Architects, designers, builders, here?

[Colapop]

Just confirming colapop, you just want the ESD principles, not really wanting to get house officially rated?

Agreed - ESD principles - not the whole star rating deal. I want to apply some simple things to a straight forward functional design without having to recycle my own shit or weave my mrs shaven pubic hairs into insulation. I'm keen on the idea of a passive heat sink and the directed flow of heated air within a design.
I'll be PM on the job as well as Main Contractor. The house will eventually become a second house on the property and likely rented out so I'm considering fairly hardy materials (plywood interior lining) and not high end fittings. But we'll be living in it for a bit so I don't want it to be too crappy!

[Brett]

Agreed - ESD principles - not the whole star rating deal. I want to apply some simple things to a straight forward functional design without having to recycle my own shit or weave my mrs shaven pubic hairs into insulation. I'm keen on the idea of a passive heat sink and the directed flow of heated air within a design.
I'll be PM on the job as well as Main Contractor. The house will eventually become a second house on the property and likely rented out so I'm considering fairly hardy materials (plywood interior lining) and not high end fittings. But we'll be living in it for a bit so I don't want it to be too crappy!

In terms of a durable interior lining, plywood is a good option, but to be able to get a nice finish you need to use high grade stuff with a nice surface finish which is not even close to cheap when compared to plasterboard. A good alternative is Elephant board (they do a multiboard which is more dense than standard boards like British Plasterboard or std GIB and is very cost effective. Also usually has a better/finer paper lining so the paint finish is better). Another option would be tongue and groove timber that you slot together. Can look really smart when painted, especially if the rest of the house is kind of sparse, and is very durable. Have you considered building the whole thing out of masonry blocks with a smooth plaster finish to the inside walls?

Sounds like you are after something practical and simple but sensible in its design for energy maximisation and limiting heat loss. I think that you budgeted figures will be plenty to achieve this.

[SPman]

Bejeezuz but NZ housing costs are high, if the figures you guys are throwing around are realistic......

best thing is to come up with a concept design, get it to a point where you can get cost estimates and then adjust from there as necessary.

Wot he said - spend some time getting the design right for the site -a little sensible design goes a long way.

[Swoop]

a little sensible design...

If you are referring to architects, that is a fine oxymoron.


A good friend is an architect and even he says "the only thing to stay inside an architect's head for longer than an hour is a cold"!

[Colapop]

Architects come up with weird ideas, engineers overcomplicate the design so you can't build it and planners make sure you don't know where to build it.

Chippies just ask you what you want and build it without the bullshit.

[SPman]

Chippies just ask you what you want and build it without the bullshit.

Chippies just ask you want you want, then build their version of what you might want if you were them!......

[Winston001]

I feel sort of excited on your behalf Cola. I looked into environmental house design 15 years ago in my obsessive/compulsive way. Sadly my wishes were ahead of the times but I learned a lot.

For example, calculated the sun's peak in Central Otago, which is 30 minutes later in the day than official midday, then orientated the house as close to that as I could - 10 degrees off true North.

Thermal mass was a wish but not achieved. The compromise was over-spec insulation and full double-glazing.

The Ministry of Energy published a free booklet on efficient design but that was more than a decade ago.

[Winston001]

Just to add that the public library had plenty of good books on solar design when I was looking. The so-called "green" ideas are not new or even difficult but for some reason we have forgotten them. Hopi Indians were building thermal mass and passive ventilation 3000 years ago.

My (laymans) opinion is to heavily insulate (for both warming and cooling) and work up from there. Internal noise insulation can be important too. Clerestory windows put light deep into the house, and also help with ventilation.

Simple is best. The biggest hurdle you face is that NZ is earthquake prone, experiences strong weather systems, and gets a fair amount of rain. Oh - and we tend to build on swamps or slippery clay hillsides. All of which puts our building standards among the highest in the world. Which you are now going to be paying for... Best of luck.

[BMWST?]

I think that if you are going to manage it yourself, your budget is achievable. Just be willing to look for deals, such as end of run carpets etc. We got some Villeroy& Boch hand basins for the bathroom that usually retail/trade at $1500 each or so (just for the ceramic basin) for $299 each because they were brought in as samples to show Mico staff, were all still in boxes, never opened.

On the timber beams thing, there is a limit to the extent to which timber can span, but on a house of 220m2 I doubt your spans are going to be anything huge, but the prenail boys will be able to help you on this. Size up what you need and give them a call, they will tell you whether it is doable or not. Every glulam or ganglam beam is a "specifically engineered" items.
Steel framing as opposed to prenail timber is awesome. It is however a lot less flexible in terms of changes post manufacture, but that isn't to say it can't be changed. Just a bit more of a pain in the arse, thats all. I build our houses with timber framing, but that is more a familiarity thing really, I would be more than happy to build something out of steel as well.

dont ring the boys at prenail if you gonna use steel framing....we very rarely see steel beams in houses now.Even 4.8 garage door lintels can be Timber now unless they have more than normal roof loads on them.You will still see steel beams if you have large open spaces on the lower level of a two storey house.Its getting to the point where you can have floor spans which push NZS3604 to limit without using steel

[skinman]

also there is a program called DesignIt put out by CarterHolt for HySpans & Hyjoist. Try & stay within 3604 if possible as glulams are more expensive than standard timber. For instance you wouldnt want all your floor joists to be Hyjoists. 240x45 MSG8 is cheaper so when designing consider upper to lower floor alignment to keep spans down.
Be aware a new 3604 has just been released. Using it is optional at the moment but that will change, just not sure when yet.
The internet is your friend. Look at lots of plans & visit showhomes looking for ideas. Take photos of houses you like also if you see any when driving around.

[BMWST?]

also there is a program called DesignIt put out by CarterHolt for HySpans & Hyjoist. Try & stay within 3604 if possible as glulams are more expensive than standard timber. For instance you wouldnt want all your floor joists to be Hyjoists. 240x45 MSG8 is cheaper so when designing consider upper to lower floor alignment to keep spans down.
Be aware a new 3604 has just been released. Using it is optional at the moment but that will change, just not sure when yet.
The internet is your friend. Look at lots of plans & visit showhomes looking for ideas. Take photos of houses you like also if you see any when driving around.

hyjoist are actually very economical way to get good floor spans and quality.The new 3604 is out and timber spans have decreased again I think.we use gluelams etc because a lot of "normal stuff cant be done with "normal msg8"(eg timber lintels,rafters joists etc)

[ellipsis]

...after the events that have transpired since sept last year, and the subsequent testing of the different 'systems', under conditions of extreme duress, an overall picture should emerge of whos' fucking who, and whos' not paying...a lot of expensive, designed homes didn't make the grade, along with the older brick stuff...if you want a house that complies, has everything you envisage and ticks all your boxes, you had better have a big pocketfull of cash....as an aside...the real designs that have stood the tests of time are hard to outdo...

[Swoop]

Clerestory windows put light deep into the house, and also help with ventilation.

Clerestory are not the best with thermal qualities though (unless double / triple glazed <--location dependant).

[Spearfish]

tilt slab structure including roof
double glazed windows
straw bale interior, plastered
underfloor heating
stream for a small hydro (big enough to run a decent man cave)
grow your veg and sell the surplus for your grains
cow, goat, pig, for milk, meat etc
change the bike and car to diesel or electric if your not doing high miles
home brew diesel

then
Plan a bike trip around the word on a bike of your choice with your savings...

[Winston001]

...the real designs that have stood the tests of time are hard to outdo...

Agreed. We've been building dwellings for 6000 years designed for the local climate and land. Many houses last for hundreds of years which begs the question - why do ours fall to pieces??

Clerestory are not the best with thermal qualities though (unless double / triple glazed <--location dependant).

Yes but full double glazing is assumed and (I thought) required these days anyway.