PC brigade already on the offensive at police chases

[slowpoke]

Fwiw possibly imposing punishments that actually deter people from doing shit may be a start,personally i cant fucking believe the ongoing inability of those that impose punishments ie Judges to impose them,pick up any court day newspaper in the country and have a read,pathetic is an understatement even more so when it comes to the drink driving thing.What is it in this country that everyone knows what the problems are but nobody steps up and sorts it come court day,drink driving,drivers doing a runner etc its all part of the same problem and for my money the problem is come time to pay the piper its a joke.Fuck all the surveys/discussion blah blah,simply impose a punishment that deters.

I hear ya.....I'm just not sure that the common or garden variety punishment that deters you and I (heavy fine, loss of license, jail time etc) is something these joy riding kids are scared of. Playing with the cops is all part of their game, and being caught is nothing to be scared of. They have no money or assests so a fine means bugger all, same for the license. Even jail time isn't a deterrent as they go away for a while, hang with their mates, make some good connections, and come back with "instant" cred/rep/mana that stands them in good stead within their peer group/community. Besides we have to pay for their jail time so surely there's something smarter we can come up with than just doubling/tripling the penalties and shooting ourselves in the foot.

I'm all for an effective deterrent but just not sure what it is. Yeah, I can hear a few folks wailing for capital punishment, but if it doesn't happen for murder/rape it isn't gonna happen for pinching a car, so best you think of something else constructive.

[98tls]

I hear ya.....I'm just not sure that the common or garden variety punishment that deters you and I (heavy fine, loss of license, jail time etc) is something these joy riding kids are scared of. Playing with the cops is all part of their game, and being caught is nothing to be scared of. They have no money or assests so a fine means bugger all, same for the license. Even jail time isn't a deterrent as they go away for a while, hang with their mates, make some good connections, and come back with "instant" cred/rep/mana that stands them in good stead within their peer group/community. Besides we have to pay for their jail time so surely there's something smarter we can come up with than just doubling/tripling the penalties and shooting ourselves in the foot.

I'm all for an effective deterrent but just not sure what it is. Yeah, I can hear a few folks wailing for capital punishment, but if it doesn't happen for murder/rape it isn't gonna happen for pinching a car, so best you think of something else constructive.

Not so sure on the jail thing mate,methinks plenty of them would scream like babies when confronted with a stint in the big house,sure not all but methinks the majority would shit there pants and actually learn something.That aside and on the drink driving thing i am sure many would be put off some if instead of wasting everyones time (inclusive of theres) there was a mandatory 6-12 month sentence for your 1ST conviction (all the PD and bullshit teaches nothing to 1st timers or 5th timers),losing a job means for many losing a house etc therefore affecting the people or things they actually give a fuck about in life family/possesions etc ie hurt them where they hurt most or at least hurt.Simply no ifs buts and we dont give a shit about your old mans drinking problem etc just go to jail,a year or 2 of that would deter many i am sure and deter both the ones starting out on that road and the ones way down it that are continually babied by our fucked up court system.

[slowpoke]

Not so sure on the jail thing mate,methinks plenty of them would scream like babies when confronted with a stint in the big house,sure not all but methinks the majority would shit there pants and actually learn something.That aside and on the drink driving thing i am sure many would be put off some if instead of wasting everyones time (inclusive of theres) there was a mandatory 6-12 month sentence for your 1ST conviction (all the PD and bullshit teaches nothing to 1st timers or 5th timers),losing a job means for many losing a house etc therefore affecting the people or things they actually give a fuck about in life family/possesions etc ie hurt them where they hurt most or at least hurt.Simply no ifs buts and we dont give a shit about your old mans drinking problem etc just go to jail,a year or 2 of that would deter many i am sure and deter both the ones starting out on that road and the ones way down it that are continually babied by our fucked up court system.

You could well be right, especially regarding the drink driving.

While you're on here........can you please, I mean PLEEEEAAASE change your avatar?! For an ol' fulla I get an embrrassing amount of wood when I see those lovely things...then lust sets in.....soon followed by reality....then depression. It's just a nasty cycle I tell ya.

[98tls]

You could well be right, especially regarding the drink driving.

While you're on here........can you please, I mean PLEEEEAAASE change your avatar?! For an ol' fulla I get an embrrassing amount of wood when I see those lovely things...then lust sets in.....soon followed by reality....then depression. It's just a nasty cycle I tell ya.

The thing with PD/Community work etc is that it becomes a gathering of likeminded fuck heads come Saturday morning,ok they waste a Saturday but hey at least they garnish some "im a bad boy" stigma out of it.To many of these wannabies a trip to the big house would be better than the smack in the face they should have got from there old man back whenever,Scare the shit out of someone = i wont do that again/i dont want to be a wannabie= in many (not all) cases problem solved lets get on with life.As for the avatar mate,will set about changing it for ya regardless of the fact that ive been having bread and dripping sammies since buying em

[scumdog]

As for the avatar mate,will set about changing it for ya regardless of the fact that ive been having bread and dripping sammies since buying em

And fending off a most displeased doris....

ya comin south and teaming up with me for a ride to the woodstock??

[98tls]

And fending off a most displeased doris....

ya comin south and teaming up with me for a ride to the woodstock??

Mate i would love to,really enjoyed the last time we were over that way,jesus that was a while ago eh.Remember waking up in the morning in Haast? after forgetting to pull the mesh covered window shutand being a mosquitos smorgasboard.With the extra weeks holiday enforced on us over xmas ive run out and will have to go over Saturday.

[scumdog]

Mate i would love to,really enjoyed the last time we were over that way,jesus that was a while ago eh.Remember waking up in the morning in Haast? after forgetting to pull the mesh covered window shutand being a mosquitos smorgasboard.With the extra weeks holiday enforced on us over xmas ive run out and will have to go over Saturday.

Well, so we're heading there via Haast?

Great, that last time was a doozy, them non-attenders don't know what they're mising, 'specially them Norf-Islanders..

Tell yer doris I'll look after you and all will be sweet!!

\hwq

[98tls]

Well, so we're heading there via Haast?

Great, that last time was a doozy, them non-attenders don't know what they're mising, 'specially them Norf-Islanders..

Tell yer doris I'll look after you and all will be sweet!!

\hwq

Mate that would mean i would have to on Saturday morning ride down to the Riveria then we set off.

[Pascal]

Some here obviously think the policy is "just so" but it can't be as our trauma rate is way high.

...

I don't think I'm emotive about it at all, just trying to see ways for improvement.

There were 137 deaths and serious injuries over the course of 8279 pursuits. The one deals with people, the other with incidents. So, let's take the bare minimum and say there are two people involved in the pursuit. The one driving the fleeing car. And the one pursuing.

Now you and I both know there are more people involved. Passengers. Innocent bystanders. But let's stick with the minimum.

So of the 16558 people involved in pursuits over 5 years, 137 were killed or injured. That is ...

0.82%

Now to be honest, I couldn't care two tosses about the idiots that flee. In my mind they are already criminals and any harm they inflict ON THEMSELVES is their own fault. So let's take them out of the equation.

Of the 16558 people involved in pursuits over 5 years, 22 who were not fleeing from police were killed or injured. And that is ...

0.13%

Really? Is our trauma rate really really really really really too high?

[MSTRS:Me]

Get a new calculator.
0.0827% and 0.0133% respectively...

[candor]

Trying hard. If you consider the road toll based on vehicle kms it is miniscule too.
The info that counts is comparative, by which policies can be assessed.

3 comparisons of interest; pursuit toll each of 7 years pre and post 2003, HIGH SPEED pursuit toll relative to other comparable jurisdictions for mobility etc (hard to find truly comparable ones as few OECDs have such bad foundations for a road safety program), deaths/crashes by HIGH SPEED impaired driver per vkm under non pursuit versus under pursuit circumstances. Same for youth may be a fourth one worth a look in.
Remove all crashes where speeds not extreme - reckless for conditions.

I don't see our Govt funding this study or much else aimed at toll trimming, it's priority is now set ambitiously on the goal of equaling best countries road toll stats
by 2010... extended out to 2030. Those voted in now; many won't be alive to be held to account for strategic decisions then.

[mashman]

The brigade of PC sacked a teacher (UK) for taking pupils sledding fucksake, it ain't like kids don't go sledging without supervision when they're outta school...

[Pascal]

Get a new calculator.
0.0827% and 0.0133% respectively...

Okay, so I needed coffee and nicotine before getting out of bed this morning it seems. Which just makes this whole campaign even more ridiculous.

What are they trying to achieve with it when the current policy already results in almost fuck all harm?

Do these people not have real jobs or a useful contribution to make to society?

[Pascal]

Trying hard. If you consider the road toll based on vehicle kms it is miniscule too.
The info that counts is comparative, by which policies can be assessed.

3 comparisons of interest; pursuit toll each of 7 years pre and post 2003, HIGH SPEED pursuit toll relative to other comparable jurisdictions for mobility etc (hard to find truly comparable ones as few OECDs have such bad foundations for a road safety program), deaths/crashes by HIGH SPEED impaired driver per vkm under non pursuit versus under pursuit circumstances. Same for youth may be a fourth one worth a look in.
Remove all crashes where speeds not extreme - reckless for conditions.

I don't see our Govt funding this study or much else aimed at toll trimming, it's priority is now set ambitiously on the goal of equaling best countries road toll stats
by 2010... extended out to 2030. Those voted in now; many won't be alive to be held to account for strategic decisions then.

Okay. Now that you've finished crapping out a dictionary of needless verbiage mixed in with some pointless, random dropping of points, how about you answer one simple question.

Why do you think a 0.0827% is a "way too high trauma rate"?

PS: Did anybody understand what Candor's post was about? Or am I the only one seeming to struggle with the:

Me: "Hi, good morning Candor!"
Candor: "Orange blossom farts!"

mental-tourette style responses?

[oneofsix]

Why do you think a 0.0827% is a "way too high trauma rate"?

Cause I don't think of it as statistics but as people and families (including the cops), yeah the runners are dickheads but who hasn't been at some stage? The numbers aren't counting the traumatised relies and friends. The runners shouldn't be countered out just cause they aren't "innocent", there isn't a death penalty for failure to stop. What interests me is why are the idoits running? where did the change in attitude come from? Was it when the police decided ticketing people attending a car show in Chch was a good way to make friends and influence people? (seems to be when things with the "boy racers" down there went sour.