Govt 'covering up' school funding plan

[mashman]

Why shouldn't schools be treated like a business? After all they should be providing a service to the parents in educating their children. If all the parents are so blind that they perceive that the schools performance is in the test and exam results of their children then that's how schools will be measured. I would have loved to have a choice between educational establishments and opt my children into specialist classes and educate them within the family and extended community for other things. Sadly the state system is a one size fits all "you will do as we say because we know best" that seems to consider the skills of children belong to the government for future economic development through a trained workforce.

Wouldn't it be radical if all parents were given "education cash" to spend at schools purchasing the services and the teacher support they wanted for their children. I'm not talking about just having the money following the school roll, but being able to purchase lessons or courses at different establishments. The good teachers will have "full" classes, a good working environment, and good pay. The poor ones will have to improve or suffer.

Unfortunately we have been indoctrinated over generations that the current school systems are the best way to educate children, I don't believe they are. Many children endure and survive the system, many vote with their feet and truant on a daily basis, a minority are left damaged and destroyed by an education system where they don't fit.

Kids as commodities eh, what a lovely thought. I'm assuming that the money you get to select these services with will be removed from ones tax bill so that those who can't afford to send their kids to the smart schools are rightfully disadvantaged?

I agree that there could be better ways to "tailor" learning for kids, but I don't agree that a business model should be applied.

[mashman]

I am reminded of the scene in Ali G - In Da House about this - where it cuts to a scene where a teacher is doing a maths problem involving Weed.....

and I agree on your last point - Parents who aren't active in their childs education probably shouldn't be parents.....

If it works it works.

I assume that you're willing to pay for the social services that go along with that wonder policy of giving "absentee" parents the learn, along with the likely social fallout?

[TheDemonLord]

If it works it works.

I assume that you're willing to pay for the social services that go along with that wonder policy of giving "absentee" parents the learn, along with the likely social fallout?

Don't we already?

[mashman]

Don't we already?

Yup... and you want to add to that? Achually I've changed my mind, bring it on as the major bitching sessions it will bring to KB will be epic.

[TheDemonLord]

Yup... and you want to add to that? Achually I've changed my mind, bring it on as the major bitching sessions it will bring to KB will be epic.

So then it comes down to which is the lesser of 2 evils:

a small number of heavily dependant on social services but with a (in theory) better educated populace
or
a larger number of lesser dependant on social services and the current level of educated populace

[mashman]

So then it comes down to which is the lesser of 2 evils:

a small number of heavily dependant on social services but with a (in theory) better educated populace
or
a larger number of lesser dependant on social services and the current level of educated populace

Only 2? Don't stretch yourself or anything. The two options you offer are both absolutely shite anyway. I'll take the one with the worst social consequences please.

I see no real difference between your 2, , choices. The kid will turn out to be the adult.

[Akzle]

Should change MP pays to performance based... i.e. stop paying them!

scooby doobie, you forget, the remuneration authority is independent (tui), politicians have no say in it! They couldnt possibly reject the recomended pay rises....

[mansell]

If it works it works.

I assume that you're willing to pay for the social services that go along with that wonder policy of giving "absentee" parents the learn, along with the likely social fallout?

The problem is it doesn't work - schools do not fit any business model - and should not, they're there to educate not to make money. The idiots in control (Donkey and his mates) seem heel bent on destroying a perfectly good education system rather than making it better.

[mashman]

The problem is it doesn't work - schools do not fit any business model - and should not, they're there to educate not to make money. The idiots in control (Donkey and his mates) seem heel bent on destroying a perfectly good education system rather than making it better.

I don't disagree in the slightest. It seems as though our politicians, businesses and way too many adults for my liking miss what school is actually for.

[TheDemonLord]

Only 2? Don't stretch yourself or anything. The two options you offer are both absolutely shite anyway. I'll take the one with the worst social consequences please.

I see no real difference between your 2, , choices. The kid will turn out to be the adult.

That was the point - every social choose has good and bad consequences and usually the difference is one that is slightly less shit but less effective, vs one that is slightly more shit and more effective.

I'd take the one that results in a better education for greater population - whatever that choice might in fact be

[avgas]

Should change MP pays to performance based... i.e. stop paying them!

I like the concept of performance based pay. And you're right we should stop paying them. But this is what I have said all along. Voting for politicians is like picking a treadmill speed. No matter who you pick - you working for someone else to do nothing and go nowhere.
Even unemployed have more ambition.

[avgas]

Dumb kids with an average IQ but no interest in Maths or Science because they want to be a Gang Member?

Michelle Pfeiffer would sort them out.

[mashman]

That was the point - every social choose has good and bad consequences and usually the difference is one that is slightly less shit but less effective, vs one that is slightly more shit and more effective.

I'd take the one that results in a better education for greater population - whatever that choice might in fact be

Why didn't you say that in the first place? You carry on thinking that way if you like.

In which case you'll vote for NOW or indeed the Money Free Party - NZ then. They are the best choices, by far, if you want better education (among many other things).

[TheDemonLord]

Why didn't you say that in the first place? You carry on thinking that way if you like.

In which case you'll vote for NOW or indeed the Money Free Party - NZ then. They are the best choices, by far, if you want better education (among many other things).

Oh come now - we have both waltzed down that arguement before - and it ended with both those systems are premature and not fully formed yet (IMHO)

[mashman]

Oh come now - we have both waltzed down that arguement before - and it ended with both those systems are premature and not fully formed yet (IMHO)

The stumbling blocks you put in the path are your own. It's formed fine enough, but it doesn't have all of the answer to all of your questions and it likely never will.

The irony in your statement is that the current system keeps being added to or removed from... in other words, premature and not fully formed yet.

Your choice though.