NZSBK 2014 dates

[nodrog:Me]

Thats exactly the sort of comment that shows that you just DON'T GET IT Rape jokes are not OK, taking the piss out of assaulting women is NOT OK - You are part of the problem.

Calm down, lets not turn this rape into a murder.

[Robert Taylor]

Not that clever though Rob,He hasn't yet worked out that his selfserving opinion doesn't come into the equation when we are organising the sport.

Thats a bit rough Billy, I was trying to in the smallest possible way keep the thread on topic. I reject your charge of being self serving. I was speaking on behalf of all the employers, wives and families who are widows to this national disease of sports leisure activities encroaching further into working weeks. Think of the loss of productivity.

[RobGassit]

Not that clever though Rob,He hasn't yet worked out that his selfserving opinion doesn't come into the equation when we are organising the sport.

By selfserving,,,, do you mean he is touching himself?

[Kickaha]

Fuck the nationals are going to be awesome this year!

How the fuck will you ever know, you're not even doing them

You should come down and be my bitch at SI rounds, you be used to it from being Tina's

[wharfy]

Calm down, lets not turn this rape into a murder.

Sadly thats how a lot of them end...

[nodrog:Me]

How the fuck will you ever know, you're not even doing them

You should come down and be my bitch at SI rounds, you be used to it from being Tina's

I don't have a sidecar that is eligible.

haven't you got Kai to hold your ball bag?

[Kickaha]

I don't have a sidecar that is eligible.

haven't you got Kai to hold your ball bag?

Agip bike is up for grabs, Kai would probably let you ride it without sucking his cock

Kai doesn't have big enough hands or time as he is now racing

[wharfy]

As a WASP ( white anglo saxon protestant ) of male gender and tory preferences I will sum it up in one sentence for you.

Helen Clark single handedly wrecked the chances of women for many years to come as many of us never want a close rerun of her ever again.



It is debatable that given she shaves twice a day that she is in fact a she....

But its not women ( or Billys ridiculous 4 day meeting ) that we have to fear most. Its this whole essentially racist Maori soverignty thing and all the fatcat lawyers feeding off it. Im ashamed to say that the National party should have stuck firmly to Don Brash's decree of getting rid of all racist based seats in parliament

I'd be interested in debating the policies of Labour/Green/National and the merits (or not) of various politicians but you can't seem to get past your issues with women who don't fit your view of how women should look and act.

You should also probably do a bit of research into the Treaty and it's history - Not just accept the "sound bites" from the essentially racist media and government.
It may not be important to you but it sure is to me - I am a second generation New Zealander (my grandparents are from Durham and Fife respectivly) I no longer have the option of living in the UK (nor want to really) New Zealand is my home - BUT I am only entitled to live here by virtue of the Treaty of Waitangi and am constantly embarrased that the crown has failed to live up to it's side of it, I thought you would have some sympathy for people who have been "screwed over" despite having a legal contract (and a moral "right") to fair treatment .
The Treaty gives me a (and my decendants) a "Turangawaewae" - "A place to Stand"

Get hold of a copy of "The Penguin History of New Zealand" by Michael King - Very readable and be just the thing for the next time you are stuck in a motel at some race meeting.

The "treaty Industry" is a term invented by people who have no understanding (and no willingness to learn) about the issues that the indigenus people of New Zealand (or any other colonised country) have had to face and are still facing - See the documentry "Operation 8" about the raid by the anti-terror police in the Urewera
I'm not expecting to change your mind about Politics - but debaing with people who already agree with you is no fun However I do hope I can get you to see some of the injustice perpetrated on Women and Maori in New Zealand and not be to quick to judge people who do not fit with your world view.

[SWERVE]

I have been reading this thread.............. even though some of the words are beyond me and you are both WAY above my knowledge of politics or the written word
But as I am 1/2 way thorough a bottle of Sav......... and feeling brave I will comment
Maggie was the best thing that has happened to UK since Enoch Powell
Helen Clark is a man
Wharfy I commend you on your defence of women............. totally agree
But as for indigionous people (prob spelt it wrong) This phrase comes to mind " help those who help themselves" lets be grateful we don't live in SA
As you were gentlemen.................

[steveyb]

Wharfy I commend you on your defence of women............. totally agree
But as for indigionous people (prob spelt it wrong) This phrase comes to mind " help those who help themselves" lets be grateful we don't live in SA

As Wharfy quite clearly pointed out, those that the phrase above seem to be aimed at are doing just that.
As he also points out, debating with those that agree with you is no fun. Debating with those that know little about, nor care to find out about, the actual issue that is being debated is depressing.

When the Crown of the time in NZ decided to enter into a legal contract with the occupiers of the land at the time (1840's) both sides did so with an understanding (admittedly maybe not the clearest that could have ever been) of what the contract entailed. They did so for many reasons, but the main ones being that they recognised the value in partnership with the occupiers of the time and the folly that would be conquest, having just subdued peoples in other lands and expensive campaigns in Europe. Indeed, at the time of claiming Aotearoa/NZ the British did not actually want to, they were over stretched, and only did so to stop the French doing so.

Anyway, the Treaty meant, among other things, that lands could only be divested of and acquired through the Crown with the consent of both parties. When the Crown decided to acquire lands without the consent of the occupying party (i.e. confiscation), they were effectively breaking their own law. But of course, that didn't matter because they were the Crown and could do what they wanted, or so they believed.

Back to today, those peoples whose lands were confiscated in this manner are now applying to the Crown for redress, using the process that the Crown has established, because the Crown recognises the errors that were made in the past and seeks to make this redress.
So, these peoples actually are helping themselves out by using a politically neutral legal channel to seek redress, rather than a politically fueled process that one might see in other countries, lets say, oh, like Syria.

Of course, if a process is established, there will always be those who seek vexatious litigation; black, white, pink, purple whoever; those people will always exist, so the process must never be judged on the basis of those cases. However, the vast majority of cases bought before this process are being demonstrated to be just and fair and are leading to an improvement in the well being of those whose grievances are heard and redressed. It must be recognised also I believe, that Maori have a different philosophical and emotional relationship with the land than do Anglo-Saxons and others. This informs their behaviours towards the land quite differently than others. Make no mistake that they seek to take economic advantage from the land, but the understanding that it is not the commodity that the Anglo-saxon believes it to be makes the relationship quite different. For those that don't now I am Maori/English (my mum is a 2nd gen Kiwi) and I don't own any property at all. I think that I have this odd feeling towards the land that I think the kaumatua talk about, that it owns you, not the other way around.

On the other topics: invoking personal invective and tirades against a subjects gender, sex, personal grooming habits brings nothing to a debate on any subject other than to demean the debate and the debater.

I think that it is demonstrably so that one Mr Robert Muldoon, a doyen of Tory politics in NZ, did significantly more damage during his terms to the economy and social fabric of this country than any other politician except perhaps Rodger Douglas. But to invoke that this is so because he was an ugly, fat, bully with a strong little-man syndrome and thought nothing better of bullying his opponents into submission (the only person able to stand up to him was David Lange, now there is chalk and cheese!) bring nothing to the debate and has no place in it.

Equally so, one might assert that dear old Maggie (RIP) was nothing more than a gold digger trying desperately to escape the shackles of her Grantham past and that once she had sneered her millionaire husband, she could with gay abandon forget the working classes from whence she came and set about in comfort, dismantling the structures that kept the UK strong. Yes, there is no doubt that tough decisions needed to be taken, but from a position of financial comfort due in no part to her own labours, she lacked the slightest amount of humanity in taking those decisions and that the same position could have been arrived at with a more humanist approach.

Now, how does that help any debate about gender roles? The former assertion does not, that latter assertion does. One gender biased, one gender neutral.

It requires some mental effort to step aside from ones prejudices to make informed and rational debate.


SHIT, is that the time?? Better get moving......

[Robert Taylor]

I'd be interested in debating the policies of Labour/Green/National and the merits (or not) of various politicians but you can't seem to get past your issues with women who don't fit your view of how women should look and act.

You should also probably do a bit of research into the Treaty and it's history - Not just accept the "sound bites" from the essentially racist media and government.
It may not be important to you but it sure is to me - I am a second generation New Zealander (my grandparents are from Durham and Fife respectivly) I no longer have the option of living in the UK (nor want to really) New Zealand is my home - BUT I am only entitled to live here by virtue of the Treaty of Waitangi and am constantly embarrased that the crown has failed to live up to it's side of it, I thought you would have some sympathy for people who have been "screwed over" despite having a legal contract (and a moral "right") to fair treatment .
The Treaty gives me a (and my decendants) a "Turangawaewae" - "A place to Stand"

Get hold of a copy of "The Penguin History of New Zealand" by Michael King - Very readable and be just the thing for the next time you are stuck in a motel at some race meeting.

The "treaty Industry" is a term invented by people who have no understanding (and no willingness to learn) about the issues that the indigenus people of New Zealand (or any other colonised country) have had to face and are still facing - See the documentry "Operation 8" about the raid by the anti-terror police in the Urewera
I'm not expecting to change your mind about Politics - but debaing with people who already agree with you is no fun However I do hope I can get you to see some of the injustice perpetrated on Women and Maori in New Zealand and not be to quick to judge people who do not fit with your world view.

I also have set views of how men should look and act Wharfy! There is also no place for racism in NZ, from any quarter.

My view of the Greens is not so far from reality, they want cradle to the grave welfare but at the same time want to shut down all means of funding it. And Russell Norman is a prize idiot. Heaven help us if a Labour / Green coaltion wins power. Swerve is right, Maggie and Enoch are all time greats as far as politicians are concerned, they had courage and conviction. John Key could do with a bit of that by haviing the courage to enact real change rather than ''steady as she goes''.

But back to what this thread was about, NZSBK dates 2014. With all due respect to the otherwise stellar work that Billy is doing I steadfastly maintain that he crossed a line that should never have been crossed by extending the Manfield round into a working week

[Robert Taylor]

As Wharfy quite clearly pointed out, those that the phrase above seem to be aimed at are doing just that.
As he also points out, debating with those that agree with you is no fun. Debating with those that know little about, nor care to find out about, the actual issue that is being debated is depressing.

When the Crown of the time in NZ decided to enter into a legal contract with the occupiers of the land at the time (1840's) both sides did so with an understanding (admittedly maybe not the clearest that could have ever been) of what the contract entailed. They did so for many reasons, but the main ones being that they recognised the value in partnership with the occupiers of the time and the folly that would be conquest, having just subdued peoples in other lands and expensive campaigns in Europe. Indeed, at the time of claiming Aotearoa/NZ the British did not actually want to, they were over stretched, and only did so to stop the French doing so.

Anyway, the Treaty meant, among other things, that lands could only be divested of and acquired through the Crown with the consent of both parties. When the Crown decided to acquire lands without the consent of the occupying party (i.e. confiscation), they were effectively breaking their own law. But of course, that didn't matter because they were the Crown and could do what they wanted, or so they believed.

Back to today, those peoples whose lands were confiscated in this manner are now applying to the Crown for redress, using the process that the Crown has established, because the Crown recognises the errors that were made in the past and seeks to make this redress.
So, these peoples actually are helping themselves out by using a politically neutral legal channel to seek redress, rather than a politically fueled process that one might see in other countries, lets say, oh, like Syria.

Of course, if a process is established, there will always be those who seek vexatious litigation; black, white, pink, purple whoever; those people will always exist, so the process must never be judged on the basis of those cases. However, the vast majority of cases bought before this process are being demonstrated to be just and fair and are leading to an improvement in the well being of those whose grievances are heard and redressed. It must be recognised also I believe, that Maori have a different philosophical and emotional relationship with the land than do Anglo-Saxons and others. This informs their behaviours towards the land quite differently than others. Make no mistake that they seek to take economic advantage from the land, but the understanding that it is not the commodity that the Anglo-saxon believes it to be makes the relationship quite different. For those that don't now I am Maori/English (my mum is a 2nd gen Kiwi) and I don't own any property at all. I think that I have this odd feeling towards the land that I think the kaumatua talk about, that it owns you, not the other way around.

On the other topics: invoking personal invective and tirades against a subjects gender, sex, personal grooming habits brings nothing to a debate on any subject other than to demean the debate and the debater.

I think that it is demonstrably so that one Mr Robert Muldoon, a doyen of Tory politics in NZ, did significantly more damage during his terms to the economy and social fabric of this country than any other politician except perhaps Rodger Douglas. But to invoke that this is so because he was an ugly, fat, bully with a strong little-man syndrome and thought nothing better of bullying his opponents into submission (the only person able to stand up to him was David Lange, now there is chalk and cheese!) bring nothing to the debate and has no place in it.

Equally so, one might assert that dear old Maggie (RIP) was nothing more than a gold digger trying desperately to escape the shackles of her Grantham past and that once she had sneered her millionaire husband, she could with gay abandon forget the working classes from whence she came and set about in comfort, dismantling the structures that kept the UK strong. Yes, there is no doubt that tough decisions needed to be taken, but from a position of financial comfort due in no part to her own labours, she lacked the slightest amount of humanity in taking those decisions and that the same position could have been arrived at with a more humanist approach.

Now, how does that help any debate about gender roles? The former assertion does not, that latter assertion does. One gender biased, one gender neutral.

It requires some mental effort to step aside from ones prejudices to make informed and rational debate.


SHIT, is that the time?? Better get moving......

Steve, why not extend the debate to the peoples that the Maori invaders ate? Where is their compensation? As I understand it the Maoris settled in NZ by conquest and it is an ultimate arrogance for them to claim that they were here first.

Women in politics is a good thing, take the current examples of Paula Bennett and the immediate past minister of police, Judith Collins. Also Jacinda Ardern, I dont agree with much of what she has to say but she has the courage of her convictions .

[codgyoleracer]

But back to what this thread was about, NZSBK dates 2014. With all due respect to the otherwise stellar work that Billy is doing I steadfastly maintain that he crossed a line that should never have been crossed by extending the Manfield round into a working week

What a load of Hogwash, so less weekends away overall, Less potential cost, More racing - But wait a minute we all have to take one extra day off for one round........and thats only if you want to do the practice day.

Bitchin for bitching sake in my mind.

Oh and i forgot, its not even a day off for you Rob, you ARE MEANT TO BE working anyway. Given that you were always gonna be there on the Saturday / Sunday anyway ?



Now - getting back to the thread proper - whos gonna win what ?

[jellywrestler]

to bashing and raping drunk chicks.

they've set up a website to help with awareness of this problem and got 100 hits in the first hour!

[jellywrestler]

But as I am 1/2 way thorough a bottle of Sav.........



But as for indigionous people (prob spelt it wrong)

I've told you before you Pommy import, in New Zealand we DON'T DRINK AND SPELL. It's 1/2 way through a bottle...


You're obviously aware that there is a risk DRINKING AND SPELLING by your second statement and yes it's spelt wrong (sic) correct spelling is- the mud people.