Commodity ownership?

[jonbuoy]

Nah, I think you mean pineapple lumps.

Ah Jesus dont start dragging the Canucks into this!

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news...-1225700396614

[Hinny]

Most people in NZ that got lost in the bush wouldn't know what they could eat! Doesn't mean there isn't anything out there. Have you been to other countries and seen what their bush is like? And how much there is in their bush that will eat YOU?

They don't die from starvation, they die from hypothermia.

Plenty of opportunity to get eaten in pre-European N.Z.
By the most dangerous animals on Earth.
Nothing benign about that.

[Drew]

Still, not a lot of protein and the English explorers observed Maori to be undernourished and half starved. Nobodies fault as after 800 years they had reached the limits of hunter-gather societies.

Are you saying they were here for 800 years before the white man arrived?

A society with no written language couldn't know that, and I don't recall learning it in school from what little NZ history we were taught.

[Winston001]

Are you saying they were here for 800 years before the white man arrived?

A society with no written language couldn't know that, and I don't recall learning it in school from what little NZ history we were taught.

Yes. I'm surprised you weren't taught this because I remember it from primary school. Archeologists date migration of Maori at around 1200 CE.

[Drew]

Sonic whitey had shown up a hundred years later we'd have found nothing but Maori bones with the big ass bird bones?

[Banditbandit]

Still, not a lot of protein and the English explorers observed Maori to be undernourished and half starved. Nobodies fault as after 800 years they had reached the limits of hunter-gather societies.

I'd like to see your references for that. Most of the Europeans remarked how fit and well Māori of the time were. And there is plenty of protein in birds and kaimoana.

And they could not have been worse than the English sailors who arrived here, suffering from scurvey and other nasty diseases. And the average life expectancy in Europe at the time was 28 years old ... the same as for Māori in GodZone. Some have also said that Māōri were better fed than their European counterparts ...

And reached the limit of hunter-gatherer soicetieas? Doubt it - a maximim of half a million people in 66 million acres of bush and plentiful seashore ...

[Drew]

If you're gonna ask for references, should you not also supply some to substantiate your claim? (Hehehe, see what I did there)?

This is all just Internet bullshit I realise, but facts might actually be helpful in the rest of us to form our anti Maori opinions.

[oldrider]

All the usual hysteria and them and us comments flying around again I see.

Government have proposed an action, Maori have asked a question ... what are you all most afraid of?

The question or the answer? .. ..

[Banditbandit]

This is all just Internet bullshit I realise, but facts might actually be helpful in the rest of us to form our anti Maori opinions.

Hei aha? Facts have never stopped you in the past ...

In 1771 in a letter James Cook wrote Māori are "a strong, well-made, active people, rather above the common size ..."

Henrik Haelbos (on Tasman's ship) recorded of Māori: "These people were rough, uncivilized strong, full of verve ..." (that doesn't sound poorly noutished to me).

Monkhouse (On the Endevour) wrote that in Tolaga Bay the local peope had about 100 acres under cultivation (so much for the hunetr-gatrherers ... they were farming as well).

Cook (1769) records: "The people in these Canoes made a very good appearance being al stout and wel made men ..."

PLenty more ... that's enough ...

And in her book Two Worlds Anne Salmond writes of Europe at the time of first contact in GodZone: "The average lifespan was short - in seventeenth century Paris, the average life expectancy was 23 years (although some people lived into their eighties and nineties), while in the ruling families of Western Europe during this period the average male life expectancy was 28 years and the average female lifespan was 34 yerars (Salmond, page 48, citing Kamen, Henry, 1971, The Iron Century: Social Change in Europe 1550-1660, London, Weidenfeld and Nicolson.

Salmond also wtrite (page 10) "Europeans [of the time] lived about as long as pre-Europen Maori, but overall they were prone to disease and quite often less well fed."

[Drew]

All the usual hysteria and them and us comments flying around again I see.

Government have proposed an action, Maori have asked a question ... what are you all most afraid of?

The question or the answer? .. ..

answers don't scare me. Billions of dollars being spent unwisely however, sends me cowering in the corner!

Hei aha? Facts have never stopped you in the past ...

In 1771 in a letter James Cook wrote Māori are "a strong, well-made, active people, rather above the common size ..."

Henrik Haelbos (on Tasman's ship) recorded of Māori: "These people were rough, uncivilized strong, full of verve ..." (that doesn't sound poorly noutished to me).

Monkhouse (On the Endevour) wrote that in Tolaga Bay the local peope had about 100 acres under cultivation (so much for the hunetr-gatrherers ... they were farming as well).

Cook (1769) records: "The people in these Canoes made a very good appearance being al stout and wel made men ..."

PLenty more ... that's enough ...

And in her book Two Worlds Anne Salmond writes of Europe at the time of first contact in GodZone: "The average lifespan was short - in seventeenth century Paris, the average life expectancy was 23 years (although some people lived into their eighties and nineties), while in the ruling families of Western Europe during this period the average male life expectancy was 28 years and the average female lifespan was 34 yerars (Salmond, page 48, citing Kamen, Henry, 1971, The Iron Century: Social Change in Europe 1550-1660, London, Weidenfeld and Nicolson.

Salmond also wtrite (page 10) "Europeans [of the time] lived about as long as pre-Europen Maori, but overall they were prone to disease and quite often less well fed."

Well bloody hell, I have learnt something from kiwibiker, that I will try my best to retain.

Some of that rings a bell from past teachings now that you write it, just can't have been interested back then I suppose.

[Paul in NZ]

Drew - if you are keen I really recommend Michael Kings 'Penguin History of New Zealand'. Like most of Michael Kings work its very readable...

[Paul in NZ]

Most people in NZ that got lost in the bush wouldn't know what they could eat! Doesn't mean there isn't anything out there. Have you been to other countries and seen what their bush is like? And how much there is in their bush that will eat YOU?

Actually on every survival course I've been on it was stated clearly that in most cases, unless you are lucky enough to get lost in an orchard or vege patch you will most likely spend more energy gathering food in the bush these days than you will recover from the food. (this is south island btw)

Spend your energy improving your chance of discovery or getting unlost OR save your energy for surviving by minimizing losses.

[Drew]

Drew - if you are keen I really recommend Michael Kings 'Penguin History of New Zealand'. Like most of Michael Kings work its very readable...

Are you suggesting I try and learn something? I'll hunt you down and kill ya if you are.

Actually on every survival course I've been on it was stated clearly that in most cases, unless you are lucky enough to get lost in an orchard or vege patch you will most likely spend more energy gathering food in the bush these days than you will recover from the food. (this is south island btw)

Spend your energy improving your chance of discovery or getting unlost OR save your energy for surviving by minimizing losses.

I'd have thought our plentifull supply of creepy crawlies could keep a person alive and energised for a little while at least.

Learnt two things, can't commit them both to the file though so one will have to go.

[brendonjw]

weren't the Morioris (SP) here before the Maoris.....

[Meanie]

All the usual hysteria and them and us comments flying around again I see.

Government have proposed an action, Maori have asked a question ... what are you all most afraid of?

The question or the answer? .. ..

The cost to the economy just to sort this out must be huge, thats before any agreed payout has been made.
Im afraid the county will go broke trying to sort ownership of everything out, only people winning here will be the lawyers

I cant see how any one can claim to have more rights or ownership in NZ than the other, after all we all have relatives that emigrated here at some stage.