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Thread: I believe in gay marriage

  1. #661
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    Quote Originally Posted by FJRider View Post
    So ... if it has nothing to do with "Rights" ... then it is only legislation or law that is the issue. As such ... are drafted by the opinions and views of society.
    Actually ... drafted by the representitives of that society ... that have been voted by majority ... into Goverment.

    Gee don't get me started on the current Government as my tin foil hat is in the wash...
    Er we don't have a majority government we have a collection of self serving politicians.
    Being held together in a real unholy union based on power and greed.
    Just like the Asset sales has no mandate.
    Like the how many million was given to the Maori party for supply and confidence that was given direct to the party.
    Yes that was missed by most as well. Think it was about 150 million.



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  2. #662
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    Quote Originally Posted by husaberg View Post
    Gee don't get me started on the current Government as my tin foil hat is in the wash...
    Perhaps ... more people may want to vote in the next election then ... because the current goverment is calling the shots ...
    When life throws you a curve ... Lean into it ...

  3. #663
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    Wasn't there a time when 'civil union' itself had to be fought hard for?
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Your beliefs don't make you a better person, your behaviour does.

  4. #664
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    Yeah its Wiki

    Civil union has been legal in New Zealand since 26 April 2005. The Civil Union Act 2004 to establish the institution of civil union for same-sex and opposite-sex couples was passed by the Parliament on 9 December 2004.[1][2] The Act has been described as very similar to the Marriage Act 1955 with references to "marriage" replaced by "civil union". A companion bill, the Relationships (Statutory References) Act, was passed shortly thereafter on 15 March 2005, to remove discriminatory provisions on the basis of relationship status from a range of statutes and regulations. As a result of these bills, all couples in New Zealand, whether married, in a civil union, or in a de facto partnership, now generally enjoy the same rights and undertake the same obligations. These rights extend to immigration, next-of-kin status, social welfare, matrimonial property and other areas. Non-married couples are not however permitted to adopt children, although people in non-marital relationships can adopt as individuals.[3]



    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  5. #665
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tigadee View Post
    Wasn't there a time when 'civil union' itself had to be fought hard for?
    Yeah, well that was what I thought too and as they had their own (gay?) prime minister and (gay) Labour government calling the shots, that was it!

    I really thought Civil Union was the real deal for them and that they at last had everything that they wanted but no, now they want it to be called Marriage!

    They will get their way on this and like Madness said, the sky wont fall down for the rest of us but what will the next thing be and will it ever end!

    The pendulum will swing across and the heterosexual minority will be screaming about some injustice imposed by the homosexual majority!

    By then there will probably be another world war for us all to join together and fight some "common enemy" Probably in the Pacific too! ... Life I guess!

  6. #666
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldrider View Post
    Yeah, well that was what I thought too and as they had their own (gay?) prime minister and (gay) Labour government calling the shots, that was it!

    I really thought Civil Union was the real deal for them and that they at last had everything that they wanted but no, now they want it to be called Marriage!

    They will get their way on this and like Madness said, the sky wont fall down for the rest of us but what will the next thing be and will it ever end!

    The pendulum will swing across and the heterosexual minority will be screaming about some injustice imposed by the homosexual majority!

    By then there will probably be another world war for us all to join together and fight some "common enemy"! ... Life I guess!


  7. #667
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    Short circuit: is an "abnormal" connection! ... Nuff said really but I did think your post effort was funny though.

  8. #668
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    What would Hitler say?

  9. #669
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    Quote Originally Posted by SMOKEU View Post
    What would Hitler say?
    Gib es mir, großer Junge.
    Can I believe the magic of your size... (The Shirelles)

  10. #670
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    Quote Originally Posted by Virago View Post
    Gib es mir, großer Junge.
    Typically camp!

  11. #671
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldrider View Post
    Typically camp!
    Mein Kampf?
    Can I believe the magic of your size... (The Shirelles)

  12. #672
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    The sexuality of Adolf Hitler has long been a matter of historical and scholarly debate. Despite the Nazi Party's opposition to homosexuality and persecution of homosexuals, some historians have argued that Hitler himself was homosexual or bisexual. Some have argued that he was asexual, whereas others dismiss these claims and believe he was heterosexual. He is believed to have had six female lovers; two of these women went on to commit suicide, and a further two attempted it.





    Geli Raubal
    the daughter of Leo Raubal and Angela Raubal, was born in Linz on 4th June, 1908. When Adolf Hitler rented a house in Obersalzberg he asked his half-sister, Angela Raubal, now a widow, to be his housekeeper. She agreed and in August 1928 brought Geli with her to stay with Hitler.

    Hitler, who had now turned forty, became infatuated with Geli and rumours soon spread that he was having an affair with his young niece. Hitler became extremely possessive and Emil Maurice, his chauffeur, who also showed interest in Geli, was sacked.

    The couple lived together for over two years. The relationship with Geli was stormy and they began to accuse each other of being unfaithful. Geli was particularly concerned about Eva Braun, a seventeen-year-old girl who Hitler took for rides in his Mercedes car.

    Geli also complained about the way Hitler controlled her life. On September 8, 1931, Hitler left for Hamburg after having a blazing row with Geli over her desire to spend some time in Vienna. Hitler was heard to shout at Geli as he was about to get into his car: "For the last time, no!" After he left Geli shot herself through the heart with a revolver.

    When he heard the news Hitler threatened to take his own life but was talked out of it by senior members of the Nazi Party. One consequence of Geli's suicide was that Hitler became a vegetarian. He claimed that meat now reminded him of Geli's corpse.

    Rumours about Geli's death spread quickly amongst Hitler's enemies. It was said that Geli had been badly beaten up by Hitler before she shot herself. Another story involved Geli committing suicide because she was expecting Hitler's child. Some people claimed she was murdered by Heinrich Himmler because she was threatening to blackmail Hitler. Little evidence has been provided to support these suggestions and the reasons for her death remain a mystery.

    Homosexuality Hitler

    During his disavowal of Ernst Röhm, Hitler cited his 'immoral sexual behavior'. However, Röhm had long been a confidant and close friend to Hitler, and Hitler had never objected in the past to Röhm's homosexuality. (Röhm-Putsch).[2] Hitler also sent a great number of homosexuals to concentration camps during the Holocaust. Jonathan Zimmerman, a historian at New York University, points out that "Between 1933 and 1945, the Nazis arrested roughly 100,000 men as homosexuals. Most convicted gays were sent to prison; between 5,000 and 15,000 were interned in concentration camps, where they wore pink triangles to signify their supposed crime."[3] Gay men were singled out for cruel treatment in the concentration camps. Nazi doctors often used gay men for scientific experiments in an attempt to locate a biological basis for homosexuality, purportedly to "cure" any future Aryan children who were gay. A study by Rüdiger Lautmann found that 60% of gay men in concentration camps died, as compared to 41% of political prisoners and 35% of Jehovah's Witnesses. The study also shows that survival rates for gay men were slightly higher for internees from the middle and upper classes and for married bisexual men and those with children

    Eva Anna Paula Hitler (née Braun; 6 February 1912 – 30 April 1945)
    was the longtime companion of Adolf Hitler and, for less than 40 hours, his wife. Braun met Hitler in Munich when she was 17 years old, while she was working as an assistant and model for his personal photographer, and began seeing him often about two years later. She attempted suicide twice during their early relationship. By 1936, she was a part of his household at the Berghof near Berchtesgaden and lived a sheltered life throughout World War II. Braun was a photographer, and many of the surviving colour photographs and films of Hitler were taken by her. She was a key figure within Hitler's inner social circle, but did not attend public events with him until mid-1944, when her sister Gretl married Hermann Fegelein, the SS liaison officer on his staff.

    As the Third Reich collapsed towards the end of the war, Braun swore loyalty to Hitler and went to Berlin to be by his side in the heavily reinforced Führerbunker beneath the Reich Chancellery. As Red Army troops fought their way into the neighbourhood on 29 April 1945, she married Hitler during a brief civil ceremony; she was 33 and he was 56. Less than 40 hours later, they committed suicide together in a sitting room of the bunker, she by biting into a capsule of cyanide. The German public was unaware of Braun's relationship with Hitler until after her death.

    Either way Hitler was a prize prick.
    But he was someones child and no doubt they loved him dearly.......
    Also in fairness to the other minorites Hilter regime also oversaw the deaths of ....

    Polish
    Nazi crimes against ethnic Poles
    The Nazi occupation of Poland was one of the most brutal episodes of the war, resulting in more than two million deaths, not including some three million Polish Jews. The five million Poles killed, Jewish, Roman Catholic and Orthodox, accounted for 14% of the country's population.Poles were one of Hitler's first targets of extermination, as outlined in the speech he gave to Wehrmacht commanders before the invasion of Poland in 1939. The intelligentsia and socially prominent or influential people were primarily targeted, although mass murders were committed against the general Polish population, as well as against other groups of Slavs. Hundreds of thousands of Roman Catholic and Orthodox Poles were sent to Auschwitz and the other concentration camps, the intelligentsia were the first targets of the Einsatzgruppen death squads.

    Soviet Slavs and POWs
    Nazi crimes against Soviet POWs, and OST-Arbeiter
    During Operation Barbarossa, the Axis invasion of the Soviet Union, millions of Red Army prisoners of war (POWs) were arbitrarily executed in the field by the invading German armies (in particular by the Waffen SS), died under inhuman conditions in German prisoner of war camps and during death marches, or were shipped to concentration camps for execution. The Germans killed an estimated 2.8 million Soviet POWs through starvation, exposure and summary execution, in a mere eight months over 1941 and 1942. According to the US Holocaust Museum, by the winter of 1941, "starvation and disease resulted in mass death of unimaginable proportions". Up to 500,000 were killed in the concentration camps.

    Soviet civilian populations in the occupied areas were also heavily persecuted (in addition to the barbarity of the Eastern Front frontline warfare manifesting itself in episodes such as the siege of Leningrad in which more than 1.2 million civilians died). Thousands of peasant villages across Russia, Belarus and Ukraine were annihilated by German troops. During the occupation, Russia's Leningrad, Pskov and Novgorod region lost around a quarter of its population. Some estimate that as many as one quarter of all Soviet civilian deaths (five million Russian, three million Ukrainian and 1.5 million Belarusian) deaths at the hands of the Nazis and their allies were racially motivated. The Russian Academy of Science in 1995 reported civilian victims in the USSR, including Jews at German hands, totaled 13.7 million dead, 20% of the 68 million persons in the occupied USSR, including 7.4 million victims of Nazi genocide and reprisals; 2.2 million deaths of persons deported to Germany for forced labor; and 4.1 million famine and disease deaths in occupied territory. There were an additional estimated 3.0 million famine deaths in the territory not under German occupation. These losses are for the entire territory of the USSR in its 1946–1991 borders, including territories annexed in 1939–40. The deaths of 8.2 million Soviet civilians including Jews, were documented by the Soviet Extraordinary State Commission


    Romanies (Gypsies)
    The Nazi genocide of Gypsies identified within the term, 'Porrajmos' was largely ignored by scholars until the 1980s, The problem with the research into the assault upon the Gypsies has so far shown that both Roma, Lalleri and Sinti, as sub-Groups of the Gypsy peoples, were a target for Hitler and his Nazi murder apparatus. This however, does not seek to include those Travellers, Itinerant or even Beggars, who were plucked from Towns and Cities and grouped together with the Gypsy people to be murdered. The death toll of Romanies (Roma (Romani subgroup), Sinti, and Manush) in the Holocaust has been assessed at some 500,000 People. As with the Final Murder Total for the Jews, Conservatively estimated to be 6,000,000, we will never know the exact Death Toll for the Gypsy, let alone for the Jews. The Gypsies as smaller contingent of what Hitler classed as undesireables, took a heavy toll of their nomadic presence within Europe.[15] Hitler's campaign of genocide against the Romani population of Europe involved a particularly bizarre application of Nazi "racial hygiene" (or a type of selective breeding). Countless tens of thousands of Gypsies were deported and gassed in the Death Camps, and Auschwitz and Treblinka have accurate records of their being murdered there.

    Disabled people

    Following a eugenics policy, the Nazis believed that the disabled were a burden to society because they needed to be cared for by others; they were also considered an affront to Nazi notions of a society peopled by a perfect, superhuman Aryan race. Around 375,000 individuals were sterilized against their will because of their disabilities.

    People with disabilities were also among the first to be killed by the Nazis; the United States Holocaust Memorial museum notes that the T-4 Euthanasia Program, established in 1939, became the "model" for future exterminations by the Nazi regime, and set a precedent for their attempted Jewish genocide. The T-4 Program was established in order to maintain the "purity" of the so-called Aryan race by systematically killing children and adults born with physical deformities or suffering from mental illness; this included use of the first gas chambers. Although Hitler formally ordered a halt to the T-4 program in late August 1941, the killings secretly continued until the war’s end, resulting in the murder of an estimated 275,000 people with disabilities

    Freemasons
    The Nazis claimed that high degree Masons were willing members of "the Jewish conspiracy" and that Freemasonry was one of the causes of Germany's defeat in WWI. The preserved records of the RSHA (Reichssicherheitshauptamt – Office of the High Command of Security Service pursuing the racial objectives of the SS through Race and Resettlement Office), show the persecution of the Freemasons. The number of Freemasons from Nazi occupied countries who were killed is not accurately known, but it is estimated that between 80,000 and 200,000 were murdered.



    Kinky is using a feather. Perverted is using the whole chicken

  13. #673
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    Meanwhile back in 2012? .... Expectant stakeholders anxiously wait!

  14. #674
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    Quote Originally Posted by oldrider View Post
    They will get their way on this and like Madness said, the sky wont fall down for the rest of us but what will the next thing be and will it ever end!
    It's true! It will keep on going and going until they're treated equally! How dare they?!

  15. #675
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    For those of you saying Civil Union and Marriage entitles the same rights...

    So what?
    Heterosexuals can be in a defacto relationship, civil union, or marriage and be treated the same by the state.
    Homosexuals can be in a defacto relationship or civil union.

    Basically giving homosexuals the rights of marriage but refusing to call it marriage is false generosity.
    Here are your rights but we're uncomfortable in calling your partnership a marriage so you can be 'civil unioned'.

    When you meet people do you want to say you're married, or civil unioned? Do you want to call them your wife/husband or civil partner?

    For those spouting that marriage has been heterosexual for thousands of years... Even if it were true an argument from tradition is a logical fallacy. IE if X is traditional it is better than Y. You have to state reasons why it's better to keep marriage as exclusive for heterosexuals, as far as I'm concerned I haven't heard any good, rational arguments against it.

    Today marriage no longer involves the binding of man with property, the brides family doesn't have to pay the groom a dowry, the soul purpose of marriage isn't children, there's no such thing as illegitimate children in our society any more. Marriage has become the binding of people who are simply in love, which I thinks great. So allow those who love eachother to marry and stop with all the anger, hate and bigotry.

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