Govt assault on young 'uns continues

[Oscar]

These would be the banks that pay their CEO over 5m per year and were being taken to court by the IRD a year or so ago. Keep watching the reports that get quickly buried, you have to look through the smoke screen occasionally.

If you look through the smoke screen (no doubt issuing from your bong), you'll see that the court action started years ago and the IRD won against all the Aussie Banks.

And whilst you're worrying about how much other people earn, maybe you could pause a minute and think how the Australian Govt. G'tee of all those banks affected NZ in GFC? I realise that it doesn't fit with your conspiracy theories, but if those Aussie banks hadn't have been well capitalised and Govt. backed, the NZ economy would be a wreck.

[oneofsix]

It may come as a surprise to you, but I was in one.
Not only that, I was on the executive.

Not really, perhaps mildly at most. Suspect one of the more militant ones.

It taught me a couple of things - a group of people with a grudge will always seek the lowest common denominator, and that none of us are quite so stupid as all of us.

These comments also apply to most political parties.

It is the political parties bread and butter. They rely on it but sadly the rest of society is following suit. However the political parties are only the holders of the throne not the power behind it.

[Oscar]

Not really, perhaps mildly at most. Suspect one of the more militant ones.

Oh yeah - The Insurance Workers Union.
A right bunch of radicals...

[oneofsix]

Oh yeah - The Insurance Workers Union.
A right bunch of radicals...

Oh that terrible bunch. They caused no end of up set

[Oscar]

Oh that terrible bunch. They caused no end of up set

Phil Goff was our Union Rep.
Fucking commie...

[Banditbandit]

that none of us are quite so stupid as all of us.

This cracked me up soooo much ... Yes .. that can be the case ...

[Banditbandit]

Oh yeah - The Insurance Workers Union.
A right bunch of radicals...

Bwhahahaha ... I can just hear you all standing up and singing The Red Flag ... (Not a real union - have no affinity for the proletariat or the struggle between the prols and the capitalist running dogs and paper tigers ... )

Phil Goff was our Union Rep.
Fucking commie...

Huh? If you think Goff is a communist then your political knowledge and credibility is seriously lacking ...

[Oscar]

Huh? If you think Goff is a communist then your political knowledge and credibility is seriously lacking ...

If you thought I was serious, then your sense of humour and knowledge of the drone in question is seriously lacking.

[mashman]

Oh yeah - The Insurance Workers Union.
A right bunch of radicals...

How long did it take you to dismantle the union capitalist pig?

[scissorhands]

Is the squirrel who stores nuts a capitalist?
Is the stag who eats more grass, gets bigger than the other males, fights, wins, then gets to mate with the girlies, a capitalist?

Not advocating a barbaric or greedy society, but myself seeking a natural sustainable model[,] comrade.

Lets let the lazy, silly, meek, and excessively compliant.... breed.... See what sort of animal farm we will end up with, a herd of domesticated beasts, ripe for a shit fight and takeover from outsiders

Or a herd compromised by weaker males getting a sly root too often... and spawning more of the same...

[mashman]

Is the squirrel who stores nuts a capitalist?
Is the stag who eats more grass, gets bigger than the other males, fights, wins, then gets to mate with the girlies, a capitalist?

Not advocating a barbaric or greedy society, but myself seeking a natural sustainable model[,] comrade.

Lets let the lazy, silly, meek, and excessively compliant.... breed.... See what sort of animal farm we will end up with, a herd of domesticated beasts, ripe for a shit fight and takeover from outsiders

Or a herd compromised by weaker males getting a sly root too often... and spawning more of the same...

We can wipe the forest that the squirrel and the deer live in off the face of the planet over breakfast from several thousand miles away... as long as there's money in it. Praps that's the way it needs to go. However, I'd rather it didn't and we attempted to become as sustainable as possible before some group of fine upstanding citizens decides that there are too many people aboard the good ship Earth and indiscriminately (with the obvious exception of those who have been trying ) cull the herd coz they believe that it is their responsibility to do so.

[Ocean1]

You are confusing Business with trading. Business is assigning value to something that has little or no real value and convincing others that it has the value you have assigned it. The burger flipper at McDonalds has more value than the CEO of the bank. You need food to live, why do you really need the bank CEO?

No, dude, business is mostly about creating value. Sure, some idiots can be convinced to pay good money for worthless shit, and that allows some businesses to deal in such shit. Feel free not to deal with them. When they're gone there'll be the majority of businesses still around, adding value to a product and selling to people who recognise that.

That's crap man. There's free food out there if you now where to find it ... (I eat free food at least once a week - could eat more if I didnt go to "work") free water too (I'm not on a town supply and pay no water rates ...) ... and shelter as well.

You are too tied into the contemporary capitalist system ...

Nothing to do with capitalism. There were and are businesses in every economy, no matter the politics. And if you don't want to deal with them then you're quite right, you can live off whatever you can supply for yourself. Most inteligent people have found, though that they do far better specialising in one field and using the earnings from that to pay other specialists for what they need. That's business.

And understand this -it's a Labour market as well ... if a business cannot pay a market rates for its workers then it is not going to be an economic business.

Who sets the market rates ? The business owner AND the workers ...

Actually neither do. The guy buying the goods/services the employee generates decides what it's worth. There's obviously higher wages and profit generated by a good employee working within an effective business.

[Akzle]

Business is simply the mechanism whereby we generate the value to acquire the resources to live. Without that sideshow you don't HAVE food, water and shelter.

nope, still wrong. the resources are out there, just a waitin for someone to do something about it...(not necessarily in the name of the almighty profit)

...how's this metaphor:
an elephant eats 100kgs of food DAILY.
now imagine the human farm required to produce that much food (daily). imagine the fuel in the tractors, the fertiliser (driven in from somewhere else), the land area etc etc, to produce that.

and you reckon humans have the right idea?

lets all spend our live gathering food. Since only one of those systems leads to the constructions of motorcycles, I can see why most of us prefer it.

... the other guy beat me to it. half time "work" to meet your needs. and bear in mind a large part of that work is fishing (for food eh)... so. go fish!

and also no. where there is a need, it will be met. we can abandon money tomorow, and if the guy at the ore mine keeps working, the guy at the trucking company keeps driving it, the guy at the smelter keeps the furnace going - you will get your motorbike - for FREE, howsat? (you just keep going and doing YOUR job... without pay)

I do own my own property - MORTGAGE FREE ... I worked hard to buy it and pay it off .. and I owe diddly-squat to anybody - everything I own is paid for ...)

sorry to burst your bubble. you don't own shit.
you have a legal claim to fee simple title, your government retains THEIR claim to allodial title, you better hope they don't want to put pylons or a motorway through your section, you better hope you don't strike oil, cos then you gon' be moved on in short order.
pay your rates, don't discharge anything beyond the 'boundary', don't tip paint down the sink...

I would also be more careful about selling companies overseas - the NZ banking industry owned by Oz took $14billion in profits last year - that's $14billion no longer in the New Zealand economy ... the tax on that money alone is $4.2billion ... how many hospitals, schools, police, roads etc would that fund? Earned by us and taken by Fat Cat Australians ... If that money stayed in GodZone then just maybe we could have reduced taxes ...

14, 000, 000, 000/ 4, 000, 000 = $3500.00 for every man, woman and child using an account in their legal name... nah.

Most inteligent people have found, though that they do far better specialising in one field and using the earnings from that to pay other specialists for what they need. That's business.

yup, and this can be entirely provided for (as above - go to work without expecting pay). BUT, it really comes down to what you are ACTUALLY worth to "society" at large.
personally, the CEO of whatever bank i turn up at, doens't actually have fuckall effect on my life, he could die, life goes on. now, if the blondies behind the counter were to up and fuck off, then i may have more of a problem. similarly the guy who loads my bullets is worth a lot to me, the guy who packs meat at the supermarket is not...


fuck it! bring on the zombie apocalypse...

[mashman]

and also no. where there is a need, it will be met. we can abandon money tomorow, and if the guy at the ore mine keeps working, the guy at the trucking company keeps driving it, the guy at the smelter keeps the furnace going - you will get your motorbike - for FREE, howsat? (you just keep going and doing YOUR job... without pay)

That's just crazy talk. You can't have a none financial solution to financial problems, think about the fallout... and motorcycles need money to come into existence. Jesus, you're talking about all but eradicating hunger and poverty and crime and war along with giving governments and corporations absolutely no reason to keep secrets or hoard useful information that may allow other country's to drag themselves into this century and start to be able to look after the people in their country propelling humanity and their ability forwards at a rate never seen and seldom thought about... amongst other things. That's just fuckin madness, why the fuck would anyone want to work half of the hours giving themselves more time to spend with their kids bringing them up with some form of moral perspective instead of rearing a bunch of cutthroat zombies. Insanity... bring on the zombies.

[Ocean1]

nope, still wrong. the resources are out there, just a waitin for someone to do something about it...(not necessarily in the name of the almighty profit)

Yeah. What tree did you pick that laptop from, dude?

...how's this metaphor:
an elephant eats 100kgs of food DAILY.
now imagine the human farm required to produce that much food (daily). imagine the fuel in the tractors, the fertiliser (driven in from somewhere else), the land area etc etc, to produce that.

and you reckon humans have the right idea?

Metaphore for what? You can have that any time you want, jump a plane to any third world economy.

[COLOR="#139922"]
yup, and this can be entirely provided for (as above - go to work without expecting pay). BUT, it really comes down to what you are ACTUALLY worth to "society" at large.
personally, the CEO of whatever bank i turn up at, doens't actually have fuckall effect on my life, he could die, life goes on. now, if the blondies behind the counter were to up and fuck off, then i may have more of a problem. similarly the guy who loads my bullets is worth a lot to me, the guy who packs meat at the supermarket is not...


fuck it! bring on the zombie apocalypse...

No, it comes down to what I'm worth to my customers. "Society's" got fuck all say in it.

And if you've got issues about your bank's management why don't you find another one? There must be at least one run according to your ideals, shirley.