American gun mania

[mashman]

There was a number of spree killings around that day, Seattle Mall, China knife attack in a school no deaths but wounded about 20 kiddies, and somewhere else too

...and opinions

True that this isn't just a mental illness thing... no doubt there are plenty who are unhinged, I guess we all, well some of us, maybe just me, have days where we "fantasize" about laying waste to those we deem surplus to requirements. I do wonder how these guys slip into the state of mind where it becomes that all encompassing train of thought. Why is one day any different to another etc... Are the signs really there? or is it just a bit of jazzed up media hype that makes every "sane" person as one of your commentators notes. Strange things we be.

[jasonu]

Amazing they found so many countries with the same population number as the USA...

I guess all the countries NOT mentioned must have had a different population size...

It is called 'propaganda' and the figures are generally twisted and or manipulated in the favour of the publishers stand point.

[jasonu]

Why do people that are not going to war need assault rifles? Why do they need guns that shoot many bullets at a time at high speed?

please do enlighten me, cause I don't get it.

Because they are fun to shoot (IMO).

The same arguement could be used against big sport bikes.
ie Why do people that are not in the World Superbikes need to ride a GSXR1000 capable of doing 185mph when a GN250 will get them to the shops just as well.
Not quite the same thing I know.

[scumdog]

Without a gun you'd struggle to kill as many people in as short a time, would he have got the same number if he'd only had a knife or a baseball bat?

Seems to work in China...

[scumdog]

goat culling? with an assault rifle? what do you use when you go wild pig hunting?

nope i don't understand it.

So if I had used 'normal' semi-auto hunting rifle with a large magazine that would have been alright then??

BTW: Slack-jawed mouth-breathing journos lump ALL military-looking rifles as 'assault-rifles', - even bolt-action ones at times.

I suggest you look up what constitutes an 'assault rifle'. (Or in NZ, a m.s.s.a., a very flawed bit of legislation.

[Kickaha]

Seems to work in China...

22 injuries but no deaths on the same day, you think it would have been the same if he'd had a gun? maybe he wasn't trying hard enough

[SMOKEU]

So if I had used 'normal' semi-auto hunting rifle with a large magazine that would have been alright then??

BTW: Slack-jawed mouth-breathing journos lump ALL military-looking rifles as 'assault-rifles', - even bolt-action ones at times.

I suggest you look up what constitutes an 'assault rifle'. (Or in NZ, a m.s.s.a., a very flawed bit of legislation.

What kind of rifles do you guys use on the job?

[pete376403]

Amazing they found so many countries with the same population number as the USA...

I guess all the countries NOT mentioned must have had a different population size...

And I guess everyone needs a semi-auto (Never know when one might encounter those pesky goats, eh?)

OK, looking a bit further -

Comparing to countries that would rate as "third-world" - Caribbean, South America,etc,

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...iolence-is-it/

Annual homicide rate for firearms

Because the U.S. is so big, it's better to compare the frequency of firearm homicides per capita, usually expressed as firearm homicides per 100,000 in national population.

According to the U.N., the U.S. had 3.0 firearm homicides per 100,000 in population in 2009. But there were 14 other nations that had higher rates in 2009, primarily in Latin America and the Caribbean: Honduras (57.6), Jamaica (47.2), St. Kitts and Nevis (44.4), Venezuela (39.0), Guatemala (38.5), Colombia (28.1), Trinidad & Tobago (27.3), Panama (19.3), Dominican Republic (16.9), Bahamas (15.4), Belize (15.4), Mexico (7.9), Paraguay (7.3) and Nicaragua (5.9). Three other nations had higher rates in 2008: El Salvador (39.9), Brazil (18.1) and Ecuador (12.7).

So the U.S. doesn’t rank no. 1 when firearm homicides are adjusted for population

But when comparing US with similar "high-income countries", then the US is top of the table:

http://journals.lww.com/jtrauma/Abst...irearm.35.aspx

Methods: A cross-sectional analysis of the World Health Organization Mortality Database analyzes homicides and suicides (both disaggregated as firearm related and non-firearm related) and unintentional and undetermined firearm deaths from 23 populous high-income Organization for Economic Co-Operation and Development countries that provided data to the World Health Organization for 2003.

Results: The US homicide rates were 6.9 times higher than rates in the other high-income countries, driven by firearm homicide rates that were 19.5 times higher. For 15-year olds to 24-year olds, firearm homicide rates in the United States were 42.7 times higher than in the other countries. For US males, firearm homicide rates were 22.0 times higher, and for US females, firearm homicide rates were 11.4 times higher. The US firearm suicide rates were 5.8 times higher than in the other countries, though overall suicide rates were 30% lower. The US unintentional firearm deaths were 5.2 times higher than in the other countries. Among these 23 countries, 80% of all firearm deaths occurred in the United States, 86% of women killed by firearms were US women, and 87% of all children aged 0 to 14 killed by firearms were US children.

Conclusions: The United States has far higher rates of firearm deaths—firearm homicides, firearm suicides, and unintentional firearm deaths compared with other high-income countries. The US overall suicide rate is not out of line with these countries, but the United States is an outlier in terms of our overall homicide rate.

[imdying]

To put it in perspective:

The largest mass killing in this country was 9-11, ~ 3000 dead. Weapons were box cutters and airplanes.

Next was Oklahoma City, 168 dead. Weapon was a truck load of fertilizer.

Then 87 dead from arson at the Happy Land social club, The Bronx, New York, 1990. Weapon was a can of gasoline.

The largest school massacre was in Bath, Michigan, in 1927. 44 dead. Weapon was explosives.

And to put that into perspective... every year more Americans die from hand guns (over 10,000, every year) than all of those events combined, times two.

[imdying]

Without a gun you'd struggle to kill as many people in as short a time

Actually I'm not so sure... I reckon I could build a shoulder launched anti aircraft missile inside of a year, range of maybe 400 metres. You could sit yourself at the end of the Christchurch Intl Airport runway and nail a 747 as it took off. Hell for even less effort you could make an unguided rocket version with an even larger warhead. The proliferation of cheap micro controllers and UAV instructions all of the net makes things like that far easier than even a few years ago.

[nzmikey]

have a look at this link : http://www.theatlanticcities.com/pol...g-deaths/4172/

& for those of you that cant be arsed reading lotsa words ...

Of the world's 23 "rich" countries, the U.S. gun-related murder rate is almost 20 times that of the other 22. With almost one privately owned firearm per person, America's ownership rate is the highest in the world; tribal-conflict-torn Yemen is ranked second, with a rate about half of America's.

In 2008, the U.S. had over 12 thousand firearm-related homicides. All of Japan experienced only 11, fewer than were killed at the Aurora shooting alone. And that was a big year: 2006 saw an astounding two, and when that number jumped to 22 in 2007, it became a national scandal. By comparison, also in 2008, 587 Americans were killed just by guns that had discharged accidentally.

[Naki Rat]

There was actually someone on the radio news promoting that the school headmistress could have "taken the shooter's head off" if she had had a gun in her desk. It brought this to mind

[awa355]

I see an article in todays news about another shooting at a shopping mall carpark. in California. 50 shots fired, nobody hurt. Same page has a story from a Hollywood actor saying the entertainment industry has to accept some responsibility for the violence.

[Road kill]

Why do people that are not going to war need assault rifles? Why do they need guns that shoot many bullets at a time at high speed? and why whould the restriction of assoult weapons and/or semi automatic uns/rifles diminish the right of someone to legally own a standard type gun.


i know really nothing about guns and weapons in general as I really don't find them apealing in any which way.

So to the gun owners, why would you promote the legal sale, (and the USA has some really lax regulations as to who can sell and who can buy) of military style weapons.
And why would you - the gun enthousiast - feel infringed by not having the right to buy a rifle akin to a kalachnikov.

please do enlighten me, cause I don't get it.

I'd feel infringed because I like all other legal firearms users in this country have actually had to prove ourselves before we were given our firearms licences.

And as I already said,,but nobody has responded to" we legal firearms owners are the largest group of police vetted and approved people in this country,,,and it is not us creating the problems

It's not as if we are like most bikers that get their bike licence and then go straight out and break the very laws they have just agreed to abide by.

As to why I'd like a Chinese copy of an M14,because I do and under NZ law I have earnt the right to,,end of story.

So how would you feel about having the right to own a bike taken from you because of what either criminals or the mentaly ill that have nothing to do with you have got up to.

[BMWST?]

Because they are fun to shoot (IMO).

The same arguement could be used against big sport bikes.
ie Why do people that are not in the World Superbikes need to ride a GSXR1000 capable of doing 185mph when a GN250 will get them to the shops just as well.
Not quite the same thing I know.

this is a bloody stupid argument.A military style automatic is designed for one thing.To despatch as many peole as possible.That is not the design breif of a GSXR 1000