The GST con story

[jellywrestler]

It's the 'off the books' income that is hurting NZ. Imagine if the goobermint had tax on another 5 billion of legit sales. Maybe we could have a reduction in tax?????? (Yeah right), but we should at least have better services as a result.......

yeah they'd go out and buy more speed cameras!!!

[jellywrestler]

When the Redshed came to Cambridge a few years ago they squeezed some of the other smaller shops out of business and that's unfortunately what they do.

When it came to Taumaranui sure there were businesses that suffered, but it put a stop to a lot of people going to taupo to do all their shopping, including groceries they then spent all their money in town and some businesses got betterer.
I'll buy local if i can out of principle, but a lot of people only see the coin they saved in cold hard cash, not the bits Scurvy was mentioning and it's probably that we run our own businesses that we see it that way.
Question
Whe's the last time you saw a New Zealand Made Logo? why aren't people proud to put it there, why aren't shops/supermarkets having a special stand with NZ made products, even to the point of showing a pie graph of the retail price of both nz made and imported goods and showing just how much coin goes out of NZ.

[bluninja]

Question
Whe's the last time you saw a New Zealand Made Logo? why aren't people proud to put it there, why aren't shops/supermarkets having a special stand with NZ made products, even to the point of showing a pie graph of the retail price of both nz made and imported goods and showing just how much coin goes out of NZ.

I find NZ quite jingoistic; hey you do know that Mitre10 is new Zealand owned and run? Any product that has any link to NZ is marketed as such ...."designed by NZers",....etc.

Though when you say NZ made what does it mean? If I buy electronic components from China and assemble them into a Desktop PC is it New Zealand made or produced? If I have leather motorcycle gear cut and stitched in Pakistan from NZ leather (yeah I know it's a stretch....pun intended) is it an NZ product?

[Icemaestro]

And why buy products here that the NZ company has just imported from the same person (though paid less shipping due to order size) and then slapped 100% (or more!) markup on? I bought a set of aftermarket mirrors off ebay a couple of weeks ago, same mould stamp from the maker in China as the ones in a shop in nz, but 13$ delivered, as opposed to 60$ for me to drive and pick it up (thats if it was in stock, as their website is usually incorrect).

[avgas]

People importing their own stuff from overseas is fine. People buying local and paying a tiny 15% is fine.
The whole thing is fine. People have successful business, and others are buying stuff cheaper on a smaller scale. Everyone wins. Nothing needs to change.

The only people who are rattling the cage are the ones with an agenda. Or need an excuse.
Think about it.

[Akzle]

i was told today that 'people work really hard for their money' and 'they like the economoney', but then go and buy the cheapest shit they can get at bunnings, made in china and shit, and they're all like, 'waa-waa, i can't afford to buy shit made in nz' and i'm all like 'bitch please' and punch them in the mouf.

We need to stand up and say we're sick of being screwed over multiple times

get real you fucking sheep.

[FJRider]

Notice all the stories in the media recently about how not paying GST on low cost private imports is hurting retailers, they cant compete etc....
Think about the maths for a second, a mere 15% difference in price plus the cost of international shipping and we're only talking about goods under say $400
And most of the time its likely a small purchase of say one or two books or computer game etc so price range $35-$100

Low cost imports (usually) don't attract import duty. GST is only added to Goods and Services bought in New Zealand.

Internet purchases are effectively "Overseas" purchases.

Retailers that import container/ship loads of products will expect to pay the required duty ... no escaping that fact.

If retailers continue to attempt to sell products that can/are bought online cheaper than commercially sold in NZ (in increasing numbers) ... silly them.

[QUOTE=R650R;1130754130]Now lets pause to remember WHY we have GST in the first place. It was because the govt removed or lowered most import taxes and tariffs ages ago and shifted it from the importer/retailer paying the tax to the consumer paying the tax.

Actually it was introduced in the "Rogernomics" economic reforms of the Labour Government in '86 .... to boost the budget after they inherited a very large deficit from the previous Government.

I think whats happening is the stage is being set for a low price sub $400 instant import levy to be paid to compensate and it will be slapped on regardless of goods value,

There are enough conspiricy theories already ... any facts to back up this claim .... ???

We need to stand up and say we're sick of being screwed over multiple times tax wise. All these different things do is disguise how much the govt takes off us. And look at the massive lost producitivty absorbed just by the acco8unting time and costs in administering GST and all the paperwork etc.

If they want to "Claim Back" their GST .... such is life (and they know it) ... if it wasn't worth the effort they wouldn't bother.

The reality is the little mom and pop style store cant compete with modern big business

If you buy in bulk ... you CAN sell cheaper (in bulk numbers). The smaller shops sell with a good profit. Supermarkets don't usually have a big mark up on individual products .. but make the money on sheer bulk numbers of products sold.

If we took GST off goods and increased income tax by 15% to 40% it would be the same but they'd be riots as people realise how much we are taxed...

Increased income tax by 15% is not the same as 15% added to Goods and Services. Not all your income is used for GST attached products ... is it .. ???

[Akzle]

2) Most of these type tradies will be semi retired and not doing a heap of jobs, btw GST does not need to be charged if your turnover is less than 60k a year.

yeah, but then they can't claim back the GST, the coffees, cocaine, the rent, the broadband, the whores, the fuel...

[bogan]

I think whats happening is the stage is being set for a low price sub $400 instant import levy to be paid to compensate and it will be slapped on regardless of goods value, whether its a $35 dollar book or a $300 tyre.
Sounds fair but really its just more consumer dollars sucked up by taxman and less money left to spend at kiwi businesses.

I think Robert may have had an irony implosion when he read that, might be why he hasn't joined in yet.

[avgas]

yeah, but then they can't claim back the GST, the coffees, cocaine, the rent, the broadband, the whores, the fuel...

It's also hard to get get the cocaine out of the whores after they have taken it.
Bitches always steal your crack.

Thank god I didn't pay GST on my crack.

[R650R]

Whe's the last time you saw a New Zealand Made Logo? why aren't people proud to put it there, why aren't shops/supermarkets having a special stand with NZ made products, even to the point of showing a pie graph of the retail price of both nz made and imported goods and showing just how much coin goes out of NZ.

Nothings made here anymore, even the kiwi icon fisher n paykel now all getn made offshore just about...
Even the Herald is now using stock photos cause its cheaper than sending their own photographer to take pic of the local airport or spend the time dragging one out of archive.
But as soon as you've made it you have to buy some foreign exotica car or whatever to show you've made it (financially/success etc)...

[R650R]

i was told today that 'people work really hard for their money' and 'they like the economoney', but then go and buy the cheapest shit they can get at bunnings, made in china and shit, and they're all like, 'waa-waa, i can't afford to buy shit made in nz' and i'm all like 'bitch please' and punch them in the mouf.
get real you fucking sheep.

Someone hijacked your login... lol

[R650R]

[QUOTE=FJRider;1130754299] [QUOTE]

No conspiracy, merely pondering what could be a likely future course of events...

You haven't bought anything overseas recently GST IS ADDED at border by NZ CUSTOMS on just about any import over the preset level unless you have resorted to some sort of fraud or trickey...

Thanks for the Einstein level explanation about buying in bulk, guess no ones ever been so bright as you to work it out for themselves aye???? You've earned a chocolate fish with that one boy...

99.99% of my income is spent on goods with GST charged on them. The ONLY things exempt in NZ is bank fees and postage stamps but not courier tickets...
So we could all pay 15% extra income tax, drop GST and it would be exactly the same. The country would be a lot better off as they could cull a few jobs at IRD by dropping gST...

[R650R]

I think Robert may have had an irony implosion when he read that, might be why he hasn't joined in yet.

Well you cant buy everything overseas Its not my idea or wish just a guess at where this might be headed.
My point is that every single bit of tax stifles growth and lowers the amount of money consumers have to spend, most of nwhich is spent locally ;p

[Ocean1]

It's also not fair the way the wholesalers/importers give larger places better buy in prices either. It really makes it hard for smaller outfits to compete and survive.

A couple of years ago BOC were charging me $400 for a bottle of Argon. The same bottle they were selling to a large competitor for $56.

I don't do business that way, and I don't expect my suppliers to. I suspect a lot of other clients have walked too, because the latest in a long line of BOC reps to have walked into my shop offered me a 50% discount.

Too late. There's too many other options now, and I'll gladly pay someone else's higher price to avoid dealing with them. What goes around...

I had the discounts discussion with my Electrical Wholesaler when I was a self employed sparkie/heat pump installer.
" Why can I get cable cheaper at Bunnings?"
" Ummmm.....er...."
Eventually I was able to source most of my materials cheaper elsewhere.
Clearly still good margins in plumbing and electrical supplies.

I work with a couple of medium sized electrical outfits, on domestic stuff they make most of their revenue from margins on parts, they're getting 60% on most of it, more on cable. Industrial work they have to charge a higher hourly rate because those clients can command parts prices at least that good.