Effing newspapers!

[Hitcher]

Despite all of the bagging of the 5.56 round used by the Steyr, it's exactly the same round as used in the M4A1 that Corporal Apiata is illustrated as carrying.

[Panzerkampfwagen VI]

If I was working in Afganistan, I'd shoot the media, not the terriorists...... Media are easier to find

[wbks]

Despite all of the bagging of the 5.56 round used by the Steyr, it's exactly the same round as used in the M4A1 that Corporal Apiata is illustrated as carrying.

People were bagging the 5.56, others were ripping on the steyr. Not the same thing, and I'm pretty sure that isn't an M4A1.
http://www.google.co.nz/webhp?hl=en&...fd358fd75aac21
Though I'm sure someone will correct me...

[Winston001]

5.56 is looking to be on the way out.

There has been a number of article in Jane's Defence Weekly, and IDR etc outlining the problems being faced in modern warfare with the 5.56 round, and how more and more units are switching to larger calibres.

The range and knock-down/armour penetration are key downfalls.

That's interesting. The current alternative of 7.62 is much heavier though. Fine for vehicle based missions but the hard soldiering in mountains and house to house still requires a soldier to carry enough ammo. One answer I guess is that most of the worlds revolutionaries manage to carry enough for their AK47s. Mind you they tend to be on home turf and don't have far to go.

I'd have thought that further development of the bullet profile and gunpowder would be worth researching before abandoning 50 years worth of weapons. There is also a suggestion that barrel length and rifling can be tweaked to make the 5.56 round more effective. Of course a long barrel must be a pain.

[Winston001]

One thing I've never understood is why modern assault rifles require such care and attention. Just read a book where a soldier remarked that his Diemaco which had been taken by rebels would be useless in no time. Yet the same rebels had no problems with their AK47s. I've heard that the Uzi is similarly robust.

[wbks]

Wow, I see the herald is having a bitch about criticism for releasing the picture. They say that they didn't know it was him and they wouldn't have said so if they did... Right, the next guy can recognise him without a second thought, but you publish it anyway, and then actually go on to complain about how LITTLE we are told about the SAS... Most people are cool with not hearing anything about them, as they understand that it is the way the Special Air Service is supposed to be, and makes it easier for them, which leaves the only possible conclusion (no surprises here): The Herald don't give a shit about putting lives at risk, so long as they get the first scoop and can profit. Not the first time they've given me the impression of being leeches, not honest journalists, and this is more proof

[wbks]

One thing I've never understood is why modern assault rifles require such care and attention. Just read a book where a soldier remarked that his Diemaco which had been taken by rebels would be useless in no time. Yet the same rebels had no problems with their AK47s. I've heard that the Uzi is similarly robust.

One reason is the tolerances. Like with a formula one vs your family car, one has way higher tolerances and therefor run more reliably and consistently, the other one performs a lot better but only takes a bit of dust sucked in and it will destroy itself. Sand works in through parts in a high tech rifle and can easily cause issues, where with an AK for example you can (and its on youtube) throw a few hand fulls of sand in under the dust cover and there will still be enough room between moving parts to function. Of course, the trade off is that your average AK47 or Uzi won't be half as accurate as any "modern assault rifle"

[sAsLEX]

That's interesting. The current alternative of 7.62 is much heavier though. Fine for vehicle based missions but the hard soldiering in mountains and house to house still requires a soldier to carry enough ammo. One answer I guess is that most of the worlds revolutionaries manage to carry enough for their AK47s. Mind you they tend to be on home turf and don't have far to go.

I'd have thought that further development of the bullet profile and gunpowder would be worth researching before abandoning 50 years worth of weapons. There is also a suggestion that barrel length and rifling can be tweaked to make the 5.56 round more effective. Of course a long barrel must be a pain.

Its not that they are looking at moving to the 7.62, but a replacement cartridge for the 5.56.

6.8mm Remington SPC and 6.5mm Grendel etc

[Hans]

Really? Explain?

690mm is not that long, in fact shorter than a lot of MP5 configurations.

It is in fact more like 800mm. An mp with a fixed stock is at least 100mm shorter, not even talking about the folding stock versions. And the fact that it's a bullpup configuration means sweet fuck all until you actually fire it. Until then it's as unwieldy as standard config. AUG also has no three-round-burst mode, which is annoying.

And yes, most special forces unit will have access to M4s, but IMHO the only reason why they'd use them is compatibility(logistics).

[Hans]

Oh yeah, and an MP5 in 10mmAuto is my personal choice. It rocks. Any automatic in .45ACP is also pretty awesome for urban situations. .45ACP is generally an overlooked round in terms of urban/police work. Very good stopping power and you don't have to get special loads to silence it. Subsonic even at 200gr.

[allycatz]

My ex was SAS...honestly the places they get dropped into don't have newspapers or the internet....Apiata is still as useful as he ever was. These guys are deployed in places you've never heard of

[wbks]

My ex was SAS...honestly the places they get dropped into don't have newspapers or the internet....Apiata is still as useful as he ever was. These guys are deployed in places you've never heard of

Like Afghanistan?... If something were to happen to him or his family because of his publicity, it wouldn't be the first time that kind of thing has happened. I couldn't put a time and date on it, but I've been told of an ex brit SAS trooper, Northern Ireland vet., who was jumped outside a pub and killed by IRA henchmen, obviously his identity wasn't concealed well enough ... With Muslim extremists getting closer to home, recently in Aus... Is it really such a jump to assume that someone with such a high public status or their family may be targeted by certain people? As far as I know, Afghanistan isn't prominent with that kind of thing, but regular soldiers were being beheaded on camera not too long ago, I bet certain people would love to get their hands on our infidel hero Mr. Apiata, or those close to him... What a message

[allycatz]

Like Afghanistan?... If something were to happen to him or his family because of his publicity, it wouldn't be the first time that kind of thing has happened. I couldn't put a time and date on it, but I've been told of an ex brit SAS trooper, Northern Ireland vet., who was jumped outside a pub and killed by IRA henchmen, obviously his identity wasn't concealed well enough ... With Muslim extremists getting closer to home, recently in Aus... Is it really such a jump to assume that someone with such a high public status or their family may be targeted by certain people? As far as I know, Afghanistan isn't prominent with that kind of thing, but regular soldiers were being beheaded on camera not too long ago, I bet certain people would love to get their hands on our infidel hero Mr. Apiata, or those close to him... What a message

If the media could photograph him so could anyone else wishing to 'target' him. NZ should never have made public the location of SAS deployment. It was only a short while ago that SAS guys did not receive awards because of the ' secret squirrel' act

[wbks]

If the media could photograph him so could anyone else wishing to 'target' him. NZ should never have made public the location of SAS deployment. It was only a short while ago that SAS guys did not receive awards because of the ' secret squirrel' act

But as maybe you or someone else said, until someone felt it was necessary to publicize him, and even now confirm that he was in Afghanistan, "they" would be just as clueless to his identity as the next person. Maybe they shouldn't have revealed the location. If people are worried about someone reacting to our position on the war than announcing the sending of a combat force kind of ceals the deal...

[allycatz]

Did anyone else read the comment by John Key in The Dom Post about Apiata receiving $35k worth of media training? Key basically implied that after that expenditure he was available to the media