Weed legalised in 2 USA states

[scumdog]

Caffeine is fatal in high enough doses. Weed isn't fatal in any dose. Now why is coffee legal and pot isn't?

Gah..

[SMOKEU]

Gah..

Prove me wrong, and quoting a piece of legislation isn't going to do it.

[Usarka]

NZ isn't france. We have a binge drinking culture - kids here knock back large cans of V throughout the day. Same argument goes for red wine, small doses is grand and we've all had some as kids and been ok, but it's illegal for kids to drink wine on the way to school (until they're 18 anyways).

Caffeine is a pscyhoactive stimulant. It commonly produces known pyschiatric symptoms (anxiety and insomnia being the most common). Like all good drugs it produces (nasty) withdrawal symptoms. There's even links between caffeine and psychosis.

My rant was more at the hypocrisy of saying "drugs are bad" when we're happy for our kids to knock back large doses of a known pyschoactive drug. Then when they try a different drug we call them criminal waster layabouts get a haircut you dirty no good hippy.


Have a read here and http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/11/6/432.full

[007XX]

Caffeine is fatal in high enough doses. Weed isn't fatal in any dose. Now why is coffee legal and pot isn't?

Actually, not quite true. Marijuana could become potentialy harmful, but you would have to smoke such a ridiculously high quantity, it is highly improbable it would ever happen.

http://druglibrary.org/schaffer/library/mj_overdose.htm


But in my earlier point about coffee, I stressed that I was refering to a low dosage over a long period of time of consumption (one cup a day), which has been proven to be even a beneficial factor towards the warding of some cancers for example.

My point: excess consumption is the problem, not so much the substance. Both are fairly harmless if the user is responsible and consummes with care.

[007XX]

My rant was more at the hypocrisy of saying "drugs are bad" when we're happy for our kids to knock back large doses of a known pyschoactive drug. Then when they try a different drug we call them criminal waster layabouts get a haircut you dirty no good hippy.


Have a read here and http://apt.rcpsych.org/content/11/6/432.full

Yes, that I agree with. And of course, I am aware of the effect of caffeine. As someone who can't sleep at night if I have more than 2 cups of coffee in the one day, or drink it after 12 pm, I am particularly alarmed when I see kids or even adults drinking the likes of V and Red Bull, sometimes two or three a day

And the size of the cans are increasing as well!

My 15 year old has been educated about them, and is against them himself. But it is scary how people get sucked in by these seemingly "harmless" substances.

[scumdog]

I am particularly alarmed when I see kids or even adults drinking the likes of V and Red Bull, sometimes two or three a day

And the size of the cans are increasing as well!

My 15 year old has been educated about them, and is against them himself. But it is scary how people get sucked in by these seemingly "harmless" substances.

Being devils advocate: So if cannabis was able to be sold as easily a V Red Bull K2 and all the other junk kids thrive on you thinkl that they would not go for it like rabod dog in a room full of rabbits???

(BTW: This is not aimed at you 007XX!)

[007XX]

Being devils advocate: So if cannabis was able to be sold as easily a V Red Bull K2 and all the other junk kids thrive on you thinkl that they would not go for it like rabod dog in a room full of rabbits???

(BTW: This is not aimed at you 007XX!)

I know mate

Straight answer? Yes, they would... But there would be hardly any difference between them then and now.

Stoned: they'd lie on the couch, eat Cheetos or whatever and giggle their arses off while playing Halo 4.

Downside: they'd do it for longer.


It is the "perceived" badness of cannabis portrayed by people who have never tried it that annoys me. Especialy when science has succesfully proven that there are no real damage caused by it in the first place.
It is bad because "straight" folks are scared of it, having been labelled a drug by opinionated, straight laced do gooders with only one desire: controlling everything around them to make themselves feel more secure about their lonely little constricted existence.


And that is definitely not directed at you Scummy, i hope you know that.

[blue rider]

quite simply the netherlands have shown that de-criminalising weed and 'tolerating' its consumption, allowing for retailing of weed and hashish in a controlled environment to adults is possible. Despite rumors, not all habitants of the flat country have turned into no good long haired and unshaven hippies.

a neat little page on the costs of the War on Drugs http://www.drugsense.org/cms/wodclock

use of drugs in the netherlands compared to the states http://www.drugwarfacts.org/cms/netherlands_v_us


human cost of the war on drugs http://www.opendemocracy.net/jimmy-k...f-war-on-drugs

a wee report on drug use world wide http://www.unodc.org/documents/data-..._web_small.pdf

history of weed and why it was declared illegal http://www.drugwarrant.com/articles/...juana-illegal/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_h..._United_States

alcohol with all the havoc it wreckes is legal and taxed and has a huge lobby
cigarettes with its hundreds of death every year is legal and has a huge lobby ,
but canabis is evil, and its use needs to be prosecuted to the fullest of the law....

[Road kill]

Being devils advocate: So if cannabis was able to be sold as easily a V Red Bull K2 and all the other junk kids thrive on you thinkl that they would not go for it like rabod dog in a room full of rabbits???

(BTW: This is not aimed at you 007XX!)

In countries where it is freely available people don't go for it like a rabid dog in a room full of anything at all.

In India "some people" make a semi religion of it,the rest don't really care.
In Holland it's mainly visitors from places where it's illegal that make the head lines,,from what I heard the locals just ain't that interested.
In south Australia where having less than 30g is a "very small" fine if the cop can even be bothered,,,again most people really ain't that interested.
But in NZ the kids are going to go at it like rabid dogs huh,,,,,,,fuck that's a pretty sad mind set.

Here,,,have a Snickers bro'.

[scumdog]

In countries where it is freely available people don't go for it like a rabid dog in a room full of anything at all.

In India "some people" make a semi religion of it,the rest don't really care.
In Holland it's mainly visitors from places where it's illegal that make the head lines,,from what I heard the locals just ain't that interested.
In south Australia where having less than 30g is a "very small" fine if the cop can even be bothered,,,again most people really ain't that interested.
But in NZ the kids are going to go at it like rabid dogs huh,,,,,,,fuck that's a pretty sad mind set.

Here,,,have a Snickers bro'.

Is it part of the NZ psyche that we 'do' things to excess? - particularly the younger ones?
Like drink too much aclcohol, V & Red Bull.
And smoke K2 and other synthetic cannabis (haha, WTF, who decided to call the crap THAT?)


WOULD they be the same with cannabis if it was legalised?

Who knows...

[007XX]

Is it part of the NZ psyche that we 'do' things to excess? - particularly the younger ones?
Like drink too much aclcohol, V & Red Bull.
And smoke K2 and other synthetic cannabis (haha, WTF, who decided to call the crap THAT?)


WOULD they be the same with cannabis if it was legalised?

Who knows...

You'd probably find that initialy, there would be a large intake mostly due to curiosity / hype. But then factors such as cost and availability would get in the way, especialy if these two factors are tailored to make it harder. A bit the way cigarette prices have indeed encouraged a lot of people to give up the nasty habit.

Also, it is worth mentioning that smoking weed often is a one time occurence. A lot of people I have spoken to often reported having tried it once, and as they didn't enjoy it, never bothered with it again.

But as you said, who knows? I sure don't have all the answers, but I would say that as times change, and gaps in the market are "met" by chemically made alternatives who do more harm than good, isn't it time that the powers that be adopt a more fluid stance to the wisdom of old?

[scissorhands]

Scummys kinda right in that Tahiti, Hawaii, NZ all have the reggae, Ben Harper, weed lifestyles going on. That probably wont change a bit.
Which aint a bad thing. If your a Jamaican, your a Jamaican.

Legalisation will change little in the long run, regarding use statistics. The outcome could even be like Holland with an eventual drop in use, if TV ads are aimed at cannabis education.

It seems public awareness of all highs, natural and synthetic is big business now, so cannabis has to compete with all the new kids on the block.

Legalise and tax. I'm also for promoting 2 healthy ales/2 red wines a day... its good for you. Hops and cannabis are relaxing

I'm a bit fat and lazy, drink ales/wines, smoke about 6 'rolls' a week, and 4 coffees a day. Blood pressure was 120/70 at 1pm

Junk food or exhaust gasses are more harmful overall to people

[Grubber]

Funny how some people can stop at the pub and have a couple of drinks and then ride or drive on, but if you refuse a drink and just opt for a couple of tokes on a cone or joint, then often you are seen as a social leper or some sort of deviant, drug dealing,lowlife. People are fucked, thats all there is to it, but I like that everyone is a fucken headcase, it makes life so interesting and exciting.

One doesn't tend to get drunk on 2 beers, one does end up stoned with one joint. Quite different really.
The only reason someone has a toke is to get HIGH! You can have a beer or 2 and NOT GET HIGH!
Would much rather share the road with someone who has a beer or 2 than someone who was stoned!

[blue rider]

Is it part of the NZ psyche that we 'do' things to excess? - particularly the younger ones?
Like drink too much aclcohol, V & Red Bull.
And smoke K2 and other synthetic cannabis (haha, WTF, who decided to call the crap THAT?)


WOULD they be the same with cannabis if it was legalised?

Who knows...

so we are going to criminalise V/Red Bull and the other caffeine based mood and energy enhancers? We are going to criminalise alcohol consumptions? and we are finally going to classify cigarette as the most deadliest and most addictive drug ever?

do I hear crickets? yes I do!

[blue rider]

One doesn't tend to get drunk on 2 beers, one does end up stoned with one joint. Quite different really.
The only reason someone has a toke is to get HIGH! You can have a beer or 2 and NOT GET HIGH!
Would much rather share the road with someone who has a beer or 2 than someone who was stoned!

i get drunk after two beers. I would not suggest you share the road with me after these two beers.

one reason I dont drink anything but coffee and lemonade on a ride.


however, you will find more people drunk on the road than stoned.
and sadly drink driving is accepted.

but weed is evil!