Dear Mr English, I don't want a tax cut

[freedom-wedge]

You're thinking way too short term and that's an exceptionally naive view of the finance that it takes to evade taxation. I know of a few people that pay absolute minimal tax and I mean they somehow JUST scrape under the minimal tax bracket, yet they earn over 200k (and there are lots of people that earn that kinda cash here). They have depreciating assets, businesses that constantly run at a loss, wouldn't surprise me if there's an offshore account in there somewhere too... Add that up would ya. I'd reackon you're looking at hundreds of millions if not billions of dollars that aren't going to where they should be.

Taking the longer term view... these guys, that don't pay the FULL taxes that the rest of us pay, will eventually retire and their pension, superannuation here? will be serviced by those that do pay full taxes. Similar to ACC they will get their salaries paid at whatever levels are set when they no longer work (albeit not through injury)... They earned it? NO they didn't, they dodged as much tax as they possibly could (potentially all of it) and therefore are not due their superannuation in my eyes. Add to that the FACT that the upper tax threshold is 136k per year and there's already 64K of what should be taxed income not being taxed... Why not? I pay tax on my whole salary, as do the majority of the country... yet these guys don't and still receive the full superannuation that they are "entitled" to... If i'm wrong, make mine a humble pie...

Example: A banker in the UK was dismissed for losing 24 billion pounds... yet he will retire on 671,000 pounds per year... who pays for that? those who pay taxes... and I bet he isn't one of them...

That's your kids and mine paying for this... it's utter bullshit... you're either trolling or don't give a fuck.

The rich exist at the top, tax advantage is at this level, they can afford the best advice in order to pretect what they earn, the system is also set up to aid and abet this situation, it what the politicos rely on and live on and breath on, yeah I,m with the mash man on this one, buget day - yawn, tax the smokers and drinkers and and by fuck tax those motorcycle riders some more becucase someons got to pay for what Im giving back, FFS.

[mashman]

So, a couple of points in response:

1) These people aren't going to see much out of the tax cut then are they? But they presumably spend a fair bit of money, they're not just stuffing mattresses with fivers, so the GST increase will hit them harder...

2) It costs money on lawyers and accountants to structure your affairs to avoid (I'll use the nice term for the legal activity) tax. It's quite possible to lower tax rates and increase tax take as it becomes easier just to pay up. I believe that's what happened under Reagan in the US.

1) they generally don't need to spend any more than you or me. It's the luxury items that they get stung on... most of which they already have. So i'd argue that your statement is 50% correct? Also, they are accruing interest and living "frugally" they can quite happily live off of it and save the rest... guess it all depends on what the money is used for... but not all spend it, well not here anyway.

2) I totally agree, but the setup fees are generally a one off and are an affordable trade for the gains made... but again, that's an uneducated guess... otherwise why would these "services" be available for tax restructuring

[mashman]

The rich exist at the top, tax advantage is at this level, they can afford the best advice in order to pretect what they earn, the system is also set up to aid and abet this situation, it what the politicos rely on and live on and breath on, yeah I,m with the mash man on this one, buget day - yawn, tax the smokers and drinkers and and by fuck tax those motorcycle riders some more becucase someons got to pay for what Im giving back, FFS.

but we need the rich people apparantly... the prime minister of the UK said so and so does the prime minister of NZ... they can't noth be wrong... they bring so much to the economy... who's holding the calculator again?

[mashman]

I see living in a civil society something that I am willing to pay for, and if we live in a world where we can't afford to buy the essentials of a decent civil society I see no reason to pay less. But then I have always believed that life is about paying your way and taking responsibility for your own results. I want to live in a world that is better than the one we live in now, and I'm happy to contribute to that as opposed to just moaning about it.

Me too. But i'd rather the society "cost" nothing more than a Thank You and a smile.

[cowpoos]

Dear Mr. English, I know you're planning to give me a tax cut in the budget, but I don't really want it and certainly don't need it. Instead of an extra $30 - $40 a week in my pocket, which I'll only spend, what I want is:

To know that if I get sick or injured that there is a well equipped hospital waiting for me, and that I won't find a massive bill when I leave

To know that my kids can go to a well resourced school with great teachers who are well trained and well rewarded.

To know that if I call the cops they'll treat my problem as a priority, and won't be parked on the side of the road taking photos of people doing 112 kmh.

To know my daughter can walk to the bus stop safely.

To know that when the guy up the road is out of work that he is given enough money to enable him to live in dignity, and maybe not feel tempted by my open bathroom window. And I want to know that his case worker is actually on his case, not snowed under and under resourced.

To know that the woman up the road bringing up her kids on her own is able to feed and clothe them in a way that doesn't bring shame on her and on them.

To know that if the country ever needs them, whether in war or crisis, that our service personelle are well equipped and trained for the task ahead of them.

To ride my motorcycle on clean, well maintained roads.

To live in a country that rewards clever and hard working people, not just people who own stuff.

Mr. English, if I want an extra few dollars, I'll go and earn it because I have control over that, so don't try and make me happy by giving me something I can get for myself. Give me the things I need that I can't get for myself and I might just ask you to come back in 2011.

Yours, a voter.

Welcome to the website Phill Goff

By the way...no one actually knows who you are....and only thick people vote for you...so good luck with your campaign building up to the next election...you'll be forgotten shortly.

[and for the record...the core of your voters are smarter than you think...they don't fall for your crap!]

As a clever and hard working person, I'm more interested in finding new ways to earn more and having the infrastructure that rewards entrepreneurialism and creativity than to get a few cents an hour extra in tax (that will go straight away in GST).

You ain't clever Mr Goff...Entrepreneurs are after money...give them more they will want more...and create jobs,bussenisses along the way...take thier money off them...they go overseas...along with all the doctors and teachers and other professionals that are in the higher tax brackets that piss of overseas that we actually need??? Did you think about that Phill?? hmm?? No??? ohhh.....thats because you ain't that clever!

It is a myth that private business is more efficient than government, but one that Act works hard to promulgate and one that will have us all paying even more for ACC. Modern government is surprisingly efficient and well run, and is pretty well a match for the private sector. The big difference is that in government there is no requirement to produce a profit for the owners (increasingly offshore entities) because we are the owners therefore state supplied goods and services can be offered at a lower cost than the private sector.

Labour kept New Zealanders poor..Mr Goff...by having over inflated systems and bureaucratic bull crap...managers in public service are the highest payed...and are most definatly no more efficient...just saying so doesn't make you right... check your facts Phill.

"This would give someone on $50,000 an extra $20 a week in the hand but when the GST rise is included, it reduces to $6."

ooooo i can hear the till bells ringin now... Most of these rich folk don't need tax cuts BECAUSE THEY DON'T PAY ANY FUCKIN TAX... and the above quote from Donkey illustrates what the "masses" believe to be true... Get the fuckers out that are hoarding the money, because they spend most of it overseas because there's fuck all to buy here...

errrrr.....your way way way to dumb to be a labour supporter....Mcgilicuty serious party??? hmm?

[freedom-wedge]

is that I am not looking to the government to give me money, whether that's in the form of a tax cut or a benefit payment because I actually have enough money, and if I wanted or needed more I'd go out and make it myself. I wouldn't refuse to improve my skills, build my business or work harder unless I got a tax cut first - I'd get off my arse and make the changes. Then I wouldn't need a tax cut.

And what I want the government to do is provide a civil society where people are valued ahead of profit (typically for overseas companies). I want the government to think beyond the next election, and who aren't going to sell everything they can.

And as a businessman I want an environment that supports small businesses to grow and succeed and not an environment that purely supports globalisation. I don't want to set up a factory in China to make things, I want to make them here. I don't want the entire banking system to be foreign owned, so when more money is to made lending money to Asian businesses than Kiwi businesses, I get turned down. I have some ideas that I'd like to develop - how about providing me with support to develop them?

look shrubster, the gov arnt interested in gross national happiness, you migh have to move to nepal for that, not even trafiic lights there, imagine the fun you could have on your iron horse, or 1000cc rikshaw ;-) I do hear ya words though

[mashman]

errrrr.....your way way way to dumb to be a labour supporter....Mcgilicuty serious party??? hmm?

thank god for that, i thought there was something wrong with me for a moment... I see Mr Magoo is still alive and kicking

[cowpoos]

Anyone that has enough money to make it ALL tax free...

Like a person earning 45k....3 children....tax free because of working for families???

[shrub]

ACC investments made a (very healthy) profit.

Shhhh.... don't say that, you'll undo all the good work of the national party spin doctors.

[shrub]

Me too. But i'd rather the society "cost" nothing more than a Thank You and a smile.

Amen brother, sadly the only way I have found where I can get the stuff I want is to pay for it with either work or cash earned working. I'd love it if the Government didn't need to tax me and I still had all the benefits of living in an advanced civil society, but that's kind of like perpetual motion, time travel and the return of Elvis - be lovely if they were true, but the laws of physics and all that...

[cowpoos]

. you're either trolling or don't give a fuck.

Don't be do hipocritical matie...you hav a very slim veiw of what are facts and what your mate told you over a joint over the back fence!!

People who earn more, pay more tax...It maybe hard for someone who's not very intelectual to understand...but its true....even with out our progressive taxation system that gets higher as you earn more. if it were a flat tax rate say 20%...and you earn 50k...You pay 10k pre year....Mr money bags earns 100k...he pays 20k a year...and yes...he does still have more money than you...why?? because he is most likey a better more productive person, smarter,probally better looking and will have a much larger penis....but besides all that...is it not clear that he pays more???

[shrub]

[QUOTE=cowpoos;1129755195] Labour kept New Zealanders poor..Mr Goff...by having over inflated systems and bureaucratic bull crap...managers in public service are the highest payed...and are most definatly no more efficient...just saying so doesn't make you right... check your facts Phill.
QUOTE]

Nobody kept me poor (or for that matter most of the people I know). In fact most of us made a shitload of cash under Labour, but I got ahead by working hard and being smart, and that had nothing to do with tax cuts or government spending and everything to do with my attitude and abilities.

[mashman]

Like a person earning 45k....3 children....tax free because of working for families???

fair point...

[freedom-wedge]

because since the 1980s we have been operating on the paradigm of cutting services to balance the books, and now we have a stripped infrastructure that delivers very little. Labour tried to rebuild infrastructure, but they got derailed and ended up doing a half arsed job which resulted in more bureaucracy and not much more services. Now we have an equally inept pack of idiots who will strip things back to nothing again without any thought to the long term outcomes of their actions.

And this is as serious as it gets, these idiots are more skilled at the scam than the previous lot, more capable because they know that they have to reward their friends from way back who have waited long and hard for you to pay just one dollar a day for the little company that waits, sheesh we gonna pay for deals done while these fellas were trying to oust Helen and making promises with cronies to do so, and no I,m not a red, I,m just not an easy sell, Please Mr English can you save us the tax cuts and stop our old people dying on the hospital waiting lists.

[cowpoos]

Please Mr English can you save us the tax cuts and stop our old people dying on the hospital waiting lists.

So if health gets more money on the 20th you'll vote national??? because labour had 9 years and achived nothing in that regard!