Has the current propaganda focus on speed and road safety affected how you ride?

[AllanB]

Thou the latest plan of plod, where they will install plate identification cameras at a distance apart and then have software that calculates how long it took to get from A to B (we are talking mutiple Km's apart here) and if you could NOT have done that distance in the short time it took you they will fine you, is a new twist. The way I understand it these cameras could be 50Km's apart..

Now this is interesting - I see it only working over a shirt distance other wise there could be too many factors in play unless they allow a very generous margin in their calculations.

For example presumably someone first drives the distance at a legal speed to do a 'test' distance. Now if I come along on my motorcycle, again not exceeding the speed limit but briskly throwing it into corners and shortening said corners in our usual manner by straightening them up I may well be significantly quicker and cover less distance over the 50kms. Am I right?

Again if they are really concerned about excessive speeds each vehicle could be fitted with a electronic monitoring system that they could bluetooth and it would tell the office what speeds you have been doing today. Indeed why not just have to do a compulsory download from your vehicle every day into a police computer and they can automatically debit your bank account.

I should probably stop this, as someone in Government may well be reading .....

[cheshirecat]

This Official speed debate has been going on for ever and a day. I remember similar official discussions when starting riding 40 years ago - sh''t that dates me!

I've done plenty of time where traffic speeds are significantly higher than here but accident rates are signif lower - you ever tried getting onto a UK roundabout in a underpowered auto. No doubt anyone who have ridden in France and Germany know cars drivers really know their vehicles and expect you to know yours. I remember being burnt off by two French nuns in 2CV once on my tricked up CB750. Tres embarasing.

Personally I'd much rather they put effort into rewarding good drivers/road users and hitting red light runners, drunks, center line crossers, dopey 'sunday' drivers blah blah and a decent driving test where amongst other things (big list potential here) you don't give a lisence for two tons of metal to a 15 year old in a non urban lax settting. There - - and I've spelt license wrong.

[AllanB]

Red light runners - welcome to Christchurch!

I cannot believe that action down here - utter madness. As a result I never take off at speed on a green - I have a darn good look first.

[Conquiztador]

Now this is interesting - I see it only working over a shirt distance other wise there could be too many factors in play unless they allow a very generous margin in their calculations.

For example presumably someone first drives the distance at a legal speed to do a 'test' distance. Now if I come along on my motorcycle, again not exceeding the speed limit but briskly throwing it into corners and shortening said corners in our usual manner by straightening them up I may well be significantly quicker and cover less distance over the 50kms. Am I right?

The way I understood it is that the cameras would be set up over a distance where there is no changes in the speed limit. Lets say that they are 10 Km apart and it is a 100Km/h road. That means you can do that in 6 minutes. Any less and you had to be speeding at some stage. = Fine!

[swbarnett]

Again if they are really concerned about excessive speeds each vehicle could be fitted with a electronic monitoring system that they could bluetooth and it would tell the office what speeds you have been doing today. Indeed why not just have to do a compulsory download from your vehicle every day into a police computer and they can automatically debit your bank account.

I should probably stop this, as someone in Government may well be reading .....

Don't worry, I'm sure they've already thought it.

The reason they don't try and implement anything so drastic is that it would violate the boiling frog principle that politicians are so fond of. Personly I wish they would push the envelope a lot further. Then they would find out just what us apathetic kiwis are capable of (aka the UK poll tax).

[Voltaire]

Don't worry, I'm sure they've already thought it.

The reason they don't try and implement anything so drastic is that it would violate the boiling frog principle that politicians are so fond of. Personly I wish they would push the envelope a lot further. Then they would find out just what us apathetic kiwis are capable of (aka the UK poll tax).

Cor..i remember the poll tax....we couldn't join the Clapham library in case they caught us....... and we kept a filled out Tele licence by the front door....we lived in fear.....
If they tried a Poll Tax....imagine all the internet whining......

[Rhys]

They have cameras/computers that can read your plate and tell if its got rego and wof

That may have some of us unstuck

[Conquiztador]

They have cameras/computers that can read your plate and tell if its got rego and wof

That may have some of us unstuck

I have a bunch of old plates that I find useful...(always wanted to use that one)

[oldrider]

I often hear statements from the authorities that alcohol is a factor in a large percentage of road deaths and accidents.

It also causes untold social issues from (ahem) lubricating (so to speak) young girls into sexy-times they would not entertain if sober (pretty sure that used to be called dating a few decades back ), family violence and numerous medical issues. Not to mention the stink of urine around town on a Saturday morning.

So logically it should be banned.

I may have to ponder this over a cool beer.


Back to speeding - if indeed speeding is so evil it would be a easy thing for all motorized vehicles to be governed to say 125 max (giving a emergency allowance).
I was looking at a $360,000 Maserati this afternoon (just looking, no touching!) as I waited for a tyre to be fitted - I bet that will never go over 100!.

It would be just as logical to say: "Politicians are a factor in bad political decisions" too and it would make about the same amount of sense!

We are lead by lunatics!

[swbarnett]

Cor..i remember the poll tax....we couldn't join the Clapham library in case they caught us....... and we kept a filled out Tele licence by the front door....we lived in fear.....

What I remember is the riots depicted on the news and Thatcher having to back down.

If they tried a Poll Tax....imagine all the internet whining......

Maybe not a poll tax but there must be something that our government could try to do that would shock us out of our complacency. I wish they would try.

In the words of Thomas Jefferson - "Eternel vigilence is the price of liberty". It seems in NZ we have it so good that we've fallen asleep. When we finally wake up we won't have any liberty left.

[p.dath]

It can be done - I've been at almost twice that speed on gravel in a cage. Wouldn't try it on the CBR though.

Its not the gravel that prevents you travelling at 100km/h on that road road. It's the tight blind corners, the corrugations in the road, the width of the road, and then combine that with night and you just can't travel at 100km/h on that road.

[scumdog]

It can be done - I've been at almost twice that speed on gravel in a cage. Wouldn't try it on the CBR though.

Yeah, but for how long 'at almost twice that speed'?

[davebullet]

Think I'll start another poll.

How many of you have ever seen another person's core behaviour permanently change?

Agreed. the longer I live, the more I reaslise I am comfortable with my perception of law and rules. My behaviour like my personality will never change.

I suppose the focus of a 5kph tolerance has made me more aware, but there are still stretches of road where 100kph is below the safe speed limit, and 80kph is above the safe speed limit. I still choose the speed I determine is safe.

[avgas]

Perhaps the dabate should be how many deaths per 1000k travelled is acceptable (or some other hopelessly complicated metric).

Because you're never, ever, ever going to reach zero.

One death per square meter would be acceptable to me.

May be then everyone else would respect how lucky we are not to die on the roads.

[schrodingers cat]

One death per square meter would be acceptable to me.

May be then everyone else would respect how lucky we are not to die on the roads.

Or getting out of bed even.

People die. All the time and in all sorts of ways.
Some people kill themselves quickly - some take their time.

The point is, it is utopian to presume that all of us will live to '3 score years and 10'.

I for one am sick of the hand wringing that goes on every time anyone under 20 is killed. Wonderful person, wasted talent, promising future, kissed his grandmother, whatever.

In 2009 376 people died on the roads. From 4.1 million that is 0.0000917% of the population or 0.0917 deaths per 1000

During WW1 with a population of 1.1 million, 18 050 casulties over 4 years or 0.0041% of the population - 43 times more. ( 4.102 deaths per 1000 population)

So flame away - you've never lost a loved one etc. That is true. Its just I think debate should be logical and supported by fact rather than an emotional tirade so I welcome your intellectual contribution.

Here's the question again - fellow worshippers of the internal combustion engine ; how many lives is an acceptable number to sacrifice per year at the alter to appease the 'god of speed' and all the benefits she brings to society?

The answer cannot be zero.
If you want it to be zero - enjoy your mud hut and don't let a sabre toothed tiger eat you before you die of old age at 26 years old