PC brigade already on the offensive at police chases

[Scouse]

I was cooking dinner tonight while listening to the news (yes, shock, I do cook, and I do listen to the news) and heard this woman bleating on about the police having to be responsible for their part in the fatal crash of the young boy driving a stolen car at high speed. Ooops, make that "allegedly driving an allegedly stolen car at allegedly high speed". [oops, quick edit, I know she didn't say those words, it's not a quote, they're my speech marks]. Had to put the knife down and do some slow breathing as my blood pressure got higher and higher...

What the hell is wrong with these people who go on and on about Police causing these things to happen when the bloody offenders choose to do a runner?

I can understand the boy's family being distressed but to be angry at the Police because "you can replace a car but you can't replace a person" (quote from the family), well...would they still be saying the same if their son/grandson/nephew had caused a fatal crash with some other poor innocent who happened to be in his way? (particularly if the police had chosen earlier not to persue). The police called off the pursuit but obviously any length of pursuit is unacceptable to some people.

It makes my blood boil that they believe their little theiving offspring should be able to go about their unlawful business at their leisure because the police have no right to attempt to catch them.


Aaaaaarrrrggggggh. Yes death is usually a tragedy, and I guess no one "deserves" to die in a car chase, but what the hell do these people want? Police to leave them to their own devices then cause a fatal through their actions or try and apprehend them before they become a cause. Aaaaaarrrrrrggggggh.

I know it almost like these people aprove of their useless scumsucking offspring being thieves

[Scouse]

She was from the Candor Trust (whatever that is).

She is a member of this site look up Candor in the members list

[2wheeldrifter]

Yes it is possible, standby and fantasize.

Yes it is indeed possible..........

Oh ok, just 'cos you asked so nicely.

small print: some details might differ from that shown!
Attachment 228068

Hey, the hair colour is the same though...

Thank you PB

[Scouse]

Yeah yeah yeah, blah blah blah, but you aint answered my questions yet noodles....

What were were you cooking and what were you wearing when you were cooking it?

Lets paint our own picture eh. I say nekid except for a PVC apron and a pair of stiletto shoes and the menu consisted of oysters (dont worry Max im gettin to the important bit) in a pie

[Swoop]

Individuals can choose not to take responsibility

They get the opportunity to take their own responsibility when they stand in the "accused's" box in the courtroom. The light hopefully comes on at that stage.

Everything comes down to the individual. How they are raised by the parents and the moral standards set for them. Let parents do their job, without the interference of the government's (agenda-driven) agencies. Instill PERSONAL responsibility into every child.

[Scouse]

If the family want my sympathy they can start by paying for the power pole.
And thanking the guys who were dragged away from their families in the wee small hours to clean up the mess this fucktard made.

If the family want sympathy they should go and look it up in the dictionary they will find it somewhere between shit and syphilis

[Maha]

I know it almost like these people aprove of their useless scumsucking offspring being thieves

Correct Steve, a thief is a thief, a dead one only means that there is one less thief around to make someones life a complete misery.

[slowpoke]

I don't think it is entirely about removal of the ability to influence children. For me it is in the government taking responsiblity for so many aspects of people's lives that the attitude, in general, has become one of "She'll be alright mate, the govt will take care of it."

You don't need retirement savings, because there is Superannuation.
You don't need health insurance, because there is free health-care.
You don't need income protection, because there is welfare.
You don't need to work, because there is welfare.
You don't need insurance, because there is ACC.
You don't need to take of your children, because there is free child-care.
You don't need to work harder or smarter, because there is Working for Families.
You don't need to improve yourself, because the government will take care of you.
Everybody needs to be equal - let's redistribute income to make it so.
There are no winners or losers.
You can't eat pies because they make you fat - let's take them out of tuckshops.
You can't do this.
You can't do that.

It goes on and on and on. I'm painting in very broad strokes, but I do believe those types of things which "socialists" generally paint as taking care of people are actually removing their desire to take care of themselves.

Why would somebody work to improve themselves when they know they can get a top-up on their income from Working for Families?

Why would a family save for their children's education when they can get interest free student loans?

I'm not taking shots at those items specifically. There is good in a lot of that. But I also think it has helped to breed generations of people who are slowly losing their independance from their government. And that fucking terrifies me.

I can kinda see your reasoning but I'm not convinced.

And what's the alternative?

Are we gonna just say "sorry, you're on your own" to the poor old buggers who lost their life savings to another folding finance company? Same to the young bloke knocked off his bike through no fault of his own? Or the meatworkers laid off with falling lamb prices? How do these people look after themselves?

You are living in a bubble if you don't think we are living in an aspirational society. Everybody wants more/better/newer/shinier/faster something or other. There's no-way you can afford any of that shit we never knew we always needed living on the subsistence welfare payments you are talking about......hence you go and steal it instead.

I really don't see the problem with any of the above examples in principle. Aren't governments supposed to help/educate/service/protect/secure it's people? If not, then what do you see as their role?

Can CYFS serve orders to have children removed from happy homes (sometimes the information is wrong, or the "argument" has been greatly exaggerated)? Do you know what an ASBO is? Just 2 examples of personal and parental responsibility being removed by the govt. And that's just 2 that I know of.

I'm sure there are some parents that are glad to see the back of their kids and happily relinquish the responsibility. Hardly surprising when you look around at some of the kids these days, attacking policemen, vandalising, general thuggery etc... the list of their talents is endless. Some people can't handle it. The govt washes their hands too... they just give the kids a house and a few bucks each week and they've done their bit. Then people wonder why society is shit, it must be the parents.

I disagree that the govt is not responsible. It may not be wholly responsible, but they're taking over the parenting role, giving the kid a roof and money for food and play etc... What then? Kid on his own. Money in his pocket, system to abuse... Game on.

Again, what is the alternative? CYF are damned if they do, damned if they don't intervene. For every headline of an interferring CYF, there's half a dozen regarding why they didn't do something sooner.

But by and large there is nothing preventing average well adjusted parents from raising well adjusted kids, least of all government interference. Trouble is when things don't go to plan a lot of folks tend to look at themselves last rather than first. I'm not saying it's all parents fault, but despite all the socialist conspiracy theory's to the contrary they have the biggest responsibility and most influence with their developing children, like it or not.

[JimO]

the cause of this problem goes further than young crims stealing cars, it starts with the paying money to people to have children, usually the people who can least handle the responsibility of rasing ONE child end up with many children. These people dont give a shit what the kids get up to, its a self perpetuating formula the kids make more kids for the money. I adopted a pup from the spca before xmas they came and checked my property to make sure i had suitable accommodation, they checked with the local council to make sure i hadnt been in trouble with them with other dogs, i can have as many kids as i want . The problem is the same as the child abuse problem its over represented with maori and i feel its time the maori leaders stood up and took ownership of the havoc being caused by their young people, pour the treaty money into education for their young. Im sick of hearing that the education system is failing maori. Its not normal behavior for a 15 year old to steal cars and its not normal to run from the cops. Personally i couldnt care less if all the car theifs killed themselves as long as no innocent person is injured

[AD345]

Jesus Christ, there's some reactionary bullshit on this thread.

Too feckin hot to type out my reply now.

So I'll just say that having raised 2 kids and now watchng 3 grandkids grow up I'm pretty happy that it took place in this society and I'm equally confident that all 5 of them are going to continue to carry on living in peace and contentment.

The usual travails of life will come and go but I have no fears for the future

[Flip]

I think that he was just an ignorant child, he made a mistake and has paid the price. It was not his parents fault, it was not the Police's fault and it sure as hell was not the governments fault. Society without exception does have a responsibility to care for its young but there is a big difference between responsibility and blame.

A certain number of every new generation rebel and every generation is concerned about the behavior of its children, it was so for Plato in 350 BC, it was so for Winston Churchill and it is so now for me/us.

I believe the virtue is knowledge, knowledge is gained by experience. So without experience it is difficult if not impossible to have virtue.

When I was a kid I did stupid things, never stole a car but several of my friends and family did and they have without exception turned out OK (after 40 years). I actually feel sorry for the youth of today, there is so much more scrutiny of the youth these days than there was when I was a young punk.

[FJRider]

Perhaps a return to personal responsibility for one's actions ... is this a case a disrespect for the law in general ... or just a disrespect for the laws we find "inconvenient" ... (more than a few on site are guilty of that)

Decisions we make often tend to bite us in the ass later ... or kill us !!!

Blame is for those that won't admit THEY made wrong decisions ... or those that NEVER made wrong decisions ...

If ... when/after making ANY decision ... you ask yourself, whats the worst thing that could happen ??? and if the answer is ... you may die ... think again about your decision ...

and you may live ... to think on it some more ...

[oldrider]

Sorry, don't agree.

There is no public servant parked in your lounge room 24/7 so exactly how have governments removed the ability of parents to influence their children?

Exactly what is it that the government and the rest of us "Socialists" are stopping parents from doing that would make all the difference? Exactly how are parents hands tied? These things must be written somewhere, where do I find them?

Sorry, but parents can still talk to their kids, can still set an example, can still involve/encourage/assist them in sports and/or education, can still choose who they decide to let into their house, can stop sub-10 year olds from cruising the streets at crazy hours, can teach respect for people/property/animals etc etc etc etc.

Nup, personal/parental responsibility is not something a government can take away, it's something you choose to relinquish.

Not true any more, it used to be like that!

Government legislation "is" present in your lounge 24/7 and all of the parental rights you have listed have been legislated out of existence!

As a parent "all you have is love" and when that fails you are in deep doo doo and if the child wishes to proceed to challenge your love further, the government (State) departments will step in and support the Child!

I hope you never ever have to test the system but if you do, you will find it is designed for you (the parents) to lose!

[mashman]

Not true any more, it used to be like that!

Government legislation "is" present in your lounge 24/7 and all of the parental rights you have listed have been legislated out of existence!

As a parent "all you have is love" and when that fails you are in deep doo doo and if the child wishes to proceed to challenge your love further, the government (State) departments will step in and support the Child!

I hope you never ever have to test the system but if you do, you will find it is designed for you (the parents) to lose!

nae bling to give.

And don't an awful lot of the youth of today know it

[trustme]

When I was a kid I did stupid things, never stole a car but several of my friends and family did and they have without exception turned out OK (after 40 years). I actually feel sorry for the youth of today, there is so much more scrutiny of the youth these days than there was when I was a young punk.

The scrutiny has always been there. The modern world has removed the discretionary powers of those in authority. Dealing with kids doing dumb shit used to be in many circumstances an ' off the record ' matter, unfortunately that is no longer possible.
Kids have always pushed the limits, kids today get away with so much more than we did. Some just don't recognise where the limits are.