Deaths

[Hitcher]

Don't be a twat....its a genuine issue, putting it out there for discussion is better than being ignorant to the facts ?

It's an issue that has been done to death, pun unintentional, on this forum, like "waving" threads, or asking for suggestions for bike insurance.

[swbarnett]

Do you think more accidents are caused as a result of the bikers own fault as I thought it was more due to not being seen by cars etc? If its more the bikers fault is it mid life crisis (returning) bikers? If so maybe a CC limit could be of benefit like learner riders.

ACC's own figures show it's not BABs. Even thought they claim otherwise anyone with a rudimentary mathematical ability can see that they've doctored the figures by making the age ranges inconsistent.

[James Deuce]

Do you think more accidents are caused as a result of the bikers own fault as I thought it was more due to not being seen by cars etc? If its more the bikers fault is it mid life crisis (returning) bikers? If so maybe a CC limit could be of benefit like learner riders.

Born again bikers are a myth of the media's invention. It's convenient to blame a long break for a lack of skill, when the reality is that a lot of people had nosappreciable skill in riding motorcycles in traffic to begin with and blatantly and aggressively refuse to develop any skill. How long and how slowly you've ridden a bike does not equal motorcycling genius.

Most motorcycle accidents, more than 50%, are single vehicle accidents where the rider "lost control" on a bend with no other vehicle involved.

[James Deuce]

So you don't like the idea of paying lower reg for having fewer claims? That is already happening as far as car drivers go? Their logic is flawed as far as making diesel vehicles pay the same as a larger road bike though as I would have thought on average they would be safer than cars as they are mostly 4wds.

You don't understand the Woodhouse principle on which ACC is based or the media distortion of how compensation schemes work or how successive Governments, both Labour and National party-led, have rooted the best accident compensation and rehabilitation scheme ever instigated in the world, ever.

So shut up.

[Crasherfromwayback]

Born again bikers are a myth of the media's invention. .

Not sure I can agree with that. "I used to road race GS750's back in the day mate!!!". Yep...all 80hp of them. Get on a GSXR1000 and pull the pin some 35 years later...and uuuuhhh ooohhh. Or get old and weak and try to wrestle a heavy Harley when you've got into the corner a bit hot. I've lost more older customers than younger ones for a few years now.

[mashman]

I guess your heart's in the right place but you can't really draw any conclusions from those numbers without the details surrounding each death.

Yes you can. Something went wrong and someone died. Try not to let it happen to you. All of the best intentions in the world won't stop deaths from happening in however many numbers of ways as there are to die whilst riding. The rest is politics.

[Ocean1]

I've lost more older customers than younger ones for a few years now.

Be fair mate, all of your customers are fucking ancient.

Yes you can.

Well you can. But you can draw any conclusion you want from the colour of your navel lint.

Everyone else needs numbers.

Well, you and this dipshit:

Perhaps he is a midlife crisis biker himself and just refuses to believe a riding gap of between 20 to 30 years is any wider than taking a ride the next day and that technology does not change over time. Maybe he also thinks the media is lying when they state the age mostly over 40 of riders who come to grief today.

Take Jim's advice and stfu before you...

No, far too late.

[DamianW]

I'm really encouraged by the Auckland Transport 'Urban Commuter' and ACC subsidised 'Ride Forever' rider skills courses through Pro-rider. Not only are most of the tuition fees covered, Star Insurance waive 50% off your policy excess for the first year if you've completed a RF course - taking these courses are IMO a no brainer. Chuck in a day or two at Cali' Superbike school at Taupo or Hampton Downs then you're gonna be better off for it.

Just my 0.02c.

[george formby]

Not sure I can agree with that. "I used to road race GS750's back in the day mate!!!". Yep...all 80hp of them. Get on a GSXR1000 and pull the pin some 35 years later...and uuuuhhh ooohhh. Or get old and weak and try to wrestle a heavy Harley when you've got into the corner a bit hot. I've lost more older customers than younger ones for a few years now.

Both here & back in the Uk it seems the older recreational riders get, the more habitual they become and the better they think they can ride.
Increases the odds for an off.
Across the board of bikes & riders I regularly see terrible road craft. Two groups stick out, catalogue riders on the latest & greatest & packs of cruiser riders. Is the white line magnetic?

Any hoo.
One of my favourite sayings is that statistics are used the way a drunken man uses a lamp post, for support not illumination.
Until this changes & the most at risk groups are identified & targeted to become safer then we will remain nothing more than media fodder & revenue targets.
It's anathema for bikers to be pigeon holed, we all ride like gods. Apparently. But as long as that attitude exists & TPTB don't give a shit then it's just going to become more expensive & frustrating to ride a bike.

[tigertim20]

Exactly the same.

But this thread isn't about the individual rider. It's about the fact that more riders have died on the roads so far this year as compared to last year. There is no doubt that this is true. What I'm saying is that this may have little relevance to how we're riding as a group. It might have relevance, we can't know without the context in which the sample was taken.

the 'year to date' means fuckall. the 'past 12 months' is a better gauge.
this link http://www.nzta.govt.nz/resources/road-deaths/toll.html says that the past 12 month to 28/3/14 had less motorcycle deaths than the same period the year previously.
So really your underlined comment means diddly squat

I wonder if their ACC levies will go up .. ??

truck companies pay a variable amount based on a number of variables, like safety / crash records of all company vehicles combined, I have a feelin they even get charged more if any of their vehicles fail COF inspections an require work - but my mind is fading on the details so I may be wrong on that

[James Deuce]

Not sure I can agree with that. "I used to road race GS750's back in the day mate!!!". Yep...all 80hp of them. Get on a GSXR1000 and pull the pin some 35 years later...and uuuuhhh ooohhh. Or get old and weak and try to wrestle a heavy Harley when you've got into the corner a bit hot. I've lost more older customers than younger ones for a few years now.

That's just a reflection of the current demographic bulge in motorcycling. The push by Honda and to a lesser extent Yamaha (thankfully focusing on fun AND fuel economy) to get back to its economic basis of cheap transport will drive the average age down over the next 20 years, however a lot of the people I started riding bikes with, still are, with little or no appreciable gaps in owning or riding motorcycles. The ones who've died have been cocky or distracted in some major fashion, either directly at the point of impact or by divorces, dead kids, dead parents, mortgagee sales, thinning hair, erectile dysfunction and so on. A lot of the BAB phenomenon is blamed on people who've started riding bikes in their 40s, not returned to the fray. They were in no way involved in a fray during their past. They don't tend to crash anywhere as much as people who started in their teens either, so trying to lump 39-65 into an age group is ignoring some massive social changes that reflect on who rides and owns motorcycles.

[FJRider]

I have a feelin they even get charged more if any of their vehicles fail COF inspections an require work - but my mind is fading on the details so I may be wrong on that

You're not wrong ... and fail more than once and can be "Flagged" for a roadside stop/check anytime by the "God Squad" ...

[TheDemonLord]

If domestic and financial issues are causes for biker deaths surely there would be the same proportion dying in car crashes for the same reasons.

Except if someone crashes an Audi or BMW at 120 kph they have a better chance of not dieing than the biker.

[FJRider]

If domestic and financial issues are causes for biker deaths surely there would be the same proportion dying in car crashes for the same reasons.

Maybe there is ...

Have you looked at the accident reports to see .. ??? or have you more important things to concern yourself with .... ??

[SPman]

Statistical blip. There've been 7 bike deaths in the last fortnight over here - horrible, but as long as it doesn't carry on at that rate....which it won't....