Dogs that attack - Is it the dog or the owner?

[BoristheBiter]

Ok, i'm being pedantic, I was meaning specifically bred. Any dog can be made vicious, sadly it's the ones that can do the most damage & are hardest to stop which are being encouraged. 100's of years of breeding down the toilet to make someone feel tough.

Then I would say the German Shepard, there is a reason they use them for police work.
But still even then not all make the grade as they aren't aggressive.

[george formby]

My best mate is a old English black and tan terrier also called a Welsh terrier. They have been around since history began and is the root breed for all terriers. Ted is registered in the UK as a historic UK dog breed.

He is only 12 kg but is a tough, confident, unfashionable happy medium sized dog. He is the best rabbit hunting dog I have ever seen. We went for a walk the other day, I shot 12 and he caught 8. He has never started a dog fight but he has finished a few of them, he is fast, tough and has no reverse gear.

The downside with him is he has no recall, he doesent go far from me (about 100m) but won't come back when called. If he sees something to chase he is off and he won’t take his eye off it. He is smart, understands about 30-40 words. He needs at least two walks a day, he also seems to have a good memory. If it is in his mouth it is his.

I have never had a staffy or red nose but if you took one of my dogs and bread them for aggression you would end up with a very dangerous animal.

Staffies & then APBT"s regardless of nose colour, more or less the same dog, should have the same characteristics as your Welsh Terrier, brains, tenacity, high prey drive, stamina, strength & a taste for badgers. As you say breeding them away from their working history to be aggressive mutts is insanity.

[Trade_nancy]

Challenge: take any 10 people off the street at random and make them walk past 2 dogs in turn,...1st a labrador and 2nd a APBT with any nose colour you like. I'd bet my $10 to say - at least 50% of the people would shy away from the APBT and none from the labrador. EVEN if the dog was owned, trained and being held on a steel cable lead by the local parish priest, people would not have a good feeling passing inside the snapping zone of an APBT.

These breeds such as APBT - are dangerous breeds that can be cleverly and carefully managed so as to become socially calm...for now.
Breeds such as labradors are docile breeds that HAVE to be mismanaged and/or abused to make them into socially maladjusted biters.
All that is required to change a calm APBT into a biter is a surprise...something that spooks it. Say a child suddenly appearing in it's face with a large toy...or ME,...running past it.

[george formby]

Challenge: take any 10 people off the street at random and make them walk past 2 dogs in turn,...1st a labrador and 2nd a APBT with any nose colour you like. I'd bet my $10 to say - at least 50% of the people would shy away from the APBT and none from the labrador. EVEN if the dog was owned, trained and being held on a steel cable lead by the local parish priest, people would not have a good feeling passing inside the snapping zone of an APBT.

These breeds such as APBT - are dangerous breeds that can be cleverly and carefully managed so as to become socially calm...for now.
Breeds such as labradors are docile breeds that HAVE to be mismanaged and/or abused to make them into socially maladjusted biters.
All that is required to change a calm APBT into a biter is a surprise...something that spooks it. Say a child suddenly appearing in it's face with a large toy...or ME,...running past it.

Your right that people will shy away from an APBT. Good, does them & the dog a favour. I pity the poor person which gets nipped when they take the Lab by surprise & it reacts the same way any dog would, Bull Terrier or not.
American medical statistics & the UK too, I believe, show that more people are "bitten" by labradors than any other breed. Thing is, they do not do a lot of damage & are far rarely reported to the police so do not make headlines. Often happens in the home too.
All in all, do not approach strange dogs without the owners permission & supervision. If you do want to run past a dog, any dog, keep your distance, dogs, all of them are designed to chase.

[Trade_nancy]

Your right that people will shy away from an APBT. Good, does them & the dog a favour. I pity the poor person which gets nipped when they take the Lab by surprise & it reacts the same way any dog would, Bull Terrier or not.
American medical statistics & the UK too, I believe, show that more people are "bitten" by labradors than any other breed. Thing is, they do not do a lot of damage & are far rarely reported to the police so do not make headlines. Often happens in the home too.
All in all, do not approach strange dogs without the owners permission & supervision. If you do want to run past a dog, any dog, keep your distance, dogs, all of them are designed to chase.

Most excellent points George. Especially not to go near a dog on a lead when running....but after maybe a thousand or more - I've been bitten twice on the run...well me once and my running mate the other time....he was bitten by APBT and me by a Rotty cross. Never had a labrador do more than smile.
Labs, retrievers, poodles in fact - cats, all bite. The difference and the important one amongst others is: APBT and similar go on an a sustained attack...not a nip or snap and run.

[george formby]

Most excellent points George. Especially not to go near a dog on a lead when running....but after maybe a thousand or more - I've been bitten twice on the run...well me once and my running mate the other time....he was bitten by APBT and me by a Rotty cross. Never had a labrador do more than smile.
Labs, retrievers, poodles in fact - cats, all bite. The difference and the important one amongst others is: APBT and similar go on an a sustained attack...not a nip or snap and run.

Sadly I cannot argue with that, a snap from a Bull Terrier can do a lot of damage, they are bred to hold come hell or high water. Most Terriers are incredibly tenacious once they get started too.
My job as an owner is to make sure nothing starts. If anything happens it is my fault not the dogs.

I have made a point from day one not to let my dog jump up, mouth anybody in play, she has to sit & stay when I answer the door & "flounders" around kids until they have been introduced & told how to behave around a dog. Flounder is whole body & head flat on the ground like a road kill frog. She is never left with strangers or kids unsupervised. Poor thing is also the softest, most affectionate dog I have ever come across. Still, she is what she is & I can't read her mind.

[Grubber]

I guess we will disagree on that. There is a lot that wouldn't even get close to the intelligence of a dog.

In some cases i would actually agree with you on that one too!

[Grubber]

Challenge: take any 10 people off the street at random and make them walk past 2 dogs in turn,...1st a labrador and 2nd a APBT with any nose colour you like. I'd bet my $10 to say - at least 50% of the people would shy away from the APBT and none from the labrador. EVEN if the dog was owned, trained and being held on a steel cable lead by the local parish priest, people would not have a good feeling passing inside the snapping zone of an APBT.

These breeds such as APBT - are dangerous breeds that can be cleverly and carefully managed so as to become socially calm...for now.
Breeds such as labradors are docile breeds that HAVE to be mismanaged and/or abused to make them into socially maladjusted biters.
All that is required to change a calm APBT into a biter is a surprise...something that spooks it. Say a child suddenly appearing in it's face with a large toy...or ME,...running past it.

Couldn't have said it better myself! Thanks for that.

[dangerous]

Staffies & then APBT"s regardless of nose colour, more or less the same dog,

NO farking way man... staffies do NOT have the agression that pit bulls do, they are the best baby sitters you can get, i would not trust a pb they are a mix of breeds un like the Staff which goes back 100's of years.

It piss's me off no end that the media report that it was a staffie and it was a mungel PB, I have a golden staff rear in colour and every time at the dog park she gets called 'one of those dogs' odley brindels or blacks dont get the same reaction.
The Staff will sit and guard, sure if a cat pops into view shes gone. the Dobie will sit further away he dosent baby sit well but is very alert to the suroundings and guards very well.

[BoristheBiter]

Couldn't have said it better myself! Thanks for that.

Now try that with people and i bet you get the same result.
It is based on biased tendency's and media hype more than real facts.

[Flip]

NO farking way man... staffies do NOT have the agression that pit bulls do, they are the best baby sitters you can get, i would not trust a pb they are a mix of breeds un like the Staff which goes back 100's of years.

It piss's me off no end that the media report that it was a staffie and it was a mungel PB, I have a golden staff rear in colour and every time at the dog park she gets called 'one of those dogs' odley brindels or blacks dont get the same reaction.
The Staff will sit and guard, sure if a cat pops into view shes gone. the Dobie will sit further away he dosent baby sit well.

The Dobie knows his place, whats the kid doing on the staffys blanket?

[george formby]

NO farking way man... staffies do NOT have the agression that pit bulls do, they are the best baby sitters you can get, i would not trust a pb they are a mix of breeds un like the Staff which goes back 100's of years.

It piss's me off no end that the media report that it was a staffie and it was a mungel PB, I have a golden staff rear in colour and every time at the dog park she gets called 'one of those dogs' odley brindels or blacks dont get the same reaction.
The Staff will sit and guard, sure if a cat pops into view shes gone. the Dobie will sit further away he dosent baby sit well.

I beg to differ. I have owned Staffies for years prior to moving out here & my current mutt is a staffie in all ways except size. The Staffie was the starting point for APBT's which were bred to be more suitable for working in America rather than Bolton. They are Terriers, well, a properly bred one is. Staffies have been bastardised for the show ring & APBT's ruined for the tiny dick brigade.
Lovely dogs, full of character & drive.

[dangerous]

I beg to differ. I have owned Staffies for years prior to moving out here & my current mutt is a staffie in all ways except size. The Staffie was the starting point for APBT's which were bred to be more suitable for working in America rather than Bolton. They are Terriers, well, a properly bred one is. Staffies have been bastardised for the show ring & APBT's ruined for the tiny dick brigade.
Lovely dogs, full of character & drive.

we are kinda on the same team here, yeah the Staffie specs have changed over the years and the yank version differs ie leg length etc, yeah the Staffie was is a fighting dog, they are very much a one track minded mutt and once they set there mind on something its history, but unlike the bastardised PB there nature is ralativly unchanged and thats quite a gental nature in general the pities I have found triger into death mode some what faster and have no concers with a person, a stafie has more brains and usually only takes on things its own size.

[george formby]

we are kinda on the same team here, yeah the Staffie specs have changed over the years and the yank version differs ie leg length etc, yeah the Staffie was is a fighting dog, they are very much a one track minded mutt and once they set there mind on something its history, but unlike the bastardised PB there nature is ralativly unchanged and thats quite a gental nature in general the pities I have found triger into death mode some what faster and have no concers with a person, a stafie has more brains and usually only takes on things its own size.

I like the usually, we rescued a pit bred Staffie in the UK years ago, what a challenge he was but came right in the end. He was totally & irrevocably DA, the bigger the dog the harder he went. Had my heart in my mouth a few times until we figured out how to keep him out of trouble. Took a year or two but he turned into a stunning, balanced pet.

[chiefofthehill]

The Dobie knows his place, whats the kid doing on the staffys blanket?

That 'kid' is me alltho I am a bit older now. The blanket may well be the dogs but the rattle was mine.
The Doberman never really ceared much for me or my brother but Ms Staffie always sat right near me and oddly tended to my every need like she was mum, maybe it was because she was a bitch (I mean that in the nicest way)