Police killing us again!

[Parlane]

Compare this one to the Buller Gorge incident.
Similar, in that a cop did a turn across a road, in a place that did not allow plenty of room for an 'innocent' motorcyclist to see him and avoid.
No-one died in that one, but the cop certainly got (rightly) hammered in the court.
That should have set an operational precedent to control where such manoeuvres were kosher.
Joe Public would be pilloried in the same situation. The cops are no different.

The big problem with me, is that this has happened before.

How many times does this same mistake have to be made before they make it clear to the police to be setting good examples for turn and chase maneuvers ?

Should the police internal guidelines not say "Only turn to chase at a safe point where a U-turn (not a 3 point turn) can be made and ___m of visibility in both directions." ?

And if they do.. then there is definitely something wrong, if they don't.. then it needs to be made clear. If this happens AGAIN.. then there will be no doubt that something has gone wrong in the system, then we either blame the police training or the police officer who made a personal decision to ignore previously learnt mistakes.

[pritch]

and was travelling between 114 and 158 kph according to the news report I heard.

Interesting figures. That looks like an exercise in creating the impression of precision where it is conspicuous by its absence.

Why 114? Not 115, or even 120? Then 158, not 160?
After this obsessive accuracy we get a spread of 44kph which does not seem very precise at all?

[Parlane]

Interesting figures. That looks like an exercise in creating the impression of precision where it is conspicuous by its absence.

Why 114? Not 115, or even 120? Then 158, not 160?
After this obsessive accuracy we get a spread of 44kph which does not seem very precise at all?

Friction is not constant over the brake path of the vehicle. They probably use min/max values, and in more than one place.

[\m/]

The pig only got a $250 fine. It's fucking insulting.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times...-officer-fined

[HenryDorsetCase]

Interesting figures. That looks like an exercise in creating the impression of precision where it is conspicuous by its absence.

Why 114? Not 115, or even 120? Then 158, not 160?
After this obsessive accuracy we get a spread of 44kph which does not seem very precise at all?

I agree. I was listening to radio news, and the pleece SCU figures were (IIRC) between 114 and 142. the private (ex pleece SCU guy) one engaged by the defence came up with the 158kph figure.

In another context, I have had to read an SCU technical analysis report. They are accredited expert witnesses, there is fairly robust science around these things but always a range of variables which inevitably effect the results. They start with what they know: body landed here, bike landed here, impact point here, skidmarks this long, road conditions X, Y, Z, and work backward to a "well, to achieve this result, depending on these variables [and that of course is the devil in the detail] then we estimate that this is what happened".

no one has summed it up better than Katman has in a sentence though.

[HenryDorsetCase]

The big problem with me, is that this has happened before.

How many times does this same mistake have to be made before they make it clear to the police to be setting good examples for turn and chase maneuvers ?

Should the police internal guidelines not say "Only turn to chase at a safe point where a U-turn (not a 3 point turn) can be made and ___m of visibility in both directions." ?

And if they do.. then there is definitely something wrong, if they don't.. then it needs to be made clear. If this happens AGAIN.. then there will be no doubt that something has gone wrong in the system, then we either blame the police training or the police officer who made a personal decision to ignore previously learnt mistakes.

I reckon that all cops should do handbrake turns. Not only would it get them spun round quicker, it would be a massive positive for recruitment. "Join the po po, get to drive like you're in Dukes of Hazzard, plus Daisy Duke will give you a blowjob"

[Parlane]

I reckon that all cops should do handbrake turns. Not only would it get them spun round quicker, it would be a massive positive for recruitment. "Join the po po, get to drive like you're in Dukes of Hazzard, plus Daisy Duke will give you a blowjob"

That's not even a bad idea lol. If all cops had that skill of driving, we would have way more awesome respect for them :P

The problem in this case was that the car took up the whole road basically. Had he just been stopped on the motorbike side of the road, the bike would have had more chance. I am just basing this on the fact that the bike hit the back of the car.

[Katman]

The big problem with me, is that this has happened before.

How many times does this same mistake have to be made before .........

Those exact same words could be used in a number of different scenarios.

[jellywrestler]

The law (and common sense) state that one should be able to stop in the distance of road visible. Thus whether the rider was "speeding" or not isn't really the issue. The issue for them was out-riding their stopping distance.

The reason for this law is the unpredictability of the road.
----

the only reason for this law is they can still charge you with something when all other possibilties are exhausted

[Parlane]

Those exact same words could be used in a number of different scenarios.

Everyone has a personal responsibility to learn from their mistakes, but when you are a police force. You have a public responsibility to learn from them together. As in, one cop makes a mistake of doing a U-turn where it probably should not have been done. then the police force it self needs to look in to regulating it's rules to stop that same mistake being made again.

[Kornholio]

The pig only got a $250 fine. It's fucking insulting.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times...-officer-fined

It's a fucking insult...
RIP Paul mate

[scracha]

The pig only got a $250 fine. It's fucking insulting.
http://www.stuff.co.nz/waikato-times...-officer-fined

Originally the Waikato Times reported "tests showed.......could have been..between 114km/h and 142km/h

Now they're reported between 141 and 158?


Defence Councillor "At worst it was careless" - nope... At worst it was manslaugter, at best it was careless.

I believed it when some here said he would not ever be charged or if he was he'd get off...shoot, wou'ld a thunk KBers would get it wrong

Wasn't advocating hanging him from a tree but $250.....that's just insulting.

[MSTRS:Me]

There were questions around the speed of those Buller riders too. Has nothing to do with stupid manoeuvres in stupid places.
I'm disgusted that the court has set such a low value on this incident.

[Parlane]

There were questions around the speed of those Buller riders too. Has nothing to do with stupid manoeuvres in stupid places.
I'm disgusted that the court has set such a low value on this incident.

$250 is 62.5% of the fine I would get for riding my bike without a learners plate..

[jellywrestler]

move described by the judge as 'Careless'
fuck it, the driver was a trained proffesional it's negligence at the very least and an insult to us all, so being a work related accident i wonder how OSH would have veiwed his contribution to a death???