The cost of 'safe' drugs?

[Swoop]

I know we need to have drugs for various reasons but the testing of animals to get these drugs ok'd sickens me.
Dont know if there is an alternative, I certainly wish there was.

There is an alternative. It should be the humans that develop the shit and most importantly it should be the large pharmaceutical companies who pedal their concoctions.
All the chemicals that go into this "wonderful" product would quickly be eliminated if their CEO's were FORCED to take the product.

[Akzle]

if their CEO's were FORCED to take the product.

[Ulsterkiwi]

There certainly are testing methods that don't require animals. Computer modelling and advances in 'in vitro' testing have made animal testing unnecessary these days. These non-animal testing methods produce far more accurate results as well.

The only draw back is they are more expensive than testing on animals but in the case of legal highs that shouldn't be of any concern to the general public. The manufacturers of these products are who will be incurring the cost and the government should be making it as difficult as they can for the manufacturers to get their products back on shop shelves.

By giving access to testing on animals the government is simply making life easier for the manufacturers.

I didn't realise you were a biomedical scientist. What are the advances made with 'in vitro' testing you talk about? Since when did computer modelling produce more accurate results? How do you define 'accurate' I would be fascinated to read the scientific papers you obtained this information from.
I didnt realise that running a piece of software was more expensive than building, maintaining and staffing an animal research facility, much less breed the necessary animals and care for them in the specified manner.

Here is one way to think about the testing of new pharmaceuticals (NOT legal highs or cosmetics, I couldnt care less about them). Your mother has a form of cancer. The consultant comes in and explains there has been a new drug developed which might work. In laboratory tests the drug has been shown to kill cell cultures of cancer cells (in vitro testing) However there have been no tests conducted in a complex environment where the drug has to find its way to the targeted cells via a circulatory system, digestive system or respiratory system all controlled by complex neuro-endocrine mechanisms (in vivo testing). So we really dont know if it will screw one of those up and actually make things worse for your mother. But hey no mice or rats were harmed so its all good don't ya think?

[Lower]

not to sound edgy but who cares? I base nearly every meal around meat. Don't think twice about the 'farm' animals that are sacrificed for me. I eat eggs from caged chickens because I'm not paying twice the price for free range.

People see a puppy and hear the word 'legal highs' and they go up in arms. just because an animal is a fluffy doesn't mean it should be treated like a domestic pet goddess.

And we put down dogs all the time? let the little things enjoy a nice chemical high before they turn to dust.

The thing everyone should be discussing is how retarded our government is when there is a 'synthetic' cannabis that is worse than the real stuff and we're giving vegans heart attacks from worrying about puppies.

[Katman]

not to sound edgy but who cares? I base nearly every meal around meat. Don't think twice about the 'farm' animals that are sacrificed for me. I eat eggs from caged chickens because I'm not paying twice the price for free range.

People see a puppy and hear the word 'legal highs' and they go up in arms. just because an animal is a fluffy doesn't mean it should be treated like a domestic pet goddess.

And we put down dogs all the time? let the little things enjoy a nice chemical high before they turn to dust.

The thing everyone should be discussing is how retarded our government is when there is a 'synthetic' cannabis that is worse than the real stuff and we're giving vegans heart attacks from worrying about puppies.

You should take their place.

[Akzle]

But hey no mice or rats were harmed so its all good don't ya think?

who the fuck are you to judge, jesus?

[Akzle]

not to sound edgy but who cares? I base nearly every meal around meat. Don't think twice about the 'farm' animals that are sacrificed for me. I eat eggs from caged chickens because I'm not paying twice the price for free range.

you don't sound edgy. you sound like a consumeristic cunt. you're probably everything that's wrong with crackerjew society.
if you wouldn't kill it, you shouldn't be eating it.

karma.

[Ulsterkiwi]

who the fuck are you to judge, jesus?

judge? oh the irony of that question coming from you Akzle.........

Nope, I am not Jesus but I am better informed than most concerning what animal testing actually means and does not mean. Katmans assertions were completely erroneus, you would be upset if that wasnt pointed out would you not, great possessor of truth?

[SMOKEU]

you don't sound edgy. you sound like a consumeristic cunt. you're probably everything that's wrong with crackerjew society.
if you wouldn't kill it, you shouldn't be eating it.

karma.

I couldn't have said it better myself.

[Lower]

you don't sound edgy. you sound like a consumeristic cunt. you're probably everything that's wrong with crackerjew society.
if you wouldn't kill it, you shouldn't be eating it.

karma.

oh boy, do you avoid pak n save? do you farm all your own meat? Hope you don't ride your bike to much it might destroy the ozone layer. Hope you joined the vegans protest against the testing with your tin foil hat on, save the furry animals! forget about all the rest of the injustice in the world its dogs that matter!

[Lower]

I couldn't have said it better myself.

you probably could if you put the bong down for once.

Acting like i'm buying into the wrong things when you spend $250 on a ounce of plant matter that should be free

[SMOKEU]

you probably could if you put the bong down for once.

Acting like i'm buying into the wrong things when you spend $250 on a ounce of plant matter that should be free

It's not much different from people who pay $8 for a shot of vodka in a pub, when I can make around 3L of vodka for the same price, and it's just as good.

[Akzle]

judge? oh the irony of that question coming from you Akzle.........

Nope, I am not Jesus but I am better informed than most concerning what animal testing actually means and does not mean. Katmans assertions were completely erroneus, you would be upset if that wasnt pointed out would you not, great possessor of truth?

well, i am the fucking ironing master. and shit.

i dont pay attention to him (sorry katman's ego)
better informed? they test shit on animals for the benefit of humans because they consider them a lesser being. god complex much? it's okay. god haz lulz at them.

the whole argument is fuckeroo because they still allow alcohol to be sold and that costs "the country" *gasp*, what? how much? sorry, i couldn't hear over the sound of THE DEAFENING HYPOCRISY OF YOUR SOCIETY.

[Akzle]

oh boy, do you avoid pak n save? do you farm all your own meat? Hope you don't ride your bike to much it might destroy the ozone layer. Hope you joined the vegans protest against the testing with your tin foil hat on, save the furry animals! forget about all the rest of the injustice in the world its dogs that matter!

i do avoid paknsave (i take my hemp kiti to binn inn. au cuz.) i do not farm all my own meat. i'd like to. i have/would/do kill meat every now and then.
and no, new guy, i don't ride my bike, not at all. sometimes i sit on it and make vroom vroom noises and pretend i'm a big boy, but then i got the internets, so i just jump on and mouth off, so everyone else knows i'm a big boy, too.
no protest. active indifference. your society's problem. good luck.

bet you couldn't so much as skin a rabbit. let alone cook it. fucking poofter.

[awa355]

oh boy, do you avoid pak n save? do you farm all your own meat? Hope you don't ride your bike to much it might destroy the ozone layer. Hope you joined the vegans protest against the testing with your tin foil hat on, save the furry animals! forget about all the rest of the injustice in the world its dogs that matter!

The OP topic wasn't about killing animals for human consumption, or just dogs, or saving the planet. It was about needless suffering of animals to satisfy human vainity ( cosmetic industries ), leisure pleasure ( legal highs ) etc. There has to be an alternative.