The Goat of Hampton Downs

[wharfy]

He said

Wharfy is a tosser! Now where is the weather report for Hampton this coming weekend

WAIKATO (filed at 24-MAR-2010 01:57)

Wednesday
Rain, with heavy falls and isolated thunderstorms.Fresh northwesterly winds.

Thursday:
Occasional rain, clearing afternoon and some fine breaks developing. Westerly winds, becoming strong for a time in the middle of the day.

Friday:
Fine breaks, but a few showers also, mainly in the west.Southwest winds.

Saturday:
Long fine spells. Southwest winds.

Sunday:
Fine apart from a few showers. Brief southerly change.

Monday:
Fine with not much wind.


AUCKLAND (filed at 24-MAR-2010 01:57)

Wednesday
Showers. Northwesterly winds, strong in exposed places.

Thursday:
Showers, clearing in the afternoon but cloudy periods remaining. Westerly winds,becoming strong for a time in the middle of the day.

Friday:
Long fine spells, and cloudy periods, mainly in the west.Southwesterlies easing.

Saturday:
Long fine spells. Southwest winds.

Sunday:
Mainly fine, but one or two showers in the east.Winds turning southeast.

Monday:
Mainly fine, with cloudy periods in the east. Easterlies.

http://www.metservice.com/national/m...forecast-7-day

[scott2ride]

How about exclusive sessions for those who have a known habit of taking people out, preferably on different days.

Hahahaha... now were taiking!

[Shaun]

Thanks to Wharfy

[scott2ride]

Well well well... Karma IS a wonderful thing!!!!!

I have just discovered that the MNZ Board has investigated the accident and has suspended Mr Meads racing licence as a result of his recent actions at Hampton Downs.

Good on them for having the balls to take action on this.

And before anyone jumps up and down thinking they have no jurisdiction at a track day, think again! Ok, normally they dont. But there have been a number of incidents and as a result of past 'discussions' they have had with Meads, they were able to suspend his license.

I would be lying if I denied that brings a sly smile to my dial!

[Bren_chch]

good stuff! it seems he deserves it.

[Fatjim]

Surely his sponsors know of his riding style?

[sugilite:Me]

This is somewhat of a generalization, and several non-racing road riders I know are massively quick, smooth and very decisive. Having said that, I do agree that separating road and race riders has merit and it would be great to see if it is financially practical for operators of track days. But I suspect it wont be that simple as track days dont often have enough pure racers to devote a full 'class' to.

Personally, I prefer the fast group because normally they know their limits and dont do stupid moves like happened this time.

I've also found that there are people who have the latest litre bikes and feel pressured by ego to go in the fast group, and man are they dangerous as you watch them over ride themselves. One particular guy had me thinking it had to be an actual skill to ride that badly and run off at such a slow speed, scary stuff.

[roogazza]

I've also found that there are people who have the latest litre bikes and feel pressured by ego to go in the fast group, and man are they dangerous as you watch them over ride themselves. One particular guy had me thinking it had to be an actual skill to ride that badly and run off at such a slow speed, scary stuff.

One would expect that the standard would be reasonable in a fast group , but that isn't the case. I give everybody a wide berth until I've a had a look at them . Too true Sugilite, maybe an ego thing ?

[codgyoleracer]

One would expect that the standard would be reasonable in a fast group , but that isn't the case. I give everybody a wide berth until I've a had a look at them . Too true Sugilite, maybe an ego thing ?

The berth matches the girth then Gazza ? :-)

[roogazza]

The berth matches the girth then Gazza ? :-)

The girth is a problem I agree, but I felt much better when I saw Kerry D. a couple of weeks ago . He must have 30kgs on me ! Congrats on another Crown, by the way. G. xxxx

[The Pastor]

What about instead of having a completely seperate day for racers than joe public track days, why not have a 'racers' class for them to practice and if the reeeeaaaaally fast joe publics want to go out and give it death with them, then it gets 'approved' and off they go. It seems to me that racers have much to show joe public who might even want to get into racing, so why exclude them from track days?

Anyhoo, as you were...

You mean like races?

[scott2ride]

It is not about excluding racers from track days, or even separating fast track day riders from racers. What it is really about is everyone treating the day as what it is... "A Track Day". And as a track day there are rules and safety measures to ensure people can ride at a fast pace, but in relative safety.

Track days are an opportunity to improve your skills and ride a lot faster than you are 'legally' allowed to on the road. Practice cornering, braking, lines, learn from others more experienced etc.

Racers can attend and ride fast. But they need to respect the rules of the day just like everyone else. Nothing wrong with that!

Racers also have practice days prior to race meetings, and they also have the actual race weekends. So they have plenty of opportunities to go 'race pace' or get super aggressive in their passing and dont need to bring it to a track day. In fact they have more track time than everyone else as they get the races, the practice days AND the track days. Non racers only get the track days... and non racers deserve the chance to enjoy them without having to worry about someone deliberately cutting them up.

Hmmm... rant over

[Biggles08]

Racers also have practice days prior to race meetings, and they also have the actual race weekends. So they have plenty of opportunities to go 'race pace' or get super aggressive in their passing and dont need to bring it to a track day. In fact they have more track time than everyone else as they get the races, the practice days AND the track days. Non racers only get the track days... and non racers deserve the chance to enjoy them without having to worry about someone deliberately cutting them up.

Hmmm... rant over

I think this particular track day was in all honesty something a little different than most track days...it was immediately prior to the first ever National Round at Hampton Downs and it was a given that there was going to be plenty of racers there trying to set up their bikes for the Nationals. Hell thats why I was there :-). Personally I believe that in this particular case (irrelevant of the incident between you and Bryce) there should have been a class set aside for those competing at the Nationals.

Race pace and race lines no matter how you look at it cannot be simulated any other way apart from riding in race situations. It doesn't matter how fast you are on the road, when it comes to racing its a completely different game...especially at National Level. I personally was in the last 25% speed group of those that compete in the Nationals and riding at a track day only helped me familiarize myself with the track layout. Come the Nationals the next weekend, I was still fighting bike setup, passing points, defensive lines and blocking tactics as the only experience I had had on the track was at this track day really.

Down throughout the South Island rounds we had the opportunity to practice at race pace in race conditions and hence their were a few 'incidents' before we even made it to the race meeting BUT it is essential to have this opportunity before one of these events IMO.

Also, I understand your frustration at Bryce (rightly or wrongly) but I don't think its a fair call saying that Bryce "Deliberately" cut you off, that is simply hearsay and not based on anything factual. I have raced with Bryce for the last 6-8 months and have had no issues with his riding over this time...in fact he has helped me get faster over this time as he is an accomplished rider. As I have said before in this thread, I didn't see the events unfold between both of you so have nothing to add to who was at fault...but I will say something in his defense when you start bagging his intentions unfounded.

[scott2ride]

I think this particular track day was in all honesty something a little different than most track days...it was immediately prior to the first ever National Round at Hampton Downs and it was a given that there was going to be plenty of racers there trying to set up their bikes for the Nationals. Hell thats why I was there :-). Personally I believe that in this particular case (irrelevant of the incident between you and Bryce) there should have been a class set aside for those competing at the Nationals.

I guess given the number of racers at the meeting maybe they could have made the fast group racers only and this would have given you all better opportunity to setup your bikes. BUT... sadly they didnt do that. Instead they chose to strongly advise all racers that it wasnt a race day or even a practice day. Hell, as Im sure you recall they even took the fast group asside after the main breifing to give us a second briefing and warning that it wasnt a practice day and not to pass closely and to take it easy as non racers were in the group etc etc. Personally I wish they HAD set asside a seperate class fro racers, that way I'd be $6-7000 better off for gear and bike repairs.

Race pace and race lines no matter how you look at it cannot be simulated any other way apart from riding in race situations. It doesn't matter how fast you are on the road, when it comes to racing its a completely different game... .

Have to agree with you there.

Down throughout the South Island rounds we had the opportunity to practice at race pace in race conditions and hence their were a few 'incidents' before we even made it to the race meeting BUT it is essential to have this opportunity before one of these events IMO.

Yes I agree there too. Which is probably why they gave so many warnings not to pass within 2 meters and for racers to treat this a s a track day not a race day. So yep you are right, its important for racers like yourselves and Bryce to have some quality practice time and be able to go at race pace. Just not at an trackday event where they specifically prohibit that. And dont get me wrong. I saw you out there riding and you managed to make passes with plenty of room and make good passing decisions based on the day.

And that works both ways... in a race you make calculated decisions on squeezing through the gap and out braking etc, and at a track day you tailor that behavior to suit the event and situation. Most racers do this extremely well and I expect Bryce is more than talented enough to do the same.

Also, I understand your frustration at Bryce (rightly or wrongly) but I don't think its a fair call saying that Bryce "Deliberately" cut you off, that is simply hearsay and not based on anything factual.

I guess opinion is what these forums is all about. You say its not factual, yet how do you know he didnt deliberately cut me up!? Maybe he did! Only he knows.

To be fair, I said "...non racers deserve the chance to enjoy trackdays without having to worry about someone deliberately cutting them up." It was a generalised comment.

But hey... I agree. I withdraw any implication that Bryce may have cut me off. He didnt cut me off OR cut me up. What he did was knock me off. Quite a difference and certainly not simply an opinion.

I have raced with Bryce for the last 6-8 months and have had no issues with his riding over this time...in fact he has helped me get faster over this time as he is an accomplished rider. As I have said before in this thread, I didn't see the events unfold between both of you so have nothing to add to who was at fault...but I will say something in his defense when you start bagging his intentions unfounded.

I realise he is a friend of yours and you feel the need to defend him. Thats cool. It's true I dont know his true intentions and Im pretty sure he didnt intend to knock me or anyone else off. But after hearing what others who saw it clearly have said, and after talking to him, and after hearing about a number of other incidents like this, it is my opinion that he saw us in a group going at a fairly moderate pace with coldish tyres, and he thought he could take us all in one foul swoop and look like a bit of a hero doing it. He's young and no doubt a bit impetuous. Its just a shame I got hurt and my bike and gear trashed.

At the end of the day I stand by my comment that "non racers deserve the chance to enjoy trackdays without having to worry about someone deliberately cutting them up." Whether Bryce did that or not is a moot point, though his history is hardly angelic and his attitude to the whole this wasnt exactly 'sporting', so you cant really say the implication was unfounded. Though I agree, I dont actually know his intentions. Either way, his actions got him kicked out of the event, got him banned from future Hampton trackdays, and got his race license suspended by MNZ. So all in all the general opinion of his actions wasnt too well received.

The fact is that many riders DO make a habit of cutting others off and riding irresponsibly to try to prove to themselves and others that they are 'great riders'. He has a history of 'incidents' and even you were not surprised when you spoke to me on the day. But his real motive is unknown.

Look I shouldnt be wasting any more time on this and neither should you. I dont know Bryce and maybe hes a great guy. Good if he is. He just didnt seem to concerned about me, my injuries or the damage he caused. Maybe he will be a little more careful next time he is on the track? Who knows. he may not have given it a second thought until it resulted in his race license being suspended. But for me it will take a lot longer and wont be over till Im fully healed and have managed to pay for the repairs.

Funny thing is, if he had simply walked over to me and apologized for knocking me off (like he was asked to do by the marshals) and shown some concern for my injuries or damaged bike, then it would no doubt have ended on the day and wouldnt have resulted in his race license being suspended.

Good luck with your racing Marcus. I've met you a couple of times now on and off track and I do seriously wish you the best.

[R6_kid:Me]

I guess opinion is what these forums is all about. You say its not factual, yet how do you know he didnt deliberately cut me up!? Maybe he did! Only he knows

Do you have any reason what so ever to suggest that he would have done it on purpose? From what I've been told he'd spoken to you before that session and knew you weren't on tyre warmers so was expecting you to be running at a slower pace in the first few laps? Is it completely inconceivable that from his position he may have thought he'd perhaps made a clean pass on you and was clear to take "your line"? I think not - but then it's also fair to say that given it was a track day he shouldn't have been so eager to get in front of you so early in the session.

From what I saw from the outside of T1, the initial contact may not have actually been what made you crash. Your bike stood up and ran straight ahead for some distance (hard to judge) before the front wheel locked and it was all over rover. This doesn't clear Bryce from any blame - as he was still the trigger in the chain of events that lead to your crash. Perhaps your reaction to him 'cutting you off' was the final cause of your crashing?

Obviously you have (have had) some serious emotion attached to the event - and fair enough, I'd be bloody pissed if the same had happened to me. But if you go back and re-read your series of events and the way you describe him you come off as a bit of a cock. I've seen the video you posted on the Aprilia forum and that doesn't do any favours for you. You say you're a father blah blah blah - and then you go and act up like that on the internet making out that you're a tough guy who's gonna put your heavies on him?

The version of events I've heard from the other side of the story seem to point out that you didn't give Bryce much of a chance to apologise. I also hear that the first thing Bryces dad asked when you came over was if you were ok. Bear in mind that they had 5-6hr drive home ahead of them so they may have wanted to make sure they had things under control in their camp before coming to talk to you - just because you approached them first doesn't mean they had no intention of coming to talk to you before they left.

On a side note, I see that you were mentioning potential court action? I seriously hope that's just 'big boy posturing' on the internet - if you are actually considering going through with it then I sincerely urge you to consider the consequences that such action would have on every other trackday user in the country.