them out of the bloody water - sink 'em. It's all about saving the whales. And that is even good for the Whalers because you can't eat them if there aren't any. World War III has already started - it's economic. Just accept and get on with it.
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  2. #227
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    Quote Originally Posted by rok-the-boat View Post
    It's all about saving the whales.
    Which whales?
    Is the sub species they are hunting endangered?
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  3. #228
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kickaha View Post
    Only because they were acting like fuckwits
    I'm not convinced it was an act.

  4. #229
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    [QUOTE=LBD;1129605223]A turn to stbd is the recognised collision avoidence rule at sea.
    /QUOTE]

    Bow to bow.

    Quote Originally Posted by Virago View Post

    However, the fact remains that the burst of power from the AG, whether a misguided attempt at avoidance, sealed its own fate.
    Had the Ady Gil not powered forward would the Shonan Maru still have turned to Port? Were they simply chasing the small boat down like they chase down whales? This is a highly manoeuverable vessell.

    Quote Originally Posted by caseye View Post
    The Ady Gil in this footage was deliberately positioned where the Security ship could not possiibly avoid collision, no matter whether they turned to Starboard(as per the high seas rules) or Port which would of course have put the stern of the ship right over the top of the Ady Gil.
    This footage also shows quite clearly that the Ady Gil was under powered control and in the last seconds was PUT (accelerated into) directly under the bow of the oncoming ship.
    The direction of travel of the Shonan Maru at the start of the BB video and subsequent released footage shows the two vessels were not on a collision path. It was the sharp turn to starboard of the SM that precipitated that prospect.
    The S manoeuvre of the Shonan Maru; hard to s'bord then hard a'port, surely indicates one of two scenarios.

    1/ They were trying to intimidate the crew of the Ady Gil by running at them and turning away at the last moment.
    or,
    2/ They turned to Port to ensure the AG didn't get away.
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  5. #230
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    Quote Originally Posted by RantyDave View Post
    Until you learn what one is there's no point in discussing it. When you know what it is, you'll know why. Adios.
    You assume quite a lot of things, do you not? (That's a rhetorical question by the way.)

    Now, suppose I was quite familiar with the term in question but merely disagreed with you on whether such considerations were at all appropriate for the present discussion. You'd most likely agree that if I started to rant on about quantum mechanics in regards to this incident, that it would be a wasted exercise - a technical wank-fest might be an appropriate term - and while quantum mechanics are indeed further removed from the discussion than anything to do with "the second moment of inertia" neither are at all relevant for a first order approach.

    Indeed, it would appear that you have misunderstood what the second moment of inertia actually is, considering you use in the relation to angular acceleration:

    Quote Originally Posted by RantyDave View Post
    Or educated. We're not talking about two ball bearings hitting each other in a schoolboy's textbook here and neither is anyone claiming the Shonan Maru was deflected sideways by any reasonable amount. What happened was the Ady Gil (carrying, let's say, 15-20 knots) hit the Shonan Maru on the starboard bow. That means the front, and on the right hand side 'kay? The force of the collision was expressed on the Shonan Maru as a torque, being the product of force (lots, we can tell from what it did to the bow of the Ady Gil and what happened to the water around the Ady Gil when the collision happened) and distance from the centre of gravity (which, given that the Shonan Maru is kinda long is also lots). The Shonan Maru would then experience an angular acceleration inversely proportional to it's second moment of inertia and obviously, once actually yawing, resisted by various hydrodynamic phenomena or, in English, slowed down by the water.
    Pretty embarrassing using the word obviously when you make an obvious mistake.

    Quote Originally Posted by Wikipedia
    The second moment of area is not the same thing as the moment of inertia, which is used to calculate angular acceleration, although the calculations are similar. Many engineers refer to the second moment of area as the moment of inertia and use the same symbol I for both, which may be confusing. Which inertia is meant (accelerational or bending) is usually clear from the context and obvious from the units: second moment of area has units of length to the fourth power whereas moment of inertia has units of mass times length squared.
    Now, either you are a very crafty troll introducing subtle mistakes to bait me along or you are an arrogant arse who've been so busy throwing ad hominem arguments into the debate that you've forgot to get your facts right. Personally I think you merely managed to confuse "the moment of inertia around the z-axis" (z being vertical) with "the second moment of inertia" which has to do with the deflection of beams depending upon their cross-section. Or do "naval architects" use a different terminology from engineers? (Hey, at least you have wikipedia's word for this being confusing...)

    Unlike you though, I will reserve the right to be mistaken on this particular subject. Your turn ol' chum. (And a humorous reply would of course be to tell me to get bent... )
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  6. #231
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    Surely the solution is simple ain't it.
    Sink all ships in Antarctic. Regardless of intention. If you go to Antarctic.....your ship will be sunk.
    Japan wont go there.
    SS wont go there.
    Whales win provided they like the cold. If anyone steps out of line - they book their ticket to the bottom of the Antarctic.

    Oh and arguing about the physics of the whole thing is a bit silly don't you think. Its pretty obvious that A.G. didn't pull its fingers out of its arse, and the S.M. who was out to "get em" did just that. The physics is kind of irrelevant when you forget human nature.
    Contrary to what Newton thinks - 90% of action is motivation. S.M. had a shit load of motivation, a shit load of momentum......it only had to be pointed in the right direction.
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  7. #232
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikkel View Post
    tell me to get bent...
    Rather obtuse of you aint it.
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  8. #233
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    Quote Originally Posted by avgas View Post
    Rather obtuse of you aint it.
    Pardon, I don't get the point.
    It is preferential to refrain from the utilisation of grandiose verbiage in the circumstance that your intellectualisation can be expressed using comparatively simplistic lexicological entities. (...such as the word fuck.)

    Remember your humanity, and forget the rest. - Joseph Rotblat

  9. #234
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mikkel View Post
    Pardon, I don't get the point.
    It must be an discrete value away
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  10. #235
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    Quote Originally Posted by avgas View Post
    It must be an discrete value away
    In that case I shall pray for continuity.
    It is preferential to refrain from the utilisation of grandiose verbiage in the circumstance that your intellectualisation can be expressed using comparatively simplistic lexicological entities. (...such as the word fuck.)

    Remember your humanity, and forget the rest. - Joseph Rotblat

  11. #236
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    Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit!

    Just listened to the National news. I wish these bloody announcers would call them 'whalers' and not 'wailers'.
    "Statistics are used as a drunk uses lampposts - for support, not illumination."

  12. #237
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daffyd View Post
    Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit!

    Just listened to the National news. I wish these bloody announcers would call them 'whalers' and not 'wailers'.
    Well, you could give the a tip.
    It is preferential to refrain from the utilisation of grandiose verbiage in the circumstance that your intellectualisation can be expressed using comparatively simplistic lexicological entities. (...such as the word fuck.)

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  13. #238
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  14. #239
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    No offence tank. But pretty much every ship outside Kiwi waters has a weaponry of some type. I'm am supprised it wasn't a big bloody rifle....oh wait those sink and don't make good evidence.
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  15. #240
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    Quote Originally Posted by avgas View Post
    No offence tank. But pretty much every ship outside Kiwi waters has a weaponry of some type. I'm am supprised it wasn't a big bloody rifle....oh wait those sink and don't make good evidence.
    Besides, arrows without a bow are only good for giving directions. Maybe they should have gotten some bigger ones and the Shonan Maru 2 would have been able to navigate around them.

    Best defense ever, the captain of Shonan Maru 2: "Sorry, didn't see ya." That's stealth technology for you - it comes with an inherent risk.
    It is preferential to refrain from the utilisation of grandiose verbiage in the circumstance that your intellectualisation can be expressed using comparatively simplistic lexicological entities. (...such as the word fuck.)

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