The ultimate VFR400 F3 race bike - 98HP

[neil_cb125t]

http://www.cycleworld.com/2012/03/23...coolest-bikes/

[Crasherfromwayback]

http://www.cycleworld.com/2012/03/23...coolest-bikes/

Very trick!

[quickbuck]

http://www.cycleworld.com/2012/03/23...coolest-bikes/

On whos Dyno

Seriously though... That is darn awesome!
45k US though....

[Geeen]

Very cool way to get rid of a LOT of dosh. Whats the go with the wear patterns on that rear tyre, suspension issues or pressure issues?

[tail_end_charlie]

Yeah, I first saw his development work on that bike about a year ago. I get the impression that the main dude, Mike Norman, is very very very anal about things, and therefore is a great engine builder. If you want more information about his build, check out his website. He really goes into depth on the design, manufacture and sourcing of the componets he uses in his engine. There is quite a lot of money that has gone into making that little V4 whine, and a lot of it has ended up as quite expensive paperweights.

[HenryDorsetCase]

If I squint juuuuuuuuust right, I might see something that looks a bit like that when I go into the garage tonight.......


yeah, not so much.

[Mental Trousers]

Norman and Elrod are convinced the NC450V will destroy anything in the 500 Superbike class and, with the right rider, maybe even the fastest SV650s.

With the right rider it should annihilate the commuter bikes.

[Mental Trousers]

Be interesting to see if they would allow 450cc triples like we have here in F3. Build a 130+hp 600 then unplug a cylinder ......

http://www.afmracing.org/content/view/31/49/

Superbike

(refer to Rule Section 9.2)
These motorcycles are also street based models, but may be made for any market in the world. Limited edition models designed for racing purposes may not be allowed. "Racing Only" slick tires may be used. Unlimited modifications to the engine and suspension are allowed based on following engine displacement classes:
175-250cc
251-450cc
451-600cc
601-750cc
751-Open cc
Super Dinosaur - No displacement limits; bikes must be at least 12 model years old.

[tail_end_charlie]

Be interesting to see if they would allow 450cc triples like we have here in F3.

I think so. If you refer to G-Force website that I linked before and scroll half way down the page (talking about Dave Moss taking his second consecutive 450 Superbike Title) he makes a reference to Mike Lohmeyer riding as a development rider for another team working to prove the 450 triple concept.

Build a 130+hp 600 then unplug a cylinder ......

...............and probably end up with about 70 hp. Probably would have some reliability problems as well. But then again I'm talking through a hole in my head.

Just to satisfy my curiosity, did you deactivate a cylinder or short stroke your CBR?

[Mental Trousers]

I think so. If you refer to G-Force website that I linked before and scroll half way down the page (talking about Dave Moss taking his second consecutive 450 Superbike Title) he makes a reference to Mike Lohmeyer riding as a development rider for another team working to prove the 450 triple concept.

It's 421 Ian Smith riding as a development rider for another team. I haven't been able to find any mention of how they've done it though.

Looks like if you weren't able to there's formula classes like F3.

Formula

(refer to Rule Section 9.3)
The motorcycles in these classes can be models based on street machines, factory purpose built racing models, or customer built one-of-a-kind motorcycles. Refer to the rulebook for class specifics and formulas. Modifications are unlimited within the various classes provided they meet the engine size/type formula for the class.
Formula AFemme is a class for female racers only. This class is a chapter optional class and is offered when the race schedule permits.
Formula I is a class for four-stroke multi cylinder engines from 451cc to 750cc, two stroke engines from 251cc to 500cc, 450cc or larger displacement four stroke single engines, and twin cylinder engines from 651cc to 1000cc.
Formula II is a class where the true factory built, racing-only motorcycles rule. They are almost exclusively 250cc two-strokes with water-cooled engines. Large four-stroke singles are also allowed.
Formula III also features mostly factory built race bikes, but these are 125cc two-strokes with water cooled engines. Smaller four-stroke singles can run here.
Formula IV allows a wide variety of bike types. Various four-cylinders, mid-size twins, singles, and two-strokes all compete against each other.
Formula Singles are four-stroke, single cylinder engines of unlimited size surrounded by any frame, suspension, etc. the builder wants to use.
Formula Twins are four-stroke, twin cylinder engines broken down into three categories (245-500cc, 501-650cc, 651-Open cc) surrounded by any frame, suspension, etc.
Formula 40 Can be any machine as long as its rider is 40 years of age or older. It is separated into 3 classes, Light, Middle and Heavy Weight. The classes are based on engine displacement and type of motorcycle.(see the race day schedule or the latest news/updates page for updates).
Formula Vintage are motorcycles meeting the AHRMA Vintage rules and AFM safety rules and are 1974 or older models. For more info on vintage stuff, you can contact the AHRMA coordinator, Dave Russel, at (650) 967-0435 in the evening (before lOpm please).

[slowpoke]

...............and probably end up with about 70 hp. Probably would have some reliability problems as well. But then again I'm talking through a hole in my head.

Just to satisfy my curiosity, did you deactivate a cylinder or short stroke your CBR?

Our own Chris Osborne gets waaaay more than 70hp out of his beaut lil' GSXR450 triple (and others he's built), it's as reliable as a John Deere tractor, and all for a fraction of the cost of that purty wee thing. It's not even that much heavier while still running stock wheels. Don't get me wrong the Honda is lovely, but I hate to think what Chris could achieve if he had $45k USD at his disposal.

[tail_end_charlie]

It's 421 Ian Smith riding as a development rider for another team. I haven't been able to find any mention of how they've done it though.

Thats not how I read it:

Former 450cc Superbike Class Champion, Mike Lohmeyer (seen on the Red bike in the picture below, with 421 Ian Smith right behind) was racing as a Development Rider for another team, helping them prove a concept 450cc Triple conversion.

Our own Chris Osborne gets waaaay more than 70hp out of his beaut lil' GSXR450 triple (and others he's built), it's as reliable as a John Deere tractor, and all for a fraction of the cost of that purty wee thing. It's not even that much heavier while still running stock wheels. Don't get me wrong the Honda is lovely, but I hate to think what Chris could achieve if he had $45k USD at his disposal.

Yes, I'm familiar with Chris's work with the triples, but he has done much more than just pulling a plug lead from what I understand. And it sounds like some teams might be trying the same thing over in the US. To be honest, they could probably learn a thing or two by talking to Chris because I imagine he has been 'running on three' longer than they have.

A more interesting argument would be more along the lines of just how much power you can get out of a modern engine running the triple setup. Mike Norman and crew seem to be able to get about 78-82hp out of a 428cc capacity for about $7500US and 90-94 hp out of a 450cc for about $15000US; all out of a 25 year old engine design. From what I understand (haven't found a whole lot of information about Chris Osborn's bike, just the article that Glen Williams wrote on it here) Chris hasn't really spent anywhere near the same amount of money that Mike Norman has, and he is still getting a reliable 75hp. And that was info from a few years ago, I'm sure he's getting more than that now.
But either running a triple 450cc out of a modern engine (or short stroking a 600 to 450cc), are both compromising the overall design parameters of the engine to a certain degree. Whereas the G-Force 450cc engines are bored and stroked in a way that maximizes the original engine design.

[Mental Trousers]

Our own Chris Osborne gets waaaay more than 70hp out of his beaut lil' GSXR450 triple (and others he's built), it's as reliable as a John Deere tractor, and all for a fraction of the cost of that purty wee thing. It's not even that much heavier while still running stock wheels. Don't get me wrong the Honda is lovely, but I hate to think what Chris could achieve if he had $45k USD at his disposal.

Last I heard it was high 80's horsepower-wise, but as with many people that build a top end race bike, that figure may be intentionally understated. It's reliable now, but it's taken a few mechanical mishaps to get it that way.

[neil_cb125t]

Last I heard it was high 80's horsepower-wise, but as with many people that build a top end race bike, that figure may be intentionally understated. It's reliable now, but it's taken a few mechanical mishaps to get it that way.

Mechanical mis haps is just weakness leaving the motorcycle....

[codgyoleracer]

On whos Dyno

Seriously though... That is darn awesome!
45k US though....

$45,000 US$, sounds cheap for an F3 bike to me.