Ducati making progress?

[Crasherfromwayback]

I used to idolise Valentino. His skill has been unmatched in recent memory (well.. not TOO recent..), and his career has definitely been a pleasure to witness it unfold.

But the last two years have also shown the egomanic side of his personality that is no doubt a by-product of being on top for so long, and having everything stacked in your favour to boot. Having that ripped out from underneath him, especially when they proclaimed to have all of the answers before throwing a leg over the bike must be truly humbling.

He has put both Lorenzo and Stoner through a lot over the last few years, and they are now paying him back in spades.

I'd always been a fan of Rossi...but very quickly became less of one once he started throwing his weight around and demanding things. Michelin had always supplied him superior tyres to everyone else. One off made the night before kind of stuff. But as soon as Bridgestone started to gain the upper hand, Rossi very quickly lost all brand loyalty and demanded Bridgstones half way through the season. Lorenzo did not get the same treatment. Rossi has often chosen his team mate. Obviously he'd like one he can always beat. When Yamaha signed Lorenzo, Rossi was for the first time, seriously threatened by his younger/newer team mate. He spat the dummy and demanded Yamaha choose between them. Yamaha made the right choice.

Rossi was born into GP racing, and had all of the doors opened for him. For his seven titles in the premier class he's beaten...(2nd-3rd & 4th place shown)

2001: Biaggi-Capirossi-Barros

2002: Biaggi-Ukawa-Barros

2003: Gibernau-Biaggi-Capirossi

2004: Gibernau-Biaggi-Barros

2005: Melandri-Hayned-Edwards

2006: Nicky Hayden won the title. (Rossi-Capirossi-Melandri)

2007: Casey Stoner won the title. (Pedrosa-Rossi-Hopkins) Stoners team mate Capirossi, was 7th.

2008: Stoner-Pedrosa-Lorenzo

2009: Lorenzo(the writing was on the wall)-Pedrosa-Stoner

2010: Lorenzo won the title

2011: Stoner won the title

To me...his two titles from 2008/2009, are really the only ones that are worth fuck all. Be honest. From 2001 through to 2005 he beat up on guys who were never actually worthy of being premier class champs. After the arrival of Stoner and Lorenzo...he's won two and lost three championships. And you wanna say that Stoner has the best bike now? Well Rossi has had the best bike most of the time. The Yamaha certainly was in 08/09. The Honda was certainly the bike to have in 2001-2002-2003. Rossi has started in 197 Gp's so far, and won 79 of them for a win ratio of 40.1%. Stoner has started in 99 Gp's, with 32 wins for a ratio of 32.3 %. As the Gp's tick over...only serious injury/retirement will stop Stoner beating that race/win ratio.

Then...you Rossi bumlickers can shut the fuck up.

PS; How many Ducati's do you think Rossi is selling for them?

We normally sing off a similar song sheet but, the aliens will widen the gap. Stoner will disappear way into the distance . That's my pick

Stoner has the best throttle control off all. he is the best at riding the fine balance between the electronics, power & tyres.

Stoner is a mega multiple time dirt track and long track champ. The more HP and the less grip the better. If they banned the electronics...Stoner would be gone. All of his previous team mates have marvelled at his throttle control.

[roogazza]

This guy seems to have it pretty well summed up.

http://www.motomatters.com/analysis/...#comment-26616

[DidJit]

So does this guy. 6th paragraph.

[slowpoke]

I kinda agree about some of Rossi's opposition Pete, but that's a big call not rating Max Biaggi. 4 x World GP250 titles on the trot, for 2 different manufacturers makes him a legend, even if he's not a very popular legend. Even as a GP500 rookie he was good enough to seriously challenge a half decent rider by the name of Doohan. And based on your logic regarding the quality of opposition we shouldn't read too much into Doohan's gazillion titles because there wasn' much opposition in 95/96/97/98? Nah, credit where credit is due, you can only beat the guys who rock up, none of them are mugs, and only look a bit ordinary because one of them is extra-ordinary.

The tyre thing is a lot more complicated than you make out, with the introduction of tyre restrictions obviously favouring the way Bridgestone operated and produced their tyres. Capirossi and Bayliss (in that one off ride) showed how good the Ducati/Bridgestone package was and that's what Stoner inherited. Can you imagine say Checa stepping in for a one off ride and winning on the Ducati MotoGP bike now? Not a fuckin' hope in hell, and that's what Rossi has inherited. Yep, Stoner could win on it but he also had 5 DNF's in trying to do so in 2010 and Rossi (3) finished in front of Stoner (4) despite missing 4 races with that busted leg.

For all Stoner's brilliance on track he's been equally brilliant off it in timing/picking his rides. I'm not saying he doesn't seserve his titles, he does, but the stars have also aligned whether by chance or design.

[denill]

Whilst I can be called a Stoner fan - I am NOT a Rossi hater and I feel cheated that the Rossi/Burgess & co team have not provided us with a competitive Ducati in 2011. I thought that they would and would have bet big money that they would. They haven't and MotoGP has lost out badly. In fact the accountants could now say no to Ducati's MotoGP involvement in the future.

[slowpoke]

Whilst I can be called a Stoner fan - I am NOT a Rossi hater and I feel cheated that the Rossi/Burgess & co team have not provided us with a competitive Ducati in 2011. I thought that they would and would have bet big money that they would. They haven't and MotoGP has lost out badly. In fact the accountants could now say no to Ducati's MotoGP involvement in the future.

Eggzactly! I don't wanna see Stoner have a season like last year anymore than I want to see Pedrosa/Lorenzo ruled out with injury or Rossi on an uncompetitive bike. I doubt it will happen but it'd be a barn burner of a season if they all stayed healthy and closed some of the gaps between the machines, any one of them is a worthy World Champion.

[rachprice]

any one of them is a worthy World Champion.

Amen to that

[Crasherfromwayback]

Amen to that

Amen times ten. The last place finisher in Moto GP is a racing God.

[denill]

Amen times ten. The last place finisher in Moto GP is a racing God.

That has been reinforced to me by seeing how a rider like Katsuyuki Nakasuga, a Yamaha test rider of no mean ability can be so off the pace.

When you see the MotoGP bikes squirming around - it is a fact that they are ALL out of this world.

[cowpoos]

Amen times ten. The last place finisher in Moto GP is a racing God.

Are you talking about Rossi...lol

[Mental Trousers]

Amen times ten. The last place finisher in Moto GP is a racing God.

The last placed regular in Moto GP is a current World Champion

EDIT actually he's not lowest placed of the regulars ...... but you know what I mean!!!

[Crasherfromwayback]

The last placed regular in Moto GP is a current World Champion

EDIT actually he's not lowest placed of the regulars ...... but you know what I mean!!!

I dig!!!!!

[Bender]

Like it or not (and I don't) Stoner is a notch above Rossi, Pedrosa and Lorenzo. If they were on identical bikes he would slowly pull away from them and win all the time.

[tigertim20]

Like it or not (and I don't) Stoner is a notch above Rossi, Pedrosa and Lorenzo. If they were on identical bikes he would slowly pull away from them and win all the time.

If they were on equal bikes, they could potentially get close enough to pressure him, as it is, he gets a good start, and thats it, he's in space for the entire race, no pressure, no threats, nothing, just all alone without someone riding aggressively and attacking him forcing/tricking him into errors that can be capitolised on.

[Crasherfromwayback]

If they were on equal bikes, they could potentially get close enough to pressure him, as it is, he gets a good start, and thats it, he's in space for the entire race, no pressure, no threats, nothing, just all alone without someone riding aggressively and attacking him forcing/tricking him into errors that can be capitolised on.

You mean like at Laguna Seca this year?