Stupid World

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 13:44

The only stupid thing about this one, is apparently kids getting taught the value of working is now newsworthy...

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/mone...-for-the-money

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 15:35

Originally Posted by bogan

The only stupid thing about this one, is apparently kids getting taught the value of working is now newsworthy...

http://www.stuff.co.nz/business/mone...-for-the-money

Nah, teaching them that that get anything at all for doing something is pretty fuckin stupid in the first place as they then go on to expect to be rewarded when they've done something. Tis how entitlement complexes are born, classic pavlovian response. Indoctrinate your kids at your own peril, coz you're turning them into future ignorant cunts. But that's just another way to look at it.

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 15:41

Originally Posted by mashman

Nah, teaching them that that get anything at all for doing something is pretty fuckin stupid in the first place as they then go on to expect to be rewarded when they've done something. Tis how entitlement complexes are born, classic pavlovian response. Indoctrinate your kids at your own peril, coz you're turning them into future ignorant cunts. But that's just another way to look at it.

Um, entitlement complexes are when people feel entitled to something they have not earned; teaching them you are entitled only to what you have earned is a pretty good way to minimise those I would have though

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 15:55

Originally Posted by bogan

Um, entitlement complexes are when people feel entitled to something they have not earned; teaching them you are entitled only to what you have earned is a pretty good way to minimise those I would have though

If that's what you have been taught? I rest my case. Because an entitlement complex to me is exactly what you have displayed. I did X therefore I am entitled to Y. If I say that you didn't deserve something, you will claim that you are entitled to it and justify that entitlement. I call what you call an entitlement complex as wanting stuff.

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 16:06

Originally Posted by mashman

If that's what you have been taught? I rest my case. Because an entitlement complex to me is exactly what you have displayed. I did X therefore I am entitled to Y. If I say that you didn't deserve something, you will claim that you are entitled to it and justify that entitlement. I call what you call an entitlement complex as wanting stuff.

Nope, there is a difference between wanting stuff and believing you are entitled to it without doing anything to earn it. Those who want stuff but do not have an entitlement complex, will go and earn it. Those who feel entitled to something, will not see any need to go an earn it. That is the distinction you are missing.

What is wrong with somebody saying, I did this work now I expect to be paid? Bet you'd be fucking angry if your boss decided not to pay you one week and said you had an entitlement complex for even asking to be.

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 16:29

Originally Posted by bogan

Nope, there is a difference between wanting stuff and believing you are entitled to it without doing anything to earn it. Those who want stuff but do not have an entitlement complex, will go and earn it. Those who feel entitled to something, will not see any need to go an earn it. That is the distinction you are missing.

What is wrong with somebody saying, I did this work now I expect to be paid? Bet you'd be fucking angry if your boss decided not to pay you one week and said you had an entitlement complex for even asking to be.

You're entitled to your opinion.

That's exactly what the govt do when they remove benefits. Hardly surprising they get angry, yet for some reason they have an entitlement complex.

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 17:07

Originally Posted by mashman

That's exactly what the govt do when they remove benefits. Hardly surprising they get angry, yet for some reason they have an entitlement complex.

Except for benefits there is no earning part of the process, that is why the term entitlement complex is used.

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 17:19

Originally Posted by bogan

Except for benefits there is no earning part of the process, that is why the term entitlement complex is used.

Isn't there? I'm sure there'll be a few hundred thousand beneficiaries who would disagree with you, but meh. It still isn't an entitlement complex. That's called support.

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 17:29

Originally Posted by mashman

Isn't there? I'm sure there'll be a few hundred thousand beneficiaries who would disagree with you, but meh. It still isn't an entitlement complex. That's called support.

Earning and support are generally exclusive terms when used in a financial context, so no, they are not earning it; and for those who would disagree, that is the working definition of an entitlement complex, feeling they should be given what society thinks they have not earned (this is not to say they do not deserve it of course).

Also, there's no explicit contract. Of the three situations
1) children getting paid to do jobs
2) you getting paid for your job
3) beneficiaries getting paid for being in NZ
The first two have a prior contract the individual can accept or decline, and that only by fulfilling that contract will they get paid; the same does not apply to the latter . So if any of them is applicable for the term entitlement complex, it is also the latter and not the kids as you said before. Since the kids are just getting kiddy version of grown up contracts, it is a good thing for them to learn.

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 17:40

Originally Posted by bogan

Earning and support are generally exclusive terms when used in a financial context, so no, they are not earning it; and for those who would disagree, that is the working definition of an entitlement complex, feeling they should be given what society thinks they have not earned (this is not to say they do not deserve it of course).

Also, there's no explicit contract. Of the three situations
1) children getting paid to do jobs
2) you getting paid for your job
3) beneficiaries getting paid for being in NZ
The first two have a prior contract the individual can accept or decline, and that only by fulfilling that contract will they get paid; the same does not apply to the latter . So if any of them is applicable for the term entitlement complex, it is also the latter and not the kids as you said before. Since the kids are just getting kiddy version of grown up contracts, it is a good thing for them to learn.

Did I say they were earning it? Try the past tense of earn. The working definition is fuckin stupid for the fuckin stupid.

It applies to both adults and kids. Simply, again, I have done therefore I should get. Teaching that shit as the norm ain't what I would call sound teaching, more opening a can of worms that you have no ability to close without being seen as a hypocrite. Something no adult, apart from me, is willing to face up to and own

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 17:48

Originally Posted by mashman

Did I say they were earning it? Try the past tense of earn. The working definition is fuckin stupid for the fuckin stupid.

It applies to both adults and kids. Simply, again, I have done therefore I should get. Teaching that shit as the norm ain't what I would call sound teaching, more opening a can of worms that you have no ability to close without being seen as a hypocrite. Something no adult, apart from me, is willing to face up to and own

Actually you were questioning my wording, which was 'earning', present tense. Don't be mad mashy, life is what you make of it, so calm down and enjoy it a bit.

That is not it at all, it is if you do this, you will get this; so one does the thing and gets the thing. That is not an entitlement complex, that is just teaching a two party contract for mutual benefit; ie, how the world works.

**Ocean1** · 20th March 2014, 17:58

Originally Posted by bogan

Actually you were questioning my wording, which was 'earning', present tense. Don't be mad mashy, life is what you make of it, so calm down and enjoy it a bit.

That is not it at all, it is if you do this, you will get this; so one does the thing and gets the thing. That is not an entitlement complex, that is just teaching a two party contract for mutual benefit; ie, how the world works.

Stop it, you're annoying the pig.

**mashman** · 20th March 2014, 18:11

Originally Posted by bogan

Actually you were questioning my wording, which was 'earning', present tense. Don't be mad mashy, life is what you make of it, so calm down and enjoy it a bit.

That is not it at all, it is if you do this, you will get this; so one does the thing and gets the thing. That is not an entitlement complex, that is just teaching a two party contract for mutual benefit; ie, how the world works.

No I wasn't... but as it's you I'll explain. You said there was no earning in the process which ruled out there having been anything earned. I dare say the majority of beneficiaries have worked/contributed in their life. I'm not mad, well, not in the emotional sense anyway... shame not everyone gets the option of making what they want of their lives for one reason or another, and no, I don't land that squarely at their door. I'd love to calm down and enjoy it, but I'm such a miserable whiney cunt I just don't have it in me.

Aha, and there are many people who do without getting and there are those who do without expecting to get in this world too. You may have met a few without knowing, they're called people... you may have indulged in those types of contracts yourself. Mutual benefit is not a requirement, neither is reward... unless of course you educate people that that behaviour is the norm, which is silly.

**bogan** · 20th March 2014, 18:19

Originally Posted by mashman

No I wasn't... but as it's you I'll explain. You said there was no earning in the process which ruled out there having been anything earned. I dare say the majority of beneficiaries have worked/contributed in their life. I'm not mad, well, not in the emotional sense anyway... shame not everyone gets the option of making what they want of their lives for one reason or another, and no, I don't land that squarely at their door. I'd love to calm down and enjoy it, but I'm such a miserable whiney cunt I just don't have it in me.

Aha, and there are many people who do without getting and there are those who do without expecting to get in this world too. You may have met a few without knowing, they're called people... you may have indulged in those types of contracts yourself. Mutual benefit is not a requirement, neither is reward... unless of course you educate people that that behaviour is the norm, which is silly.

What in the actual fuck are you going on about now? Jesus christ you talk some shit in the interest of scoring points against money and anything it relates too. Honestly, and take this how you like, the stupidity in your arguments has made me less inclined to maintain an open mind towards moneyless utopian societies. If you goal here is actually to promote such, you should rethink how you do it because you're achieving the exact opposite.